Tell me Your Favourite Beethoven Piano Concerto No.1?

yeti42,

I'm gonna try to source it on vinyl but DG's digital recording from the 80s can be iffy no matter what the format is. I wasn't aware he did the set with Jochum. I haven't heard his No.1 but his Emperor Concerto with Böhm sounds pretty good sonically. ( but this is a late 70s recording )

Congrats on your 555PS. It just makes the music more natural and 3D. ( btw, the DR PS does the same thing but more so ) I remember when I first heard the 555PS with a CDS3, it made an XPS2 lifeless and dead next to it.

So i've been listening to the Uchida/Sanderling PC1 on and off for last week or so.

This Decca reissue of their Beethoven Cycle compilation CD is from 2005 but the No.1 & 2 is originally recorded back in '97.

These CDs all have the glassy hard edge to them and tendency to sound stark without much of ambience noise. Definitely this is not a good sample for a digital recording. In addition upper midrange has that annoying ring. Perhaps original issue CD might sound better but sonically these reissues are a disappointment. Not as bad as Arkiv reissue but enclosed booklet's printing quality has that *bootleg* feel with a poor registration. 

Performance wise, It is surprising that this is a rather nondescript rendition out of Uchida. Not soft as her earlier Mozart pieces but there isn't much of attitude or sense of direction. I feel that she's wondering around as if playing Schubert program instead of Beethoven. Her crystal clear keybaord work is appreciated but this is unemotinal performance with no sense of wit. Her fine finger work ending up sounding fussy in that it doesn't feel like Beethoven would have played it.

Obviously I am speculating but from bits and pieces I have read about the composer's personality, fussy and mousey Beethoven Piano Concerto doesn't fit right.

Sanderling's score is big and grand as he did with Richter's No.3 but marred by ringy recording at the climax. The 2nd movement is just binding time with no sense of tension. Rondo is equally unmemorable. This isn't working for me.

 I might  revisit this set later time but I couldn't even complete the entire cycle. ( listened up to No.4 )

Now here's the popular newer release of Beethoven Cycle:

As his recent Schubert CDs, this Harmonia Mundi 2010 release sounds pretty good. 

This is a decent digital recording thanks to bunch of BBC sound engineers and Teldex Studio Berlin. It is not completley free of hardning and glassiness and that massed strings still makes me wince a little but overall well balanced.

Next to Uchida/Sanderling set, this is played out much faster. After the brisk upbeat orchestra intro Lewis' enters in equally sure footing playing out the role of a true virtuoso with a huge chip on his shoulder well. He takes command of the tunes right from the top. 

Lewis' bold muscular solidity, tho I felt sometimes it's wrong for Schubert, find it perfect for a Beethoven tune like this. There are many showy moments for the deliberate effects in that this is more like how Beethoven would have played. ( it's show time!~) Lewis' skillful enough he never lets the technique takes over the tunes. Which is pretty remarkable. The 1st movement cadenza is breathless but keeping things casual and down to earth. Largo starts out like a monologue with thoughtful subtle pausees here and there but I can't say he's got an emotional reach of Kempff. 'All singing all dancing' Rondo funky and bouncy as Backhaus.

I really like the simple communication he creates out of this set. Down to earth but is quite effective. I do like his line of thinking.

Surprising about the Uchida disc, she's one of the few people that can make Mozart work for me and I'd expect her to shine in the early Beethoven too.

I demoed the 555ps against an XPS-DR, the dealer had said when he'd compared them earlier (in a different system) he thought the XPS was now very close to the 555ps-nonDR, nothing like it to my ears. I was using the CDX2 bare before so it really is a considerable improvement.

I'm going to leave it until it needs a service to DR it.

The Serkin/Kubelik set has arrived, so far I've only listened to the first disk, concertos 1 and 2 and it's really rather good, I'm hearing tunes in the 1st I'd not noticed in my other versions and it's not just the different cadenza. The orchestra is of its time but not over blown for early Beethoven and the piano sings rather than shouts. Its weakest in the last movement where it could possibly do with a bit more drive but that's only on first listen so I may come round on that. The recording's pretty good too.

Gents, forgive my ignorance of this genre, but an idiots question

What is the significance of concerto no 1 as opposed to any other number?

Sorry but had to ask

Not a stupid question at all. It's a great piece of music, an endless list of recordings is out there, so it's a good candidate for discussing at length. 

Cheers,

EJ

Beethoven wrote five piano concertos, and the one we call number one was published first, though written second!

The Second Concerto was written first and with-held as Beethoven was not so pleased with it!

Here are the first three in a youtube film, to enjoy!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhzuQ46ceoI

ATB from George

Thanks George. Clear as mud (joking).

So the thread asking which favourite, is asking about the same Beethoven piece, but played by different artists with their own style / take on it?

EJ,

 Thanks for not giving me a derogatory response !

Every performers plays music slight or very differently from another.

With Beethoven there is room for many different performances of each piece he wrote.

ATB from George

Thanks George 

Yeti42,

Thanks for your report!

According to Youngrock Lee's site, Serkin made all together 6 recordings of Piano Concerto in his lifetime. This is his '77 5th recording before his last set with Ozawa in '83. I can imagin Serkin losing steam at the Rondo as this score was mainly intended for the young whipper snapper Ludwig.

But I bet it is interesting from what I read this is a live recording? There is always a chance wonderful magic can happen at the live recording over a canned studio environment.

Cbr600,

Out of all Beethoven's Piano concerto I like No.1 and 4 the best. ( and now no.2 is sort of growing on me )  No.3 and 5 are probably more popular and played often but I don't seem to be tired of listening to the No.1.

Serious classical folks would call different versions of the same tune 'reading'. Basically they are  covers where different musicians interpret the same tunes. Interestingly they can be different enough that the same tune can sound as if sitting through a boring lecture or can be a great emotional experience.

Do you have your favourite Beethoven's Piano Concerto No.1?

If so, please share.

BBC Radio 3 has a weekly program on Saturdays at 9.30am called Building a Library which takes a piece of music and reviews available recordings over about 40 minutes. It can be facinating listening but also sometimes tediuos depending the reviewer and your mood at the time. Their recommendation is usually worth a listen but I don't always agree with it. I can't find Beethoven's 1st in the archive though.

Thanks for the insight Kuma

Hi Cbr600,

As George very rightly points out, the music of Beethoven is not a static or fixed entity and is open to varying interpretation by any musician.  From my humble perspective though, I would extend this view to include the music of all composers and through all styles of music but certainly classical music, by its very nature, seems the most prone to encourage one into a lifelong pursuit of following a moving target.  

Their can be varying degrees of latitude based on taste, knowledge, tolerance or the personality of each individual as well as what we perceive or understand about who the composer was and in what time period, style or culture etc.  Not to generalize though, even within classical music many are content with just one performance or one recording of a work.  For myself personally, I fall into the category of those who enjoy collecting music recordings and find it very satisfying or redeeming to have fifty different versions of my favourite works or composers.

For more modern music that has been recorded by the composer/artist themselves, it seems less likely to want someone else's interpretation.  A collection of Elvis Presley, Johnny Cash, Bob Dylan, Thelonious Monk, Miles Davies, Dave Brubeck, The Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Lady Gaga etc. will form the bulk of a collection along with maybe the odd cover by someone else.  Classical music is the opposite as we don't really have this option since no one knows how Beethoven would have really sounded or played.  

Best Regards,

Doug

Doug,

    Seems like a good point, well conversed. Certainly helps me understand why someone would have multiple copies of samework. 

Thanks for that

Paul

Bet you could find a 3rd or 5th.

Just the third form 2000, for anything before last year it means searching a pdf, anyway this is what they have on the third:

Beethoven: Piano Concerto No.3 in C minor, Op.37 Colin Lawson 23.09.00
First Choice: András Schiff (piano), Dresden Staaskapelle, TELDEC 0630 13159-2 (3-CD)
Bernard Haitink (conductor) (WARNER CLASSICS UK)
(c/w the complete 5 piano concertos)

Second Choice: Mitsuko Uchida (piano), PHILIPS 446 082-2 (CD)
Concertgebouw Orchestra, Kurt Sanderling (conductor) (UNIVERSAL CLASSICS)
(c/w Piano Concerto No.4)

Historic Choice: Annie Fischer (piano), DEUTSCHE GRAMMOPHON 453 804-2 (6-CD, mid-price)
Bavarian State Orchestra, Ferenc Fricsay (conductor) (UNIVERSAL CLASSICS)
(rec. 1957; from Beethoven Historic Recordings, various artists)

Period Instrument Choice: Robert Levin (fortepiano), ARCHIV 457 608-2 (CD)
Orchestre Revolutionnaire et Romantique, (UNIVERSAL CLASSICS)
John Eliot Gardiner (conductor)

Yesterday's was on Brukner 4

I Looks like the programme is available as podcasts from mid Sept 2010 but maybe only accessable from the UK, would you care to give this a try from where you are?

"http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/bal/all"

yeti42,

I just tried the link and it's UK only.

Interesting recommendation this.

The contents gotta be better than this photo. :x

Out of above list, the only one I am familiar is the Uchida/Sanderling set which isn't my favourite No.3. (Richter/Sanderling and Lewis's are two of go to 3rd. )

I should get a hold of Annie Fisher's No.1 and the one with forte piano. They should be interesting.

I knew nothing of Goode, Fischer or Budapest Orchestra till Florestan mentioned them in earlier page.

This is a 2005 recording with an atmospheric and warm overall tonal balance. A touch defused so it has more of a lackback mid hallway perspective rather than up close but relatively distortion/hard edge free. 

I am still struggling, however, with this set. 

Soft, airy and light. Almost I am on a vegitarian diet. They do not insist or make a strong argument anywhere through the score. Or maybe not having a point and going with the flow is their point.

Goode's elastic gliding scale is easy on ear and Fisher's orchestraion equally mellifluous but fire missing from both parties in spite being rhythmic and bouncy. The 2nd movement isn't convincing as the tune just flows right through like water. No clearly defined stops or starts, every note is strung together like a pearl neckless with very little variations or dynamic contrasts. 

Goode's Largo has no Kempff's spontenuity, no commanding presence of Perahia/Lewis, no Arrau's intimacy nor Zimerman's passion.

Without a strong POV, largo always has a danger to become an elevator music.

On balance this is heavily leaning towards Haydn/Mozart camp rather than Beethoven. Rondo also not lively as it should ending up sounding plodding and not incissive enough. There is no explosive dynamic moment on this set.

I would have liked, at least the 3rd movement should have more Beethoven-flavour but they remain reserved and polite.  The funky dance segment is not the Swan Lake! 

They certainly make a pretty music but I am not hearing any new insights.

Another take on Argerich's PC1. 

This time with Seiji Ozawa and Bavarian Radio Symphony Orchestra.

This is an earlier live recording (1983) yet it sounds so much better in terms of recording and mastering than the DG Sinopolli/Philharmonia studio recording.

Warm, spaciuos and upclose but clear tone of piano is coming through well. Virtually no distortions I could hear in problem upper midrange area or massed strings copuled with excellent reach on frequency extremes. A good example of a well done live recording. 

BR Klassik is a Bavarian Radio Symphony's house label. A nice surprise to discover their recording/mastering standard is excellent. However, the Mozart program with Jochum  (1973 recording ) is not as good as this Beethoven recording. Same mastering engineer but different recording engineer. I suspect the original analog tape in a poor condition.

I've noticed that usually I prefer Martha's live recording than the *canned* studio ones. And this one wasn't the exception. Here, she's just as much as lively and energetic but she's more judicious about the silence beween notes. Timing is simply better so she's keeping the tention and following better musical pulse. Ozawa's orchestration is soft and spacious as a good playground for Martha to roam around. Largo is a lot more thoughtful and not so keyed up but I get the feeling that she's always keeping a little distance and for some reasons not letting her hair down. Funky and fun Rondo suits her better personality, perhaps. Odd couple it seems but Ozawa/Argerich combo works better than Sinopolli/Argerich. For one thing, the conductor isn't competing with the pianist.

Or Martha gets the magic power off the audience?

That said, I am not fully convinced if Martha is the right pianist for the scores. 

Leon Fleisher/Szell '61 recording of Beethoven Piano Concerto No.1 was highly liked in the US based music forum. As a novice classical listener, I haven't heard of this American pianist before. This is an original Epic mono pressing. The sound is clean but a tad dry. Also now it feels a bit dated.

I see why it's popular. 

This is a grand scale Gun-ho piece as Richter/Munch set. It is dashing and well constructed throughout. Both Szell and Fleisher never miss a beat with a blazing speed. It's an extravaganza filled with dramatic fireworks. Fleisher is incisive and his astonishing clarity on left hand playing out the role of virtuoso well. However, a machine gun like note delivery at times feeling a bit relentless and finger work appears busy.

Since both gents do not give any breathing space on notes, I find the music suffocating. The music i becomes alive when there is a push and pull elements. This set is all 'push' and not enough 'pulls'.

It doens't have a certain flair and at times I feel like he's dissecting the music rather than interpreting. I like his masculine presentation against Szell's very exacting chariots leading orchestration. But Wish there are larger dynamic expressions. Largo is rather dull emotionally reticent ending up like a lead-footed ordinary slow tune. Awkward and mechanical. Comparatively, later Gilel/Szell set does much better on Largo albeit Szell's orchestration sounds tired and he lost the precision. ( He was suffering from cancer by then ) Neither of them just  wanna let it go where this tune needs to go with the flow. Even his dance segment of Rondo is a bit stiff lacking Kempff's natual ease and light heartedness.

So over all this set sounds a robot-like.

Interesting your comment about 'masculinity', Kuma. I recently bought the above disc - Fleisher's first disc after regaining movement in his semi-paralysed hand, after injections of Bottox, would you believe. My first comment to the missus was that it was the most masculine Chopin playing I had heard, and that I was rather taken by it. My wife, a good Polish lass, weaned on Chopin music since birth, didn't seem impressed with my comment !!!

WW,

Thank you so much for letting me know of his 'Two Hands' CD.
I found a very moving documentary also called 'Two Hands', how he overcame with his illness.

In your CD, Schubert's B Flat Major is listed.

How is it?