Am I Patriotic? British v English
Posted by: Whizzkid on 03 July 2009
Hi Guys,
I've watched Wimbledon all my life and have been to watch on the Centre Court 4 times so I have a great love of the tournament & Tennis in general. I also played allot at secondary school on our courts.
The problem I have is that even though I've enjoyed watching Andy Murray play ever since I first saw him a few years ago and think he is a talented player and will win a major, if not more than one I don't get excited if he wins or loses. If this was Tim Henman I'd be on the edge of my seat, which I have been over the last decade. The same goes for the other national teams in the European Championships or World Cup, I therefore conclude that I'm an Englishman with an attitude akin to the other countries in the British Union and love the fact that we thump them at footie all the time
. I also have a similar problem with Football teams in the Champions League or Ueafa Cup, I'm a Arsenal fan and I am a wreck watching them play, the Champions League final a few years ago I was 3 pints in before they even kicked off to calm the nerves, my heart pounds and I get fidgety but I couldn't care less if Man Utd, Chelsea or Liverpool get to final.
So am I a weird selfish English stiff upper lip you other lot are lowlifes kind off patriot? I find it strange that others can switch there allegiances so easily when we whack a Union Flag on a sportsman or there is an English club in European final. Is this just me or do others feel the same?
I am English and Arsenal 'till I die.
Dean...
Posted on: 03 July 2009 by u5227470736789439
Being half Norwegian, I am definately British not English in allegance, even if English born.
I am not Nationalistic at all with sport!
I have very strong views on this, and even deplore the playing of National Anthems at the Olympics for example.
ATB from George
Posted on: 03 July 2009 by saxondale
quote:
Originally posted by Whizzkid:
I am English and Arsenal 'till I die.
Dean...
which is fair enough ...
you must wish Arsenal had some English players you could cheer on though , surely - ?
Posted on: 03 July 2009 by Guido Fawkes
I was surprised when Arsenal moved to the Emirates, my expectation was they would move home to Woolwich.
I always think of Andy Murray as British as he won his way through the first 5 rounds at Wimbledon; however, I was disappointed to see the young Scott lose today. I think he is a wonderful player.
I'll always support England at Cricket, Football, Rugby, Croquet and all the major team sports, but when it is individual sport I always support the British player.
I'll support Ipswich Town till the end of days, which is strange because they have never supported me.
Posted on: 03 July 2009 by Chillkram
I am British first and foremost and will always support a British team or player wherever there is one. Next I will support England or any English teams against other countries' teams. After that I will support any other British nation's teams/players against those from outside the UK.
I'd even support Arsenal in Europe unless playing another English team!
Posted on: 03 July 2009 by Guido Fawkes
quote:
I'd even support Arsenal in Europe unless playing another English team!
Another? Are Arsenal an English team then? I think teams should have at least 6 players on the field from the country whose league they play in.
BTW What's Delaney like?
ATB Rotf
Posted on: 03 July 2009 by Chillkram
quote:
Originally posted by ROTF:
quote:
I'd even support Arsenal in Europe unless playing another English team!
Another? Are Arsenal an English team then? I think teams should have at least 6 players on the field from the country whose league they play in.
ok, you got me, I was exaggerating on that one!
quote:
BTW What's Delaney like?
Likes a yellow card, but not a bad player. He fell out of favour with Sousa at the end of the season. Good going forward.
Posted on: 03 July 2009 by winkyincanada
quote:
Originally posted by GFFJ:
Being half Norwegian, I am definately British not English in allegance, even if English born.
I am not Nationalistic at all with sport!
I have very strong views on this, and even deplore the playing of National Anthems at the Olympics for example.
ATB from George
Tribalism in all its forms, including patriotism or nationalism is abhorrent. I'm NOT better than you because of where I was born, nor because of what football team I choose to support, nor because of my chosen (or indoctrinated) irrational beliefs; nor because of any of an inifnite number of excuses that people use to group themsleves into arbitrary, self-interested tribes.
I'm with you on this George. Nationalism at sporting events is jingoism at best and breeds arrogance and contempt at worst. The sight of athletes draping themselves in their country's flags appalls me.
Posted on: 03 July 2009 by u5227470736789439
Dear Winky,
I have come in home in a state that would allow for tribalism.
No! I cannot do that, though I could recognise the reasons for WW2.
As as a Norse/Anglo [born n 1961] I can still be a Polacoophile, but this does not involve murder.
My late Norwegian grandfather thought the Poles were the bravest anti-Nazis in the Second World War. Which is quite good from someone very high in the Norwegian Resistance.
He was a character, and a not an easy person, but he inspired love and respect among those who knew him ...
ATB from George
Posted on: 04 July 2009 by Absolute
quote:
Originally posted by ROTF:
I'll always support England at Cricket, Football, Rugby, Croquet and all the major team sports, but when it is individual sport I always support the British player.
This is interesting. For me, i always support England in team sports, Rugby, Cricket, Football etc. But when it comes to individual sports, such as tennis, i often support the players i enjoy watching the most. I want them to win because it means i get to see them play more.
Going back to the British/English thing, I had a friend who had 'British by birth, English by grace of god' tattooed on his back. Im not that fussed about it. Yes, i am very proud to be English, but im also proud to be British.
Posted on: 04 July 2009 by 555
I support two teams. Scotland, & whoever is playing against England.
Posted on: 04 July 2009 by User34
Living in France cured me of caring about football, anymore. I don't care who wins as long as it's not manchester united, it's the vestige of when I cared.
What surprises is the way people say "We" when a team wins. What do they mean "we", they're not playing.
OTOH, in myfantasy golf team for the race to dubai, there's at least 5 english players, so I'm not immune either.
Posted on: 04 July 2009 by AS332
Everyone is equal .
Apart from those born and raised outside of Yorkshire . They are just doomed for all eternity .
Posted on: 07 July 2009 by Mike-B
I iz frum oxferdshi’er, an as I live quite close to the English boarder and pop over to that country quite easily :-) I fink I can speak on behalf of the English.
Problem as I see it is that England, Scotland & Wales are all supposed to be separate countries within a federal – or is it feudal – kingdom who occasionally stow the battle axes and join up to fight jonnie foreigner, colonials and the antipodeans. The most important is with the red shirt and the oval ball but from time to time some other less important and less lethal battles.
But the problem I am concerned about is the English don't have our thier own parliament. They have to share it with the Scots and Celts even though they are allowed to have their own. But the biggest insult is the English don't even have an English PM, he is a bloody scot, as is the chief bean counter. The English are under the thumb of the old enemy.
So rise up true Englishmen and let’s take the words from 6th verse of the English anthem and like Marshal Wade, may by thy mighty aid victory bring. May he sedition hush, and like a torrent rush, rebellious Scots to crush.
Posted on: 07 July 2009 by Bruce Woodhouse
Being 'English' is just one of my identities, one of my labels. We like to have these groups and associations. I'm male, caucasian, an adopted Yorkshireman, English, British and European. I like Scottish mountains, Italian cars, the French language. but ultimately I do identify with some idea of being British/English. That great multi-cultural melange i think it represents, that historical and cultural legacy.
I don't see a problem with shouting for 'your team' as long as you appreciate your opponent. It is not saying you are better than them for a sportsman to be draped in the flag, it is more about identifying with a national heritage I think. I don't see a problem with being proud of a cultural or ethnic identity. That perhaps includes trying to contribute in some small way to the future of your community. Smaller nations in particular get enormous boosts from succesful athletes who feel truly 'owned' by thair nation. Why not celebrate that?
We are not the same; ethnicity, social and physical geography, history and heritage do inform our development. Tell me you cannot identify groups of kids wandering around London as being British/French/Italian. I bet you can get it right most of the time before they speak a word.
Thank god we are not some unified nation of Europe. Enjoy the diversity, celebrate it, and be patriotic provided you can do it constructively. Patriotism is about celebrating your nation, not denigrating another.
Bruce
Posted on: 07 July 2009 by nap-ster
quote:
Originally posted by ROTF:
I always think of Andy Murray as British as he won his way through the first 5 rounds at Wimbledon; however, I was disappointed to see the young Scott lose today. I think he is a wonderful player.
Posted on: 07 July 2009 by AS332
Posted on: 07 July 2009 by 555
Does Y.A. operate helicopters as well?
Posted on: 07 July 2009 by AS332
Aye we'll fly owt !
Posted on: 08 July 2009 by Simon Matthews
quote:
Patriotism is about celebrating your nation, not denigrating another.
Spot on. It's a sad 'PC gone mad day' when we can't celebrate national identity without feeling like we are being offensive to another country. Is every Brazilian fan at a world cup being offensive to all the other footballing nations because they sing, dance and wear their own national colours? Hardly.
Posted on: 08 July 2009 by winkyincanada
What the hell does football have to do with national identity? Celebrate the differences in culture through cultural means. You know, art, architecture, costume, dance, food, history etc. National (or team) colours at football matches is just tribalism. It's all fun until the rioting starts.
Posted on: 08 July 2009 by winkyincanada
To illustrate my point above, there is a fantastic display of cultural celebration going on in Mongolia right now. It is called the Naadaam festival and it is about Mongolians celbrating Mongolian culture. There are sporting events for sure, but they are Mongolian events that have a long and deep historical significance.
What is NOT happening is Mongolians trying to prove themselves "superior" to other nations/people by beating them at some sort of arbitrary contest.
Posted on: 08 July 2009 by nap-ster
I wonder if the Mongolians have a "Call a Canadian an American and monitor the reaction" competition as part of the proceedings?
Posted on: 08 July 2009 by winkyincanada
quote:
Originally posted by nap-ster:
I wonder if the Mongolians have a "Call a Canadian an American and monitor the reaction" competition as part of the proceedings?
I doubt it. But you never know. Call me whatever you like. I live in Canada and am therefore "from" Canada when I am overseas. I am not Canadian by birth nor citizenship; nor by way of any sort of belief that Canadians are superior to residents/citizens of other countries.
