FE or RE

Posted by: Milk&Juice on 20 August 2003

I apologize in advance for bringing this topic up, cause it has probably been talked about to death on this forum.

But recently I have discovered segments in the audio industry divided between flat earth and round earth. I am aware that Naim and some other companies are regarded as flat earth, but I am confused as to all the differences between the two.

If I am wrong could you please point it out, but does flat earth in general refer to the PRaT and constructed lines of music and round earth to sound staging and timbre etc. I know this may be a novice question, but it is one asked by a novice enthusiast.

Also if I were to use Quad ESLs with Naim amplification which would this fall under? Wouldn't the Quads be RE and the Naim FE so what would the mix of the two brand of components comprise then? Would the strengths and weaknesses cancel each other or compliment?

Thanks in advance for any help in this matter,once again sorry for bringing this up but I would like some clarification.

Dru

Posted on: 20 August 2003 by Paul B

quote:
Also if I were to use Quad ESLs with Naim amplification which would this fall under? Wouldn't the Quads be RE and the Naim FE so what would the mix of the two brand of components comprise then?

I would suspect that you would be located in Middle Earth which is neither heaven nor hell.

Please keep in mind that there is no compromise with the truth. Either you are with us or against us. Remember that. Any deviation from the path of righteousness is treachery and an abomination. I already suspect that you are not a true believer.

You may note that I have not mentioned what is the "true" path. One does not have to say it to know.

Paul

Posted on: 20 August 2003 by joe90

On Flat Earth they would hand you for such a crime.

On Round Earth you could live your days out in a blissful ignorance.

Best stay put.

Joe90

Posted on: 20 August 2003 by joe90

I mean HANG you. HANDING you is something else entirely.

Joe90

Posted on: 20 August 2003 by Milk&Juice

RussianRiverKid

I think once the stones have stopped on you I think they will have a new home on my head

I am like you I absolutely love my Naim CDP and FC2 and am contemplating buying Naim amplification as well but I have to admit I love the sound of the ESLs(i think that last stone drew blood.

But thanks for the links I have determined that I mustn't be FE cause my only source is digital and I threw out all my old LPs. Hell I even like valve stuff, but I would like to try an all FE setup and see the difference and whether its just the way I listen to my music.

I don't believe I am either, just someone still learning with trial and error. Although I don't think I'm gonna make many friends on here though

So one last question, which field would Dynaudio fall under then? or Sonus Faber? Most of the speakers that are mentioned as FE aren't readily available to me or even just to listen too. So maybe I'm stuck in between a rock and a hard place.

Thanks again

Dru

Posted on: 21 August 2003 by bjorne

Don't worry guys. As long as you have a Linn or Rega tt or a Naim CDplayer with Naim amps it's acceptable (at least to some people) using other speakers than Naim.

Posted on: 21 August 2003 by Milk&Juice

Well I am still changing minds bout my speakers and amps but at the moment I am in "Middle Earth" so that means I have to deal with the battle at Helms Deep, and have hobbit and elvish friends.

Posted on: 21 August 2003 by domfjbrown

quote:
Originally posted by bjorne:
Don't worry guys. As long as you have a Linn or Rega tt or a Naim CDplayer with Naim amps it's acceptable (at least to some people) using other speakers than Naim.

What about a Rega Planet CD and Ela speakers with Naim in the middle?

When the music's over turn out the lights

Posted on: 21 August 2003 by bjorne

quote:
Originally posted by domfjbrown:

What about a Rega Planet CD and Ela speakers with Naim in the middle?

Perfectly acceptable if you use Naim loudspeaker cable. The Planet is accepted as a good enough CDplayer for those who don't want to spend a lot of money playing this awful new digital media.....

[This message was edited by bjorne on THURSDAY 21 August 2003 at 14:07.]

Posted on: 21 August 2003 by Paul B

quote:
my only source is digital and I threw out all my old LPs

The horror! The horror! No wonder you like RE then.

Paul

Posted on: 21 August 2003 by garyi

Dom, its time to face it you are flat earth. I know you move in round earth crowds but you are flat earth.

Posted on: 21 August 2003 by joe90

I'm not THAT flat. I have a pair of Royd Edens.
Oh, hang on...

Anyway, one good thing about the ESLs is that you could hde behind them when the goblins come looking for you.
A little bit like Harry Potter's invisibility cloak.

Joe90

Posted on: 21 August 2003 by Milk&Juice

there'll be so much air and transparency that the orks won't see me

But hang on, I've got a CD5 with flatcap2, maybe they will see me.

Posted on: 21 August 2003 by Steve Toy

I love the music played through Naim CD players. To me the tune and rhythm are there at this starting point in the musical reproductive chain. From that point on any number of different amps and speakers can do the business provided they don't remove any of the qualities laid down at source.

I have a Naim CD player and I use Naca5. Everything else in my system is not Naim but has a similar outlook.

The CDX is a very airy, and spacious CD player as revealed by my amps and speakers. The PR&T elements are also retained throughout the reproductive chain in my system.

Regards,

Steve.

Posted on: 22 August 2003 by Paul Ranson

Products aren't Flat Earth, people are. This forum has a vocal wing of Round Earthers.

A clue to a Round Earther can be found in the language used, references to 'air', 'space', 'PRaT', 'slam', 'detail', etc. They're describing what they hear, and what they hear is sound not music.

I've been playing with a partially broken pair of Quad ESL63 this week. This speaker should be on every Flat Earther's list, and the current version looks positively bargain basement.

Paul

Posted on: 22 August 2003 by ClaudeP

Art Dudley provides a very good description of the "flat earth" concept in his review of the Nait 5 (Stereophile, August 2003):

"it could teach more expensive amplifiers a thing or two about playing music..."

IMO, it summarizes it all.

Posted on: 23 August 2003 by Paul Ranson

It's quite OK to want sound, or to be mostly interested in the sound. There's nothing wrong with having a RE tendency.

But IME if you get the music the sound follows, the reverse isn't always the case.

RE. That violin sounds gorgeous.
FE. That violinist has a hangover.

etc....

Paul

Posted on: 24 August 2003 by joe90

I agree with Paul.
Sound follows the music, the reverse isn't always true.
That's so right. And so succinct.

Joe90

Posted on: 24 August 2003 by Milk&Juice

So I understand that PRaT are fundamentals of a flat earth listener. But saying that does that specify we listen for the flow of constructed musical lines or the transient response and decay of different notes.

Would specification also be able to narrow down the range of what would typify FE and what is RE.