A few hours with a Unitiserve, Snait, nDAC and my PC
Posted by: Occean on 28 September 2010
Currently I have a Supernait which is fed by my PC (Win 7 64bit/3.0ghz/ssd/nas/foobar/ESI Juli@) into my Spendor S5e’s + REL Stampede. I know the obvious upgrade for this is a Hicap2, but as it happens I currently have £2k ish I can spend. I really like the idea of the Unitiserve – yes my PC works just fine but a separate solution seems like a good idea to me. Also with all the hype of the nDAC and it being £2k, I thought I had better have a listen too….
So I organised a demo at O&L in Clapham, called silenttim from the forums to join me.
Unitiserve + Snait
Unitiserve + DAC + Snait
My PC + SNait
My PC + DAC + Snait
Speakers were PMC GB1 which I have heard many times before.
So I brought a couple CD’s (Martina Topley Bird, Antonio, Audio Bullies, Waldeck) ripped them with the Unitiserve, nice – must say that’s easy! So first up was the ‘serve, snait and with a DC1. Oh my it sounded so different to my home setup, the top end was really edgy in a negative way, I guess I was not as familiar with the PMC’s as I thought. Listened to a few tracks, all had the edgy topend, overall I wasn’t happy – I check with the guys that everything was warm and run in, they confirmed.
So we dropped in the DAC – everything started to sound lovely. The top end was smooth again, more detail and all the good things you expect but it wasn’t a million miles from my home setup. Not sure about the PMC’s at all. Repeated all the tracks
Next step was to setup my PC, optically into the Snait with the Serve connected via a DC1. The difference was astounding, we could both hear quite a big difference…my PC was better! The ‘serve had the same edgy sound to it as before, but my PC had all the detail and resolution (and reading FLAC’s) but the topend sounded so much better to both of us, even a quick blind test, everytime we could tell the difference. I was shocked and I must say a little disappointed, I loved the idea of the serve. But my confidence was restored in the PMC’s.
So finally – PC to DAC to Snait as well as the ‘serve – the DAC made a nice improvement to the PC, soundstage was widen and everything was just a little sharper but I was not convinced at £2k better…I know a Hicap’s improvement is a lot more than this.
So what did I decide, well I am booking the DAC for a home demo. The serve, well if it sounded as good as my pc (I was expecting that at the least) I would have ordered there and then, it didn’t – this has made me realise that my PC does a damn good job, it has always outperformed my Mac and sonos. So I may build the *perfect* PC instead.
As for the DAC, it was good, but not £2k better than the Snait bare, I need to thing long and hard about my upgrade path, if I decide to go 282/250 the DAC is a must, but I am not sure I want to go that far and unbalance my AV system so much (it sounds friggin awesome right now).
So I organised a demo at O&L in Clapham, called silenttim from the forums to join me.
Unitiserve + Snait
Unitiserve + DAC + Snait
My PC + SNait
My PC + DAC + Snait
Speakers were PMC GB1 which I have heard many times before.
So I brought a couple CD’s (Martina Topley Bird, Antonio, Audio Bullies, Waldeck) ripped them with the Unitiserve, nice – must say that’s easy! So first up was the ‘serve, snait and with a DC1. Oh my it sounded so different to my home setup, the top end was really edgy in a negative way, I guess I was not as familiar with the PMC’s as I thought. Listened to a few tracks, all had the edgy topend, overall I wasn’t happy – I check with the guys that everything was warm and run in, they confirmed.
So we dropped in the DAC – everything started to sound lovely. The top end was smooth again, more detail and all the good things you expect but it wasn’t a million miles from my home setup. Not sure about the PMC’s at all. Repeated all the tracks
Next step was to setup my PC, optically into the Snait with the Serve connected via a DC1. The difference was astounding, we could both hear quite a big difference…my PC was better! The ‘serve had the same edgy sound to it as before, but my PC had all the detail and resolution (and reading FLAC’s) but the topend sounded so much better to both of us, even a quick blind test, everytime we could tell the difference. I was shocked and I must say a little disappointed, I loved the idea of the serve. But my confidence was restored in the PMC’s.
So finally – PC to DAC to Snait as well as the ‘serve – the DAC made a nice improvement to the PC, soundstage was widen and everything was just a little sharper but I was not convinced at £2k better…I know a Hicap’s improvement is a lot more than this.
So what did I decide, well I am booking the DAC for a home demo. The serve, well if it sounded as good as my pc (I was expecting that at the least) I would have ordered there and then, it didn’t – this has made me realise that my PC does a damn good job, it has always outperformed my Mac and sonos. So I may build the *perfect* PC instead.
As for the DAC, it was good, but not £2k better than the Snait bare, I need to thing long and hard about my upgrade path, if I decide to go 282/250 the DAC is a must, but I am not sure I want to go that far and unbalance my AV system so much (it sounds friggin awesome right now).
Not what I'd expect and yes, tos being better and them so different is most interesting. I haven't heard the serve yet but the HDX that it's based on has no edginess for me whatsoever. You have to go with what you heard but it seems something in the package or setup may have been bright other than/besides the serve. Tos usually softens things a bit and here it was helping along. Pure speculation on my part. 
Let us know how it goes if you do a home dem. Are you using WASAPI?
Maybe an NDX will be right up your alley. I suspect it's character may be more pleasing to many.
Let us know how it goes if you do a home dem. Are you using WASAPI?Maybe an NDX will be right up your alley. I suspect it's character may be more pleasing to many.
Don't worry, you won't offend any card-carrying members of the Serve Mutual Admiration Societyquote:Originally posted by Occean:
I am not saying the serve is bad, but my ears are used to a different sound.
Our motto : To Serve and Protect 
quote:Originally posted by Occean:
the NDX is not for me, there are so many things I do not like about it.
Dear Ocean
Could you please be a bit more precise.. what dont you like on the NDX
quote:Originally posted by AbsoluteMusic:quote:Originally posted by Occean:
the NDX is not for me, there are so many things I do not like about it.
Dear Ocean
Could you please be a bit more precise.. what dont you like on the NDX
Its just a personal thing, I am sure it sounds great and will be perfect for some people.
Hardwesr
A £3000 unit that seems to be part nDac £2000 but not the same quality and 50% Uniqute £1300 for me it doesn't add up.
Software
I much prefer the HDX/Serve software, which is a server rather than client. Again for £3k I don't want to reply on 3rd party upnp server software. I'd like to have seen the serve software minus ripping (a la Sonos and DS). No 176/192khz support in upnp.
If I had to sped £3k a sneaky DS and Ndac or I'd save another £1k for a serve.
quote:Originally posted by Occean:quote:Originally posted by AbsoluteMusic:quote:Originally posted by Occean:
the NDX is not for me, there are so many things I do not like about it.
Dear Ocean
Could you please be a bit more precise.. what dont you like on the NDX
Its just a personal thing, I am sure it sounds great and will be perfect for some people.
Hardwesr
A £3000 unit that seems to be part nDac £2000 but not the same quality and 50% Uniqute £1300 for me it doesn't add up.
Software
I much prefer the HDX/Serve software, which is a server rather than client. Again for £3k I don't want to reply on 3rd party upnp server software. I'd like to have seen the serve software minus ripping (a la Sonos and DS). No 176/192khz support in upnp.
If I had to sped £3k a sneaky DS and Ndac or I'd save another £1k for a serve.
oki..tks for the clarification. I'm also not fully convince by the "net" solution. (would prefer a dedicated "all in one" solution) Basically like which proposed by the HDX...but not at it's current price....to much by a lot if looking on the component used....Must admit that coming from the IT world i cannot imaging today spending this sum for an HDX
.. tech looks a bit un-mature ) Just my two cents
PM was in hog but every setup is different. Value vs better is also a very individual equation. 
Allen, HDX was updated to latest but not SSD or BNC connector, both DAC and HDX earthed and only DAC connected to 552 for all auditions. HDX played via NAS and the other 2 played via the same files transferred to their internal drives so it could be part of their libraries without much manipulation. If anything, the HDX was at a disadvantage depending on your take of distant multi use nas vs local.
Allen, HDX was updated to latest but not SSD or BNC connector, both DAC and HDX earthed and only DAC connected to 552 for all auditions. HDX played via NAS and the other 2 played via the same files transferred to their internal drives so it could be part of their libraries without much manipulation. If anything, the HDX was at a disadvantage depending on your take of distant multi use nas vs local.
JS....there are many instances when someone has told me of a huge leap in performance brought on by this or that only to find out the "improvement" turns out to be a false
sense of extra detail or huge change in dynamic ability that ultimately fails to satisfy.
The context of my response to Occean is simply to point out the need to first look at source because of the real improvements in music communication that come from the "source first" religion. Whereas simply making something more dramatic or clearer or bassier or whatever often times is perceived as better when in fact a simple change which is not so obvious further up the chain can bring more real and lasting benefits.
That was too long wasn't it!?
sense of extra detail or huge change in dynamic ability that ultimately fails to satisfy.
The context of my response to Occean is simply to point out the need to first look at source because of the real improvements in music communication that come from the "source first" religion. Whereas simply making something more dramatic or clearer or bassier or whatever often times is perceived as better when in fact a simple change which is not so obvious further up the chain can bring more real and lasting benefits.
That was too long wasn't it!?
Personally I think the CAPS build on the CA site gives away a little too much for ability to be portable and it also a little out of date now in terms of hardwear.
A single core atom was chosen as the duals were not passive at the time, now the next gen atom chips are in an the duals are even faster, more ram, less power consuming and passive.
The psu is a smps unit, a liner unit should be superior. Though not portable.
The case is cramped and the pci card is not actually mounted so the outputs are available on the outside, rather cables need to be routed though gaps. Something like atechs passive case would be much more suitable as a home unit
A single core atom was chosen as the duals were not passive at the time, now the next gen atom chips are in an the duals are even faster, more ram, less power consuming and passive.
The psu is a smps unit, a liner unit should be superior. Though not portable.
The case is cramped and the pci card is not actually mounted so the outputs are available on the outside, rather cables need to be routed though gaps. Something like atechs passive case would be much more suitable as a home unit
...oooh, I want one, or one like this:
thought you might like thatthere are also the Mcubed cases which are a lot easier to get hold of in the UK - they also do a mini one that takes a PCI card
The HeatSync 2500 is a beautiful case -- looks great. But $569....with no options selected? 
I love the DIY approach when it delivers excellent sound and maximum functionality...at a reasonable cost.
IMHO, if you start out with such an upscale case, then you may run the risk of pushing your total build cost pretty close to manufacturer-delivered turn-key solutions.
And I thought I was over-the-top spending $200+ for the Origen case last February!
Hook
I love the DIY approach when it delivers excellent sound and maximum functionality...at a reasonable cost.
IMHO, if you start out with such an upscale case, then you may run the risk of pushing your total build cost pretty close to manufacturer-delivered turn-key solutions.
And I thought I was over-the-top spending $200+ for the Origen case last February!
Hook