Joy Division: Closer

The whole bloody lot.

Peter

Get them all.
Closer and Unknown Pleasures are the first two albums with original band.
After the death of Ian Curtis the band went through several changes to get in New Order and several other little streams.
Look here: http://members.aol.com/lwtua/joydiv.htm

Together with Closer, Unknown Pleasures is all you need. The rest (including Still - although nice sleeve on the vinyl, bought it when it came out on 17th October 1981, one day after my 24th birthday) is more -or should I say less- of the same.

Unknown Pleasures is so good it is almost unlistenable.

Willem

Sorry, I forgot Atmosphere. It is a must have.

If some like cd both albums are now out on remastered version.
I've found them in HMV internet store.

quote:

The rest (including Still - although nice sleeve on the vinyl, bought it when it came out on 17th October 1981, one day after my 24th birthday) is more -or should I say less- of the same.

willem

Still has Joy Division recorded live at Birmingham University (I think) and is, OK the same songs as on closer and unknown pleasures, but to me it is also worth having for those exciting and emotional live moments that are quite something

I will certainly get a copy of Unknown Pleasures but not sure about Still. Didn;t they also release an album called "Substance" (not to be confused with the 1987 New Order release of the same name) which contains many of the tracks from Still but also Atmosphere et al.

b

Substance was essentially the singles and B-sides. It is well worth getting for Atmosphere alone (though it is stunning on 12"). Also alternative version of She's Lost Control and Ian Curtis' epitaph Love Will Tear Us Apart.

'Still' is a bit patchy but the live tracks do give some of the feel of Joy Division live.

I see there is another compilation album called Permanent and that there is some cross over with Substance. Difficult to know which one to plump for.

b

"Still" is worth it if you can get it cheap on vinyl - I got a fair copy from MVE Notting Hill for £2 - the records and sleeves weigh a TONNE!

I got "Closer" for 80p in a charity shop - TOTALLY mint! Couldn't believe it...

If you can get the US 12inch press of "Atmosphere" it's one of the most amazing records ever - the drums almost blow out your windows - it's VERY dynamic.

Does anyone know if there's a 12inch of "Transmission" available???

Isn't it curious that Joy Division were so great, but New Order such drivel.
I wonder if they went on to become a new band, they would call themselves The Final Solution?

quote:

Isn't it curious that Joy Division were so great, but New Order such drivel.

A little harsh I think. New Order never reached the heights that Joy Division did but they weren't THAT bad. OK "Republic" was pretty crap but most of the rest was pretty good. Blue Monday remains a classic.

Not the first time it has happened though...

Beatles --> Paul McCartney & Wings

(I'm not a great Beatles fan and they did produce some crap too, mostly from the pen of Macca - funny that)

I think New Order 'True Faith' is pretty good, and I loved the video!

As seagull said

I have only one new order album. Movement and a twelve inch Blue Monday single. Some of Movement is not that bad.

Funnily, I only go back to listening to Still now and again (the live sides especially New Dawn Fades and Twenty Four Hours,.... amazing)

Along with The Beatles and Led Zeppelin, Joy Division were the greatest group these islands have ever produced.

Right now, they are probably the world's most important group - their influence is absolutely everywhere.

I was around when JD were (78-80) and their music seemed like the most important thing in the world back then. Listening to it now, it still does! Joy Division were the last great group, around in an era before popular culture sagged into middle age; in an era before videos, MTV and demographic marketing. The journey they began over a quarter of a century ago, and which they never completed, has never been completed by anyone else, and I doubt if anyone around now has the will to create art as great as theirs.

You really need to complement Closer with Unknown Pleasures as they are both part of the same journey, and together they are, I think, the single most powerful statement pop has ever made.

But Substance is also essential, as it collects together that trio of unsurpassable singles they recorded for Factory: Transmission, Love Will Tear Us Apart and Atmosphere.

Still is worth having more for the studio outtakes than the live album; there are some officially-sanctioned live LPs – Preston Warehouse, Les Baines Douches (this is when members of the group pissed over members of Spandau Ballet from the balcony!) etc and many bootlegs, which are also worth having. The 4-CD box set Heart And Soul has a great deal of unreleased material on it and is well worth picking up.

I always used to wonder at the speed of The Beatles' progress – less than 5 years between Love Me Do and I Am The Walrus. But Joy Division's progress in their three-year career was even more astonishing: 18 months seperate the dense, flailing rage of their debut An Ideal For Living EP and the majestic Unknown Pleasures.

As for New Order, well, you can't really separate them from JD really; again, it's part of the same journey. Their work since 2001 has been dire, but in the 1980s and early 1990s they were the best band in Britain, if not the world: Technique from 1989 is a masterpiece, and Blue Monday is the record upon which the whole of the 1980s and much of the '90s turns.


Kevin

quote:

Originally posted by Kevin-W:
Along with The Beatles and Led Zeppelin, Joy Division were the greatest group these islands have ever produced.

It's a bit reductive..............

I have Vols. 1&2 of Joy Division, John Peel Sessions, 45rpm on BBC Records issued in '86 and '87.

Don't ask, you can't have them. They're my...precious (use silly Gollum voice).

I recommend Deborah Curtis' book Touching from a Distance - Ian Curtis and Joy Division , an excellent insight into the man and band.

Andy

quote:

Originally posted by Gianluigi Mazzorana:

quote:

Originally posted by Kevin-W:
Along with The Beatles and Led Zeppelin, Joy Division were the greatest group these islands have ever produced.

It's a bit reductive..............

And your point is...?

quote:

And your point is...?

See........as italian a lot of music coming from England meant a lot in my life.
I would remember Bauhaus, Sylvian and Japan, Bowie, Massive attack and all the Bristol/Bath area (Tears for Fears).
There is quite so much to remember and to listen to.
Personally i've such a nostalgia of late 70s and early 80s when music was such a continuos falling in love!
Talkin about Sex Pistols, that still scream in my cd player.................and so much i can't make a list............
This is my point.

I must also recommend "Heart and Soul", the booklet is very good.

If you can find Peel Sessions 12" it is good, but is on H & S.

Just listen to Kasabian, Franz F, Zutons, etc to hear the legacy.

Jono

There was a 12" of Transmission -- I have a copy .

For those of you that weren't aware, a film is in the works, based upon Deborah Curtis' book, Touching From A Distance.

The film 24 Hour Party People also features Joy Division, and is very cool if you are into Factory/Manchester music.

The 'last' Joy Division song, In A Lonely Place, is available in demo/live form on Heart And Soul (I think), but was one of the first songs New Order recorded, is available on New Order's Substance, and is actually very good.

In my opinion Joy Division produced two of the greatest albums ever in Unknown Pleasures and Closer. They are both very intense, but unsurpassed in the 25 years since. The singles Love Will Tear Us Apart, Atmosphere and Transmission are all essential; Transmission probably being my all time favourite track. One other track to hit these heigts is Digital, which is available on the comilation Substance.

The rest of the material is not bad, but not quite in the league of those.

For me New Order have done some good tunes, but the lyrics really let them down, sounding like nursery rhymes at times. Low Life and Power, corruption & Lies are worth having as is the first single Ceremony, which was written by Joy Division and has Ian Curtis lyrics.

Another think worth looking at is the film 24 Hour Party People. The actor who plays Ian Curtis is a real dead ringer.

It's probably best to buy what JD released on vinyl, or failing that, on CD, and what you can't buy, you can dowload P2P. Some of their stuff is worthy.

Dear All,

Many thanks for all your comments. I will be seeking out many of your recommendations.

Bruce

p.s. I see New Order have a new release coming out soon.

quote:

Originally posted by IanGrant:
There was a 12" of Transmission -- I have a copy .

FANTASIC!!! I have it on 7inch, and "Substance" and 24HPP, and will have to seek it down. If it sounds even HALF as good as my copy of "Atmosphere" it'll probably make my neighours move out!

I also like it as I can play the bassline to it - even though I'm TOTALLY out of practice at being able to play anything else - years of stagnation, and even though I got a new bass in November, I've not got into piddling about on it much....

Apologies for my ignorance here - but is Deborah Curtis Ian's mum, or his wife? (wasn't her walking out on him just before he went to the States one of the reasons he hung himself - or have I misread the 24HPP movie? I really should get that book - I've a fiver book token somewhere I could use towards it...

Finally - "Low life" by New Order's not a bad album either, but no-one can diss "Blue Monday" - the best 12inch ever (probably next to "Transmission", that is, now I know it exists!!!)