Need some honest opinion on SBL

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Originally posted by silklee:
A used SBL seems to be on the way for me.

If i get the SBL, my full system will be as follows.

CD5/202/200 on my pARTicular. LP12 (FR14 arm plus shure M95 cartridge) on my M**a reference table.

Questions that spring to my mind.

Will it become mulletish?

Will my relatively weak sources be ruthlessly revealed?

Will the new Naim (202/200) go well with the SBL?

Is the 200 enough to drive the SBL in a 4m by 3m room?

My present ES14 booms in my room, will the SBL have the same problem?

I dont think i can arrange a home trial though i will be able to listen to it at my dealer's hopefully on the cd5/202/200.

Please advise.

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Your system is fine. SBL speakers go to a minimum of 6 ohm so they are NOT difficult to drive. They need a solid wall behind to have good bass. You may want to set them up by firing them across the 3 m length direction so that you dont need to crank up the volume to much. A NAP250 would be ideal but the NAP200 will still do fine (I wont go any lower than that).

I ran my SBL's for many years using a 140 - your 200 should be more than capable of driving them saisfactorily.

Good move!

Computers are supposed to work on 1's and 0's - in other words "Yes" or "No" - why does mine frequently say "Maybe"?......

I ran SBLs with a Nait 5/CD5 for six months with no problems. Sometimes it made me wonder why I had a big DBL system. It was fun to listen to and demostrated how good the new 5 series was.

The wall you place SBLs is very important but your listening position needs to be near the back wall. If you sit in the middle of a big room, there wont be much bass. Even my big DBLs suffer from this fate.

Chris Bell

Chris I think this wholy depends on the size of the room.

There is more than enough bass in my room.

What I will say is make sure there is a bit of room between you and the speaker.

Its a superb speaker and what makes it superb is that it just gets better and better the more you put up front of it.

I don't know what stage the SBL becomes the weak link.

However its fair to point out that the SBL is not going to deliver gut renching bass, although in my room ithits you in the chest if yo wind it up.

Once you have them make sure they are installed carefully. Naim may be out of sbls but I bet they have SBL kits, if you find the seals are knackered.

Slightly Barmy Loudspeakers

They'll be just fine with what you have. I use a modest spec'd Linn into my 202/Hicap/250/SBL's

They are not a difficult load, and will have much better bass control than your current speakers.

Boundary placement is recommended, but rooms are a lottery. I get the best sound in my room, by using them against an acoustically damped, plasterboard wall, either side of an open arch.

The bass is just fine, but if I sit right on the back wall, the bass is excessive and gets a bit thick.

You must be prepared to spend some time and effort, trying every possible speaker/listening position.

Good luck.

Thanks for all the reply.

Considering the amount of money I spent and am going to spend for the SBL with my dealer, I think I will insist on a home trial.

Nothing like a home trial....

Hi Silklee,

I agree with everything said so far, but ..

When I had ES14's I was desperate to move to SBL's because they sounded so good at my dealers house. Problem was that he had much better electronics than me so the first home demo was a disappointment. The SBL's sounded dry and recessed compared to the forward bouncy presentation of the Epos.

I reckon that SBL's are a much better loudspeaker than ES14's but that there is a point in terms of amplification where the Epos are singing their hearts out and the SBL's are still clearing their throats. After the second home demo, a few years later and with a beefed up amp section, the Epos were history.

It will be interesting to see how the demo goes.

I keep shifting my goal post.

Up till last Saturday, I was happily saving up for my Aro....

It was Aro and Cirkus then probably CDX2 then Hicap then change of speakers.

Untill my other half asked me..."why dont you change your speakers?"...

So i thought, what better than SBL. I quickly emailed Naim and was told that all the new SBLs are gone.

I called my dealer and he say he got a used SBL (1995/1996) for sale.

I am convinced of source first but SBL seems to be one of THE speakers to get. However it seems fidgetty and that setup is crucial... (a bit like LP12?).

Maybe Allae is a better choice. Newer, easier to setup, sound good also....

I am confused.

I need a home trial.....

Silkee, set up is not difficult, assuming you are not a serial tweaker, you set them where you want them, put some silocone on and sit back and relax.

SBLs are great. For a 96 model check they are bang up to date, if not knock him down on the price.

Just calm down and start thinking logically.

There are two ways to build a good system.

1. Source first. Buy at the front end and work your way down to the speakers.

2. Buy bargins, second hand or special offers, as they come up. This is the cheapest way of building a system but it can be unbalanced whilst you are doing it but you get there in the end.

From what I have seen of your postings, you already have a fairly good system and it will easily accomodate the SBL's.

Buy only post 1998 models where the veneer is also on the back panels because the newer cabinet did improve the sound.

I suggest you buy the SBL's and then stop worrying and enjoy the music. Your hardware plus the SBL's will give a great sound. Any further improvements should be done at the front end and there is plenty of time for that.

Regards

Mick

garyi,

The deal will go through my local naim dealer. He told me that the SBLs after 1995 are all up to date. I have been trying to search for the history of SBL but to no avail.

A real pity I just missed the last batch of SBLs from Naim.

Can you advise?

Hi Mick,
My dealer could only tell me that particular SBL was first sold in 1996. I havent gotten hold of the serial number yet.

Which means it wont be post 1998. He did mention it is with the new drivers and that the crossover is a little improved from the older ones.

I cant remember what he said about the cabinet. Sort of an information overload for me since i know nothing about SBL.

I think i will need to spend time reading about it, but i would rather use that time to listen to it.

Going though JV's posting, he did mention that the SBL will sound worse everytime it is being moved around. That is a big worry.

The speakers will probably be at least 7 years old, so probably it had been moved around a fair bit.

I also have a friend who went from a 250 to 135 as he felt the 250 was not able to handle the SBL. I wont be able to upgrade from my 200 for at least a few years so it HAS to work.

I think i will get all my answers from a home trial.

Silkee by that he meant that the seal of silicon can become damaged. In other words if yo move it around, re-seal it and the SBL will be just fine. Really its no big deal.

The newer SBl that Micks refers to has all over veneer. Check the ones you are looking at, between the bottom and middle box you will either have black paint of veneer. If its the latter you have the up to date ones.

Judging by the age you won't have the up to date ones, and now it comes down to what you wouold prefer to do. You can still get the latest ones for nearly half the price of Alleas, so its up to you.

All SBLs are good though!

I think you need to talk to someone.

You can email me for my tel on

michael.parry2@ntlworld.com

SBL's are dead easy to set up etc but you seem in need of information.

Regards

Mick

Interesting thread.
My sytem is: CD3.5(Hi-cap)-102 (NAPSC & Flat-Cap) - 180 - SBL. I have the SBL's on Mana, as is the rest of the electronics. I originally bought mine as an ex-demo pair, and first used them on a suspended wooden floor in my previous house. The result was not good, but I kept altering their position until it became acceptable. I thought i was not using a good enough Naim amp, but then when I moved house to one with a concrete floor the change was massive - far tighter bass & faster clearer sound. I agree with others above that regardless of price speakers need to be listened to at home. If your dealer is not happy with this then look elsewhere - the dealer could be missing out in the future re and upgrades elsewhere in the chain you will be making...! The other option is to agree a long trial period...

Silklee

I wouldn't worry about too much the age or performance of SBL's.

Even Mk1 SBL's from the late eighties, are good enough to outperform both EPOS Es14's and Allaes.

My SBL's started off on the end of a CD2/72/140 and now are powered by CDS1/52/supercap/250.

They are superb speakers and buying them will definitely be one of the best upgrades you will ever make.

Mick,
I am based in Singapore. An overseas call would be rather expensive.

To all,
My dealer will set it up for me though he havent replied me whether I can arrange a home trial.

I will call him tomorrow and have a chat with him. Wish me luck.

Silklee

SBL's can be moved around with care. I've shifted mine a few times without disturbing the seal.

Grasp them by the bottom box/frame; lift (bent knees/straight back!) and make sure that your shoulder etc: doesn't touch and move the middle box.

Set them down carefully and VERY GENTLY rock them, to settle the spikes, adjusting as necessary.

It is of course best to re-seal them, when you are happy with their final resting place. If the seal is knackered; when you push the cone in, it will pop straight out. If the cone returns to normal in a slow damped manner, the seal is intact.

Good luck.

james my man, you're passing through again?

vik

HI guys,
I worked out something with my dealer.

Fingers crossed....

2 days and counting....

I think the SBLs will suit you. The CD5 is a little light, but that's not really a problem since it is a fine player with no nasties in its presentation. Things only become 'ruthless' when there's a problem presentation and that's not the case here. It remains a reasonably well balanced system.

The next move would be an NAPSC and then either a HICAP for the CD5 or a CDX2. If you went HICAP, you could then subsequently go CDX2 and put the HICAP between 202 and 200. so that's a good path.

The SBLs must go near a wall. They are unlikely to boom since they don't do that. If you do have a boom problem you simply need to pull them away from the wall by an inch or two until the bass settles down. You will get a very different presentation to the ES14s you're used to and, for a while at least, you may still remember the ES14s fondly, but that's only really likely to happen if the SBLs are not setup correctly.

It's a nice system - enjoy it!

Regards,
Frank.
All opinions are my own and do not reflect the opinion of any organisations I work for, except where this is stated explicitly.

Hi Frank,
I already got the NAPSC. I didnt thought it was worth mentioning.

Will post the home trial results here.

After 2 hours of listening to the SBL....

The snappiness, punch and speed of the SBL is so much better than the ES14. Maybe the ES14 isnt optimised in my boomy room. Most evident on Groove Armada's Love Box.

The physical condition of the SBL is good.

But there is one problem. The kick from it is so good that i just want more of it. So when i crank up to volumes that i never use to do, it starts to sound bright.

back to more listening...

Hi Guys,
The SBL works great in my room and my system.

I am at a loss of words as to how to describe it. Its just music.

Great to hear you are liking the SBL's so far.

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The SBL works great in my room and my system.

I am at a loss of words as to how to describe it. Its just music.

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This is the crux of it, if they do work well in your room then they are some of the best speakers available at any price.