CDS-CDSII upgrade

Thanks. Tell us about the new pucks please.

malcolm

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Originally posted by Rockingdoc:
Thanks. Tell us about the new pucks please.

malcolm

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Which ones? If you're referring to the puck used in the new players (CDX2 & forthcoming CDS3) then they use longer locating pins to the older types and are incompatible with earlier players.

If you're referring to the "new" top-hat puck for use in the CDS and CDI, it uses two rubber grips rather than the single one used originally. In subjective tests, the single grip puck sounds slightly better but the double grip puck offers greater playability with troublesome discs. Both can be purchased from your Naim dealer.

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Originally posted by I was dobbin once!:
So how long will replacement pucks for the old CDX be available??

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For as long as customers require replacements...

Richard

When will the promised 500 series fronts be available for olive panelled products as Paul S. previously promised us and what will the cost be?

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Originally posted by Bosh:
Richard

When will the promised 500 series fronts be available for olive panelled products as Paul S. previously promised us and what will the cost be?

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We'll make an announcement about this in a few months time. At the moment we've got our work cut out fulfilling orders on the new equipment so everybody, please be patient...

Thanks Richard. I have the three-rubbers flat puck with my CDS2, which needs pretty frequent TLC with the Blu-tak to avoid the ERR. I got the (presumably wrong) impression that a new replacement puck was in the offing.

malcolm

Malcolm,

problems with the puck are usually down to compression of the little rubber grips. A handy tip is to periodically tease out the grips to their full extension - obviously being careful not to get grease from your fingers onto the rubber and also avoiding breaking the rubber grips.

The puck is a delicate balancing act; on the one hand it must actually firmly grip the disc but on the other hand it must only make the most gentle of contacts, otherwise sound quality is impaired.

Treat the puck as a "consumable" item which wears with time and be prepared to buy a replacment every now and again, and you shouldn't have any problems (even with CD-Rs.... ).

I am dim.

It didn't occur to me that my problem with CDRs in the CDS2 might be due to thin discs. I thought it was something to do with not reading the layers correctly.

Much happier now thanks

malcolm

"Treat the puck as a "consumable" item which wears with time and be prepared to buy a replacment every now and again, and you shouldn't have any problems (even with CD-Rs)."


Richard,

I got a new puck, and the old one sounded better. I have a witness, too. The new ones grips better.

Weird, eh?

cheers, Martin

E-mail:- MartinPayne at Dial.Pipex.com

I read your comments about pucks with interest. I had a CDS and now have a CDSII, both since they were released. I had many problems with tracking on the CDS and had to clean the puck at least once a week. I have never cleaned the puck on my CDSII as it has never had any problems reading a CD. I know that this is probably terribly wrong and that I should be soaking the puck in asses milk on an hourly basis, but if it ain't broke ..

A few questions about the CDSIII. I have heard both that it is another giant leap and a just a reboxed CDSII. I have also been told not to bother because it's just a stop gap measure until a 500 series player comes out. Any comments ?

Richard

What will the ball park UK price be for the CDS3.
I was saving pennies for a NAIM CD and want to adjust my planning

Thanks

GEOFFP

hi. could someone please tell me what upgrade of the CDS2 you are speaking of? I am contemplating the purchase of a CDS2 and would like to have specifics on the upgrade. Thanks.

david

David,

My understanding is that the CDS2 is no longer available pending the release of the CDS3. The CDS can be upgraded to CDS2 specification but the CDS2 will not be able to upgraded to a CDS3.

There is also talk of a 500 series CD player that would presumably operate in zero gravity and come with a lifetime supply of tissues.

Thanks Minky, but in the first post one of our esteemed leaders talks about the CDS 2 upgrade program. Now I ask you, what is this program?? IF i buy a used CDS2, what kind of upgrades do NAIM offer for it?

OOOOOOHHHHHH. Wait. I think some of my I.Q. points are coming back. He is talking of a CDS-CDS2 upgrade program which lets you upgrade from a CDS to a CDS2, right?? It has nothing to do with a CDS2 upgrade. "I see" says the blind man.

David

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Originally posted by StuartA:
Richard,

I will be going CDS3 as soon as you guys release it. It will make a change for me to buy a naim product at the beginning of its shelf life. However this is a major investment for me and I have given some thought to its shelf life and spares availability long into the future.

Have you considered an "insurance" policy on, say, moving parts. I would be happy to pay for you to keep transports in stock and safeguard the life of the product as far as poss.

Any thoughts?

Stu.

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Stu,

we routinely try to keep a large supply of spares in stock once a product is discontinued. We can still service just about everything we've ever made and we have no intention of changing this policy. It's one of the reasons we had to suddenly stop building the NAT 01 once we discovered we could no longer source certain parts. Demand rocketed and it would have been tempting to use up what parts we had building units to satisfy that demand but ultimately we need to ensure we can service all those units in customers hands for many years to come.

No price yet for the CDS3, I'm afraid but reckon on it being a little bit more than the outgoing CDSII.

The 500 series CD player is "pie in the sky" at the moment. It's a possible project but no decision has yet been taken as to whether we will pursue it. If it ever did happen it would be extremely expensive and would have to take CD replay to whole new level. The fact that the CDS3 reputedly does just that already makes R&Ds job extremely tough with the 500 series player, so it may never happen....

[This message was edited by Richard Dane on THURSDAY 30 January 2003 at 10:20.]

I was playing with me puck rubbers yesterday and got to thinking about the pucks being "consumables".
Isn't this a bit wasteful and un-environmental. I mean the plastic holder and magnets don't wear out, just the rubbers. Couldn't Naim dealers supply little packs of rubber rings instead of whole new pucks?

malcolm

I’m not pleased at all when learning the CDS1-22 upgrade will not be possible any more. Not because I could afford it (if I could,then I’ll rather spend this money on a used 52) but I understand this is the time when our dedicated CDS1 has to be considered as obsolate.

Taking it into account, wouldn’t you think it’s time to loose on Naim’s policy denying any technical information on the items?

In my case, I have the best possible technical support in Hungary (including measuring equipments) where they can regularily fine tuning the Philips CDM4 of the CDS1, on the basis of the servicing manual with the help if not of Naim’s then of some Philips machines. (Then tracking errors will be vanished for a year or so.)

It was possible even repairing the CDS1 when one cap went blooey. It was a terrible “blind flying” but at the end it was evident that it was not necessary to send the player back to Salisbury and paying money and time. By the way, I have a spare CDM4, from the serie 22. Of course not 21, because the whole serie 21 was ordered from Philips strictly for Naim Audio. It would be good to know whether its apt for the CDS1.

To summarize my question: why not to sell us a service manual for the player that - especially after the start of the CDS3 - is totally obsolate.

graphoman

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Originally posted by graphoman:
To summarize my question: why not to sell us a service manual for the player that - especially after the start of the CDS3 - is totally obsolate.

graphoman

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may be the service manual will show the design concept of the CDS series that Naim Audio consider it as their intellectual property. Perhaps the CDS2, CDS3 design were also based on lesson learnt from the CDS1

it does not work that way. Do you suggest the ENEMY has been ready for 12 years and even now he’s just waiting for the occasion to steal all the ideas behind the CDS1, and therefore standing in contact with all the CDS1-owners?

graphoman

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Originally posted by graphoman:
it does not work that way. Do you suggest the ENEMY has been ready for 12 years and even now he’s just waiting for the occasion to steal all the ideas behind the CDS1, and therefore standing in contact with all the CDS1-owners?

graphoman

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Graphoman

It is a common practice that companies protect their design even the obsolete ones. The CDS1 may be considered obsolete if compared to the CDS2 or CDS3 but still very advanced to many others currently in the market. I dont have problem with their policy as long as they still can (at their best ability) repair the older products. If you read those Naim flyers or the "official info" on their product lines you will find nothing except some techno-words to wet people fantasies on their new toys. They will never release a well written official comparison between the older designs and the new ones with clear analysis (reviews) and explanation why the newer designs are better (by using new components/new circuit layouts and impact of the each new component to the sound). I bet you that they (Naim Audio) must have all those analyses done before changing things. The magic is to keep it secret (black box type) so that if you like the sound you have to buy. Do you know other company (audio) that provide to their customers technical info on the obsolete products?

yes, in our practice (in the recent 25 years or so) there never was any problem with the service manuals. Not with the manuals of the obsolate items: it’s rather meant the service manual of any of the living product of a lot of named companies. It’s mandatory that the customer should possess the service manual if he wants to. (It does not come free, I must admit.)

In addition to it, here may be mentioned that my friend (ones my co-editor) is the best expert in Hungary on the field of measuring technique and standardization, and, on the other side, the best repair man at the same time. There is absolutely no movement in Naim’s laboratory that he could not cope with, supposed we’d get the technical information needed. And then (in the case the CDS1 becomes faulty) I would not send the thing to Salisbury, would not bother the factory, would not remain without music for 5-6 weeks, and would save repairing and transporting cost.

It is as simple like that.

graphoman

graphoman,

Your repair man sounds good - but can he make Nextel rings? More precious than mithril in this part of the world.

David

I'm with Dias on this one. Not upgrading to CDS2. Hopefully Naim will be able to provide spares (especially CDM4 transport) when I send my CDS1 back to Naim on it's 10th anniversary in 2005. Nextel ring may kaput by then.

Friends are very surprised how good the CDS1 sound for a 7 year old CD player!! I'm glad Naim doesn't make auto CD drawer. I guess it's a pat on the shoulder for great engineering, product reliability and thoughts into after sales support.

Roland

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Originally posted by Tuan:
It is a common practice that companies protect their design even the obsolete ones. The CDS1 may be considered obsolete if compared to the CDS2 or CDS3 but still very advanced to many others currently in the market. The magic is to keep it secret (black box type) so that if you like the sound you have to buy. Do you know other company (audio) that provide to their customers technical info on the obsolete products?

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Interesting idea. But seriously, I doubt the competition would have been waiting for a printed copy of the CDS data if they wanted to steal some of its design ideas. There's this lovely phrase reverse engineering, taking apart a competitor's product to see what makes it tick, and I'm sure that's what everyone is doing all the time in high-end audio.

Herman