Streaming options help (please!), part 1239202

Posted by: Kartik on 01 May 2012

Hi guys --

 

I think it's time to ditch the CDX2 and move to a streaming solution, and I'd love some help from the forum. I tried searching this and various other fora, and while I think I've managed to glean some information, I'm still a bit confused! So I hope you don't mind me asking some tired old questions again.

 

We're a mixed Apple / PC household. I currently use a Windows laptop, and my fiancee uses a Windows laptop too, but is thinking of moving to a Macbook. We have 4 (perhaps soon to be 5) iDevices between us.

 

We both have relatively small individual music libraries on our computers (c.40GB each; lossy, but great music!), and use our own computers to sync our iDevices. Both of us use iTunes as our music / iDevice management software. We would like to keep doing this, though we're happy for our music libraries to live on a NAS etc, and only be available on our laptops when we're at home.

 

The plan is to combine our individual music libraries into one big one (with a little help from TuneUp etc), and then get around to the process of ripping our c.600 CDs in lossless format. Currently thinking ALAC since we both use iTunes, and this makes syncing with iDevices etc easier.

 

 

So here are the two options I'm considering:

 

A. Buy a Mac mini and plug it right into a DAC + get a NAS for general back up etc

 

B. Buy an NDX + either a Vortexbox or a WHS NAS running Asset

 

 


Option A

 

I understand that you can't have multiples instances of iTunes all looking at the same physical library without creating all sorts of mix-ups (i.e., can't have her computer, my computer and the new music-dedicated Mac mini all pointing to the same physical library on a NAS). Is this true? If so, for people who run a Mac + Dac setup, how do you manage your music library for use with both your primary system and things like iDevices?

 

I don't want to have to rely on any other computer apart from the Mini being on when playing music, so that rules out Homesharing etc, and I don't want to sync our iDevices to the new Mini (since they need to be able to talk to Outlook etc on our individual laptops).

 

As far as I can tell, the best thing to do is to have three separate physical libraries (her computer, mine and the Mac mini), and get software like SuperSync to keep them all synchronized. This seems to be kinda redundant and inefficient, but at least it simplifies the replay chain (Mac mini HDD --> DAC), keeps our current iDevices management method intact, and also offers a rudimentary backup solution.

 

Also, as an additional plus point, this option lets us keep using Apple's Remote app as a control point, which is a lovely app and my fiancee is already familiar with it.

 

Still, would love to hear of a more elegant / better Mac+Dac method if you guys have any!

 


Option B

 

If I go down the Vortexbox / Asset NAS route, can I move all my music into one of them, and then can I still use my iTunes as the primary music management software? ie can the UPnP servers just stream ALAC to an NDX without having to create separate file structures, FLAC mirrors, etc?

 

In this kind of a setup, will album art, playlists (including ones created by Genius) etc work ok? I imagine I'd use either n-Stream or the Asset Control Point as my control point software, though open to other ideas.

 

I guess that this option will presumably mean having more complex / robust network architecture, since music will have to be streamed across it real-time, rather than just played from a computer's HDD as in Option A above -- perhaps run a wired connection all the way to the NDX rather than just rely on wi-fi?

 

Additionally, how do I get around the problem of still having to manage multiple iTunes libraries (hers and mine)? We still need to make sure that our iDevices can be synced to our own computers, and we can get access to all our combined music + individual contacts, calendars, memos, apps, books, etc.

 

Perhaps here Homesharing could work? Assuming my library is the primary one, and I share it with her, can she have access to it when she syncs her iDevices? We would like to have separate playlists etc if possible. Otherwise I guess back to the SuperSync / multiple libraries plan.

 

 

 

 

Sorry about this overly long, slightly random stream of thoughts. Just really confused on what I should do!

 

Would love to hear what you guys think the best way forward is, any better ways of executing either / both of the above options, any completely new options, etc. Thoughts on sound quality, convenience and future proofing would be great too.

 

thanks very much!

 

best,

Kartik.

Posted on: 01 May 2012 by Guido Fawkes

> I currently use a Windows laptop, and my fiancee uses a Windows laptop too, but is thinking of moving to a Macbook.

 

Good idea - MacBook's are cool and the just work, Windows is ..... something I only use at work and it is always crashing ... such and such is not responding .... much worse since work moved me to Windows 7. Once you move to Mac, you'll not want to go back to Windows - though I still prefer the Amiga operating system.  

 

> So here are the two options I'm considering:

 

A. Buy a Mac mini and plug it right into a DAC + get a NAS for general back up etc

 

B. Buy an NDX + a Vortexbox 

 

I would go for option A for the better sound quality - if you replaced NDX and NDS then I'd go for option B. 

 

I have 

 

Mac Mini + Naim DAC/555PS downstairs (main system) 

Vortexbox + UQ upstairs (office system)

 

Both work very well, but the SQ of the first system is unquestionable better than that of the second in my opinion; this is because the DAC/555PS is better than UQ (no surprise) - to me it doesn't matter whether you use a Mac Mini or Vortexbox or even Asset (when the Linux version is available, of course) - the SQ depends mostly on the quality of DAC implementation and beyond - of course, you want a low jitter/noise feed, but both the MM and VB are just that. 


Asset does seem to have more features than Vortexbox, but VB is free and Asset requires a Windows licence ... so that rules it out for me, at the moment, but if Spoon ports his app to Linux then I'm up for trying it. 

 

My Mac Mini can access the Vortexbox and it shows up as a separate Library, but I play directly from the Mac. 

 

If you want to manage multiple iTunes libraries then something like PowerTunes (Please click here) will help.

 

All the best, Guy  

Posted on: 01 May 2012 by Zinger
Generally speaking, Mac computers tend to be quieter than PCs (not just the kinda quiet when u stick your head next to the computer) etc. I don't know the science behind it. Mac mini has no fan as far as I know, and if you could even get an SSD into the Mac mini, that would be even better. Personally I like the CAS route as the computer could be used as a media center as well when I am not in the music-mode. The cost for the streamer/transport itself is also lower compared to using NDX as a transport-only device.
Posted on: 01 May 2012 by Kartik
Originally Posted by Guido Fawkes:

My Mac Mini can access the Vortexbox and it shows up as a separate Library, but I play directly from the Mac. 

 

 

Hi Guy --

 

Thanks for the reply. I've seen some of your other posts here, and was hoping that you'd chime in!

 

Just a few questions if you don't mind --

 

1. Does your entire iTunes library live on your Vortexbox? Or are there any copies on other machines?

 

2. How is your Mac mini connected to your VB? Any difference in quality from playing via VB or its HDD?

 

3. Do any other computers apart from your main system's Mac Mini access the VB iTunes library? If so, does using something like PowerTunes let you do that without having to close down iTunes on your Mini first?

 

4. Assuming you have any iDevices, how do you sync them? ie how do they see the music on your MM / VB. Do you do it through your MM, or another computer?

 

thanks so much!

Kartik.

Posted on: 02 May 2012 by Simon-in-Suffolk

Hi Kartik - well I recommend the NDX route. You can upgrade as you go along.

As far as streaming, I recommend a little NAS such as a Netgear Duo. I advise a seperate uPNP server. Get a tiny micro PC for this  (you know the ones the size of a large text book) they are often cheap, fanless/ quiet and you can run Windows HomeServer on it. Its a great OS with no lifestyle bloat, it just works.. simply in the background headless - it even updates itself if you want it to - which is rather rare with WHS. I put Asset on a tiny WHS server. Asset gives you a lot of flexibility and supports your custom tags, which become jolly handy after you have expierienced  streaming for a while and want to catalogue and sort your thousands of CDs your way as opposed to somebright spark working in Cupertini/Seattle.

 

Asset also supports transcoding and streaming to other devices in your house other than your Naim. Transcoding elimates the angst of file types and wondering if you have ripped your thousands CDs in the right format..... You can store the files if whatever format you want and transcode if needed/preferred for your Naim.

 

 

Posted on: 05 May 2012 by Kartik

Thanks guys

 

If I want to use a combination of iTunes for daily iPhone etc management + Asset etc for serious music listening, does Asset do that without messing up iTunes file locations, cover art etc?

 

ie can it just read and serve up my iTunes library (coverart, playlists, genius playlists, etc) without altering it?

 

I currently use iTunes with the 'keep organized' and 'consolidate files' options checked.

 

thanks!

 

best,

Kartik.