How can the manufacturer guess?
Posted by: Arye_Gur on 27 March 2003
I read about the 202/200 (a good review for the 202/200) that this combo’s sound changes through 6 – 8 weeks until it settles – and I wonder.
I understand that it takes several days to a new system to settle down – but 6 – 8 weeks? If it takes so long, how can the manufacturer guess what will be the quality of the sound from the beginning?
Arye
I understand that it takes several days to a new system to settle down – but 6 – 8 weeks? If it takes so long, how can the manufacturer guess what will be the quality of the sound from the beginning?
Arye
Posted on: 27 March 2003 by Bob Shedlock
Experience - They don't guess. Universal knowledge that discrete components "season".
They actually listen to them after they're cooked.
They actually listen to them after they're cooked.
Posted on: 27 March 2003 by J.N.
Spot on
I installed a new 202 - NAPSC - Hicap - 250 in December, and would concur with the 6 to 8 week time frame, to reach full potential.
Naim are gonna have a new design permanently powered up for much longer than that, before it goes into production; I'd guess.
BUT; it should be good from cold - the future is 'icing on the cake'.
Something is wrong, if someone says "It was unlistenable for three weeks".
I installed a new 202 - NAPSC - Hicap - 250 in December, and would concur with the 6 to 8 week time frame, to reach full potential.
Naim are gonna have a new design permanently powered up for much longer than that, before it goes into production; I'd guess.
BUT; it should be good from cold - the future is 'icing on the cake'.
Something is wrong, if someone says "It was unlistenable for three weeks".
Posted on: 27 March 2003 by Minky
This has always puzzled me too. How do you fine-tune when some components won't be stable for a long time and may even sound worse after they are run-in ? For example, how do you design a speaker that needs 100 days before it gives of it's best ? Do you decide that the drivers are basically OK, run them in, and then do all of the tuning on the boxes (the effects of which can be tested immediately) ? How does this process work in an amplifier with hundreds of components, each of which (I assume) has an effect on the sound ?
I guess the answer is either that a piece of equipment is designed and tested using already run-in components, or that the benchmark is set on the way things sound now and part of the testing process is to make sure that it will continue to sound good (and hopefully better) over time.
I guess the answer is either that a piece of equipment is designed and tested using already run-in components, or that the benchmark is set on the way things sound now and part of the testing process is to make sure that it will continue to sound good (and hopefully better) over time.
Posted on: 27 March 2003 by Arye_Gur
I don't know now, but I remember that Naim claimed to check each component by listening before it leaves the factory.
I don't think it takes them 8 weeks to do so.
Arye
I don't think it takes them 8 weeks to do so.
Arye
Posted on: 28 March 2003 by JeremyB
It's not hard to accelerate the burn in. You elevate the temperature (and/or humidity) and you get an exponential (vs temperature) "acceleration factor". An acceleration factor of 50 is not hard to acheive, meaning that 1 day burn in is equivalent to 50 days at room temperature.
Unfortunately this is only useful for product you don't sell, since the effects of performing the elevated temp burn-in are not 100% predictable - the product is definitely stressed in a way it would not be under normal operation.
Unfortunately this is only useful for product you don't sell, since the effects of performing the elevated temp burn-in are not 100% predictable - the product is definitely stressed in a way it would not be under normal operation.
Posted on: 28 March 2003 by Arye_Gur
quote:
Originally posted by Tom Alves:
Naim presumably take a long time to design their kit... Compared to that what's eight weeks?
Tom
I agrre, and I think that Naim products are excelent, but the description of a quality of a sound that goes up and down through a period of 6 - 8 weeks seems odd to me. If someone says that the sound goes better and better throgh this period, it will be logical to me.
Arye
Posted on: 28 March 2003 by Shayman
Let's face it. Naim kit doesn't sound crap even from new. + It does get noticeably better with a short time of being powered up.
I'm sure they say things like 8 weeks to make sure people don't try and return kit after a few days because it doesn't sound as good as their dealers/friends etc.
Jonathan
I'm sure they say things like 8 weeks to make sure people don't try and return kit after a few days because it doesn't sound as good as their dealers/friends etc.
Jonathan
Posted on: 28 March 2003 by Richard Paget
When say BMW sell u a new car the engine is not run in--it's stiff and if you chose to rev it it would do so only begrudgingly.
Burn it in for 500 miles and it's better, 5000 and it's great.
So how do BMW know their engine will produce ~200hp and rev smoothly each time.
--becuase they have seen the exact same design do exactly the same thing time after time in development.
So there are happy to sell u it. Occassionally one will blow up but there is never one that only produces 150 hp--it's near 200hp or it doesn't work at all(faulty component-blows)
That's why Naim can happily charge u £1000's without the need to drop in for tea and a listen after a few months.
Regards Richard
Burn it in for 500 miles and it's better, 5000 and it's great.
So how do BMW know their engine will produce ~200hp and rev smoothly each time.
--becuase they have seen the exact same design do exactly the same thing time after time in development.
So there are happy to sell u it. Occassionally one will blow up but there is never one that only produces 150 hp--it's near 200hp or it doesn't work at all(faulty component-blows)
That's why Naim can happily charge u £1000's without the need to drop in for tea and a listen after a few months.
Regards Richard