CDS lost its bounce

A proficient dealer might be able to fettle it, but ideally it needs to go back to Salisbury.

Time for that holiday in the UK.

Here's a good place to start:

http://members.shaw.ca/mikesae/CDSowners.htm

hth,

jim

Sounds like the pins under the transport tray has come out of the cup which is connected to the leaf spring.

If you follow Dave's guide you may be able to fix it. Otherwise send it back. But it doesn't seems like a major problem to me.

regards

Dev

I would try and screw in the transport bolts in again on the underside, (pretending you were going to send it to salisbury!) then remove them again. This may possibly free up the springs again.

Cheers
Goose

"Sounds like the pins under the transport tray has come out of the cup which is connected to the leaf spring."

Dev's right.

regards,

dave

Thanks everyone for the help and courage to take the plunge, especially jcc-san for providing the link, and Dave Simpson for the excellent instructions on CDS dismantling. (And Mike Sae for the excellent site.) My CDS got itself a new timing belt and plugs.

Fully expecting to bugger things up further, I set about trying to rescue the transport late last night.

One pin was out and easily relocated. Bounce was restored.

The nuts on the main board were all given a turn and the slack taken up. (Surprising just how loose they were. Early model CDS owners take note.)

Looked at the leaf-spring bolts but didn’t have a spanner to fit. Judging by the results of the board tightening, it’s probably worth having another go tonight.

Immediately after switch on it was obvious that the music had returned, what had sounded flat and harsh was much more dynamic and much less offensively grungy. I have a feeling that things have actually improved considerably, but as it could have been the late hour and a good mains supply I will wait till tonight to verify the improvement.

Makes me wonder whether the PS PCB might need some tightening up as well.

Thanks again. I love you all. ;-)

Jon

PS For technophobes like myself who give this a go:
The harness has a retainer on it so you can’t just pull it out. Also, if you have big hands like me it’s a bit of a squash trying to get enough digits in to both lift the retainer and pull the plug out, so train your kids.

PPS As an aside, I’m thrilled to discover that CD players need maintenance too. I am already hatching plans to source replacement leaf springs from Salisbury (11 years old now you know), and I have spent the afternoon scouring every corner of the net for a laser alignment protractor, though no luck yet. May try dragging some green stuff across the lens too.

Jon

Hi Jon,

Glad the procedures helped, but thanks actually go to Dave Dever at NANA... I was just the messenger.(big thanks to Mike for posting it also)

I'm sure the results vary from system to system as well as the "cumulative effect" of some of the adjustments vs. all required, but for me it was the single biggest sonic improvement I've experiencied in this rig. I just couldn't keep it (the adjustments) quiet;)

regards,

dave

Finding the above quite irresistible, I thought I’d give my CDS a bit of a tighten up. I’ve been inside most Naim gear but, having now been inside the CDS, this very different to re-seating a few phono cards.

Most importantly, a word of warning – those following Dave’s very helpful instructions will see the following under point 4:

“Unlock the main board (lower) transport screws and place the unit back on its shelf. Unlock the (upper) transport screws, reconnect to the cdps/ preamp and enjoy”

This rather implies that both sets should be locked during the procedure. Well if they are you wont get very far. The PCB locking screws emerge through holes in the outer case bottom when locked – you cant slide the inner tray out if this is the case. Furthermore, the transport tray locks by forcing the upper left tray edge against a rubber strip on the underside of the outer case top. Thus it also needs to be unlocked in order to easily slide the tray out. All this is tricky stuff and Im not surprised Naim dont countenance opening the CDS.

However, it seems silly to send the whole thing back to Salisbury if all that is needed is a pin reseat? Any comments Naim?

Incidentally, all of my screws etc were rock solid after all that! The unit was serviced in 1997 so I suppose hadnt had time to loosen significantly?

Steve

"This rather implies that both sets should be locked during the procedure. Well if they are you wont get very far."

Correct! I'll fix that.

Furthermore, the transport tray locks by forcing the upper left tray edge against a rubber strip on the underside of the outer case top. Thus it also needs to be unlocked in order to easily slide the tray out.

I've only been inside the head unit three times or so and never had to unlock the (upper) transport screws in order to slide my inner tray assembly out but I like your suggestion. Once during removal, my transport mech did hang-up during inner chassis removal. I'll add this to the piece.

"All this is tricky stuff and Im not surprised Naim dont countenance opening the CDS."

Personally, I don't think they are thrilled with us going into the units but they know it's a real world, we'll open the pups up, so why not arm us with *something* so when shoot ourselves in the foot we don't blow the *whole* foot off;)

Mucho thanks for the corrections Steve!!! I'm going to forward revisions to Mike.

regards,

dave

"Personally, I don't think they are thrilled with us going into the units but they know it's a real world, we'll open the pups up, so why not arm us with *something* so when shoot ourselves in the foot we don't blow the *whole* foot off;)"

Dave, I couldnt agree more - this is a little redolent of the whole LP12 saga, with implications that one needed a cauldron full of dragons teeth and virgins blood in order to set the damn thing up. We all later discovered that ordinary blood would do!

Youre right about good advice - people will go ahead regardless. For example, the first time I tried to get my LP12 motor to stop clicking, a simple procedure, I ended up deforming the motor top casing. In my defence, I was 16 at the time!

Putting a pin back in the cup doesnt require a degree in rocket science and should be to everybodies benefit as long as you accept you may invalidate your guarantee. I was glad to be able to check my springs at home without having to send the machine away - my CDS was transported 200 miles without a locked transport because the seller didnt have the allen key. The CDI is so much simpler because its locked with a pair of big fat knurled knobs - no special tools required.

Steve

My CDS was transported 200 miles without a locked transport because the seller didn't have the allen key.

(Wince)...whew, Did you ever talk to Naim about the possibility the cds might need to be checked out after the rough ride?

"Dave, I couldnt agree more - this is a little redolent of the whole LP12 saga, with implications that one needed a cauldron full of dragons teeth and virgins blood in order to set the damn thing up. We all later discovered that ordinary blood would do!"

I always got a kick out of this also. 'Been setting up LP-12s for years for shops as well as maintaining my old customers since I left hi-fi sales and I still have to explain it's nothing more than detail, a lot of experience and proper training from Linn. Chicken heads and magic dust can be left at the door.

regards,

dave

P.S. Again, thanks for the corrections. Mike will try and get the revised document posted this weekend if he has time.

Dave, it was on the front seat next to me and, believe me, I was driving carefully!

When I got it home it turned out that the seller had been using it with only one of the CD transport locks undone...the other was screwed in ! Ergo the transport was half locked! So much for home set-up. The circuit board was fully unlocked but thats far less likely to get damaged.

For me, the ultimate test is sonic...I turned it on and it brought gasps of disbelief, it sounded so good. If it hadnt I would have had it in Salisbury the next day!

Steve

Guys,
Read the excellent advise but unless I got it wrong it all says not on the CDI. What if anything will benefit from a quick adjustment on a CDI?

Cheers

Simon

Steve,

Glad your cds is ok but I'm still wincing. The half-locked transport screw story is a sad fact of life. I've seen that all too frequently (though not one locked and one loose-usually both partially undone).

Simon,

I wish I could give you more information for your player but the conversation that produced this document was centered on my cds. It might be worthwhile to contact your shop technician and/or Naim and see if there's more spring cleaning to be done inside of your aging player. (Maybe someone from Naim or NANA will comment here also.)

I'd love to see this document expanded. Maybe a database could be hosted at Mike's site for credible information gathered from Naim, NANA or other distributors for *all* product tuning tips or service issues. I know the logistics like authentication would be difficult at best but if someone had the time or inclination....

regards,

dave

You got there before me. In the same vein as this thread I was wondering about the transport on my CDi, if you look at the transport against the shell of the unit it is clearly leaning see inclosed picture, not very clear I am afraid, I colored in a grey box either end of the transport to show the gap to the unti top.

This picture was taken head on, not to the side.

Can anyone comment on the suspension that is employed in the CDi?

It all works well, there is however more bounce where the transport is closer to the unit top. What are the four screws laid out in a square to each corner of the transport? They have allen key bolts.

anyway just interested, the CDi has been like this since I purchased, so I don't know any different.

Well, after reading all of the above I couldn't resist checking the tightness of these nuts and bolts which mount the main board to the suspension. Six of them were not very tight, the rest were okay.

Whilst faffing around I gave the transport tray of the CDS a good clean with Foam Clean, the stuff I use for cleaning my P.C. This is the only thing I have ever tried on the transport tray that has worked, and I can't believe I never tried it before. The tray always looked as though the paint finish was scuffed and worn away.

I put the player back together and put the Beta Band on and noticed that it all sounds a bit less grainy. I was still having trouble skipping from one track to the next, even after faffing with the puck. I'm not suggesting you try this at home, but as I'm feeling brave today I decided to carefully apply a small amount of Foam Clean to a clean cloth and very gently wipe around the nextel ring of the transport. It has worked! My CDS even plays Warner Bros CD's and lets me randomly select tracks without complaint. I'm assuming that the nextel was as dirty and greasy as the transport tray itself.

I'm sure cleaning the transport in this way is not recommended by Naim. It worked for me, but remember if you kill your CDS your only option is to upgrade to CDS2!

Best wishes,

Michael

Sorry for the shouting....The dull or rough finished paint is intentional. It's a special light absorbing paint (hence the lack of "gloss" or "sheen").

Applying any sort of liquid (especially with alcohol or ammonia) will damage the paint and it's purpose. Naim, NANA?

Leave this surface grungy...it's supposed to be that way.

regards,

dave

P.S. Try blu-tak on the hub,Nextel ring and squished into the top hat's center as well as the mating surface of the top hat puck. Blu-tak safely removes trash.

[This message was edited by dave simpson on SUNDAY 20 January 2002 at 22:46.]

I agree with Dave S

Blutack picks up everything from flakes of dandruff and miscreant hairs down to microscopic levels of dust. It's really good stuff and doesn't stain the matt black paint on your tray.

BTW for anyone who can't get hold of it in the States or wherever look here

P

Hiya,

Yeah, I know the paint is a special finish and designed to do a certain job. The problem was that the finish was so dirty from greasy fingers touching it when removing CD's that parts of the paint finish looked light grey. I decided to take the plunge and now the tray looks good as new. Also I have tried blu tak a million times with limited success on my player. I'm sure it works for most of you. Again I decided to risk it as the player is pretty old and I was resigned to upgrading it. If I get another six months use out of the CDS I'll be happy. Even a new puck provided only limited success, so I reckon in my case the Foamclene has removed the grime which was causing the discs to slip an now it works perfectly and sounds great.

Cheers,

Mick.

Mick,

If it worked for you... who am I to argue with success;)

regards,

dave

Gary,
After seeing that photo you have got me fiddling around with bits of card and tilting my head to one side holding a lamp for light. Trying to see if my transports level. Its a good job every one already knows I am mad. The transports ok though.

Seriously I think you should let Naim have a look at your player. If nothing needs doing then it wont really cost anything, but you will get peace of mind.

I am thinking of sending mine in but I am a bit afraid they will take one look at my balding Nexel ring and recommend a new transport.

Simon

I managed to get the thing open and had a closer look, I think it would be fair to say that the suspension is a little more rustic, that is to say 3 springs!

I have decided not to worry to much about it it would simply appear that the side that dipping is because the spring is slightly less sprung.

I suppose if I was really bored I could do something about it, but hey better things to worry about, we have the CEO of the company in tomorrow and he wants a three course meal.