Time to re rip and import

quote:

Originally posted by Slabwax:


I use I tunes on a macbook.

If you are going to do this on a Mac, you MUST get XLD.

It is the ONLY ripping software for Mac that creates logs, cues, m3us, no Cache, no c2, Secure Mode ripping, with gap detection etc...

THE ONLY.

XAct was OK. XLD is the way to go. If I was going to rip anything on my Mac if would be with XLD without a doubt.

This is almost EACs equal, and will rip as well as the HDX.

DO NOT USE ITUNES. it is ok for a rip or two. But if you are going to do your entire collection (over the next year) USE XLD!!!!!!!!

PC

That is a new one for me - never heard of it before. I googled it and found the site - however I also found a blogger review which compared it to MAX. Both seem to have their strengths.

Thanks for the tip.

Gregg

Gregg,

It was new for me until my Mac buddy showed me it.

It is a studly ripping program (FINALLY!!) for Mac.

It is seriously as good as EAC and the HDX engine.

I would use MAX for converting if I had to, but XLD is the real deal for ripping.

Get it, set it, and rip away!

Another flavor of the day....the new messiah....

Tomorrow is a new dawn.

XLD ? Hmm - i'll give that a try. I tried EAC in the past and couldn't hear any differences between that and an iTunes rip so stayed with iTunes.

James

Hi Slabwax. I am just checking out XLD now.

A couple of issues come up immediatly, but I have not fully checked the software yet, so I may be mistaken.

Basically there does not appear to be any automation, you have to put a cd in, then tell the programmeto look for a cd, then get it to scan then get it to decode, then get it to get track names.

I am trying to import just one album for now, the utterly boring Damien Rice, to check sound differences if any.

However if I had 1500 cds to import, I would set itunes to lossless, and set it to automatically import cds then eject when done. This programme is going to make it at least 4 times longer to do.

PCSotocktopn seems a genuine nice chap ready to offer advice when required, however I think it fair to say in audiophile terms he is the guy that checks VTA between records and adjusts the tracking on the cartridge everytime the weather changes.

quote:

Originally posted by james n:
XLD ? Hmm - i'll give that a try. I tried EAC in the past and couldn't hear any differences between that and an iTunes rip so stayed with iTunes.

James

You won't. You either become a ripping neurotic or you get on with life and enjoy the results.

Oops some sanity from garyi beat me to it.

Hope your box arrives.

Steve

Hate to add to the neurosis, but ripping can make a big difference.

I hope someone would have an easy answer ( like an HDX ), so I won't rip the entire library wrong again.

What I have done is okey. But could have been better.

I am sure this is a PC vs Mac, thing and I am not saying mac is better.

But I have never, and I repeat never heard a click pop, blip or otherwise from the 800 or cds I have imported, not one ever. Including my very first CD Brothers In Arms, an original.

Perhaps this is why the neurosis from certain quarters?

quote:

Originally posted by garyi:

But I have never, and I repeat never heard a click pop, blip or otherwise from cds I have imported, not one ever.

Perhaps this is why the neurosis from certain quarters?

Nor have I. More importantly, the music I have ripped sounds superb whether listening to FLAC conversions, WAV or Apple Lossless - couldn't pick a difference when ripping the same CD.

YMMV of course.

Steve

quote:

Originally posted by kuma:
Hate to add to the neurosis, but ripping can make a big difference.

I hope someone would have an easy answer ( like an HDX ), so I won't rip the entire library wrong again.

But how can you make the statement that the HDX is the easy answer - and will do a better job than other ripping programs?

I still have a BIG BIG problem with Naim (and their customers) stating that their, and only their, ripping solution is better than EAC, MAX, XLD, RipFactory (Linns choice) etc etc etc. Naim are new to ripping and have only started work on their proprietary solution since the advent of the NaimNet project. The myriad of other ripping solutions have been around for considerably longer, some of them have more resources available for development, are in continual development - and other new solutions arise on a continual basis.

There seem to be many different flavors around for ripping programs - all with varying degrees of user friendliness. Ones easy answer with the HDX can be the same as others easy answer with iTunes can be the same with others easy answer with MAX etc etc.. I think the bottom line is, in benefit for end users, that there are numerous ways available to achieve Rips, each with various degrees of ease of use, but with the end result being many ways to "skin the cat".

Regards
Gregg

quote:

Originally posted by garyi:
I have never, and I repeat never heard a click pop, blip or otherwise from the 800 or cds I have imported, not one ever. Including my very first CD Brothers In Arms, an original.

I've got one dud out of 300, but even then it's one track among the 20 on the disk. I had been using Max, but can't hear anything wrong with those that had been done via iTunes.

Peter

I'm with Steve and the other users of Itunes. When I uses a pc (not long ago) I tried EAC and found it good but cumbersome and could not detect a difference from using Win Media player ripping in lossless with error correction.

Since then I've moved to a mac and tried various progs but now just use Itunes as its easy, quick and I've had no problems. I've got 800 ish cd's and to rip them with EAC or similar would have been soul destroying.

Ryan

Why ask for advice and then not take what is given?

Eventually you will get the answer you want. The HDX's ripping engine, and most others, are based on or at least nearly identical to EAC.

EAC is the Holy Grail.

If Itunes is FASTER and thats what you want. Then go for it.

As most know it takes a little more effort to make things as perfect as possible.

I, for one, cannot listen to compressed (MP3) music. Others can.

If you dont want to take the time and effort to do your rips as correctly as possible, I am not sure what you expect to get out of it.

A log file is a MUST!!! It shows you exactly where "suspicious positions", and more importantly errors, occur in a track. You can then go listen to that spot and determine it you care or not. Itunes will never tellyou if you had any errors, or where they are.

Just because you are using error correction does NOT mean you dont have any. Nor does it mean the ones that are there are actually real.

Sorry I dont give you guys the answers you are looking for. But i do know what I am talking about.



Garyi, what is VTA? Cartridge?

quote:

Originally posted by garyi:
I have never, and I repeat never heard a click pop, blip or otherwise from the 800 or cds I have imported, not one ever. Including my very first CD Brothers In Arms, an original.

Right. Sure. An I bet you've never heard the same from your CDP, yet they certainly occur.

Why would you spend anymore than the minimum on a CDP. Why even consider a CDX2??? Because they are BETTER. Better at correcting errors, better at extracting the data, better laser, whatever.....

Rips are the same way.

Ignore it if you want. But Itunes DOES NOT have all the tools needed for the best rip possible.

Sorry.

Apart from it producing error reports, can you hear a difference between and iTunes rip and the others you mention ?

James

Kuma, (or anyone who has observed sound quality issues with ripping)

I am curious to hear more about your experiences with ripping. What did you use, and how was the sound compromised?

PC,

In your log files, how many errors have you seen on any given track? How would an un-corrected arror sound on replay? Is it a few milliseconds long? Or does the correction apply to a longer sample segment?

Charlie

The worst thing you can give an audiophile is some figures to look at.

quote:

Originally posted by Steve S1:
The worst thing you can give an audiophile is some figures to look at.

Why are the 555 and CDS3 more expensive than than a 5x???????

Could it be the specs?

Or just the style of the box?

quote:

Right. Sure. An I bet you've never heard the same from your CDP, yet they certainly occur.

Haha, you are funny PCS, if they do occur on a CD player and they don't bother me, why would I spend up to 6 times longer importing a CD to ensure they don't happen?

You are a good man PC, the holy grail. haha.

quote:

Originally posted by CharlieP:
Kuma, (or anyone who has observed sound quality issues with ripping)

I am curious to hear more about your experiences with ripping. What did you use, and how was the sound compromised?

PC,

In your log files, how many errors have you seen on any given track? How would an un-corrected arror sound on replay? Is it a few milliseconds long? Or does the correction apply to a longer sample segment?

Charlie

Assuming there are NO ERRORS, ALL RIPS WILL SOUND THE SAME!!!!!!!!!!!! No one should disagree with that.

The important point people are missing is that without a log file (for one), you will NEVER know where errors are, or if you have any in the first place.

Charlie,

Errors can sound like a skip, or a pop, a basically a "digitized" or "pixilated" sound.

They certainly dont happen very often in the least. But if they do, i want to know where and how often. It is possible they are uncorrectable.

ANY proper ripping software should produce the following:

- A Log
- A Cuefile (to ensure 100% bit perfection if burned... for use in the car perhaps)
- Gap detection (some albums, and it is not rare, have pre-gap tracks at the beginning of an album)
- Pre-Emphasis flagging
- Secure Mode with NO CACHEing
- Drive Off set correction ( YOU WILL NEVER GET A BIT PERFECT RIP WITHOUT IT. never...)

Drive offset, gap detection and secure mode without caching are the most important aspects. Can Itunes so this?


Whether you like it or not, the HDX is a very, very sound ripping engine. If you dont want my word for it, go read the white page for the HDX.

Anything you use for ripping should do everything the HDX does and possibly more. EAC, XLD, Xact (good, but not great, for MAC!!!), dbPoweramp all excel in this fashion?

If you think they are wrong, or it doesn't matter. Simply use Itunes or Winamp and keep your head firmly buried in the sand.

Good rips take time. But you only need to do it once. And if you do, you can ALWAYS create a 100% PERFECT copy for use in your CDP or car.

quote:

Originally posted by pcstockton:
Simply use Itunes or Winamp and keep your head firmly buried in the sand.

Now that would bugger up the sound.

Chill, Patrick - you are being teased. Just accept that much as I admire your dedication to chasing down the last "bit" - I can't hear anything wrong with any of my iTunes rips - so it's good enough for me.

I know somebody with a great Hi Fi who can't tell the difference between a lossless and MP3 320 rip of the same track. Imagine that?

Regards,

Steve

quote:

Originally posted by garyi:
why would I spend up to 6 times longer importing a CD to ensure they don't happen?

Why not??? What is your hurry? It took a better part of 2 years to properly rip my library and do my vinyl transfers to 24/96. The latter was really tough considering I dont own a TT.

You do it as you listen. It gives you a chance to listen to everything all over again.

Take your time and do it right.

Maybe a "Proper" rip should be seen as a FREE upgrade. Would that make everyone feel better?

You would hear a difference in a rip from Itunes EVERY SINGLE TIME, if the CD had pre-emphasis. Or if there was a pre-track gap with info.

you would hear the difference every time. I would bet my life on it. Because you would hear NOTHING in the latter case, and unlistenable music in the former.

How is that for sonic differences? I am sure every single, not deaf, person on this forum would hear the difference between nothing and something.

I would say about 10% on my CDs have some kind of pre gap track. You will NEVER see them in a Itunes rip. But you will surely wonder where the beginning of the song went.

PC,

Thanks for the info. I have been using dBpoweramp ( -> flac or wav) on PC for many months. Before that I used iTunes to apple lossless, and EAC to wav. I only listened to a few examples, but to be honest I have not heard any difference between wav, flac and apple-lossless. I have not noticed any pops.

Of greater concern, as PC points out, is the file format. For me I am leaning towards going back to iTunes, because I like 1) the interface; 2) using an iPod Touch; and 3) I like what Apple does to output 16/44 data in 24 bits. Plus I do not care for MS Windoze - but that is a personal problem... Still, the flac support (or lack of it) could cause trouble down the road.

If I end up using a Mac, will definitely look into XLD.


Regards,

Charlie