Which wine are you drinking today?
Posted by: naim_nymph on 20 October 2012
Wine ratings....
0/10... Undrinkable poison (or corked) …a non-starter.
1/10... Horrible nasty tasting plonk. Best used for a sink waste cleaner.
2/10... Very poor effort, not enjoyable to drink but maybe used for cooking.
3/10... Grimace wine ...with too many concessions that leaves one wanting.
4/10... An okay wine with some virtues but far from good quality.
5/10... Good drinkable fair to middling wine but far from flawless.
6/10... Very good wine, drinkable. Would buy again at the right price.
7/10... Excellent wine, very drinkable and enjoyable.
8/10... Excellent plus wine, highly enjoyable, class!
9/10... A special wine with the most fantastic taste.
Ten!.. Perfection!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Just uncorked an Angel's Flight : )
My previous bottles of this have been nice and this isn't bad either, this the has hints of liquorice…, it really needs to be decanted and goes without saying - room temp… and given some time (2 hours) to smooth out an otherwise cold hairy tongue after taste, can be very grizzly if opened up too cold [I know… I tried] Nice colour and good body but more than slightly strong.
When warmed up proper is very happy face drinkable though : )
score = 6/10
Debs
You're right Mista H, it's just down the road. I have taken friends to Chapel Down on a number of occasions. I also rather like their Flint Dry White, still with some bottles left over from last year in the cellar. I tried their red Pinot Noir a few years back and it showed promise but wasn't available - I believe it was only being made in tiny quantities.
There are plenty of Vineyards in the area - Biddenden is practically on my doorstep - and the passion and potential are there in abundance.
I am a Kent lad, I grew up in Ashford but left at 18. I certainly would not recommend a visit to Ashford to anyone...except of course to Soundcraft HiFi.
Jason.
Agreed Richard, Chapel Down is a great place to visit for a few hours with friends and family.
Book me a ride mate.
You're right Mista H, it's just down the road. I have taken friends to Chapel Down on a number of occasions. I also rather like their Flint Dry White, still with some bottles left over from last year in the cellar. I tried their red Pinot Noir a few years back and it showed promise but wasn't available - I believe it was only being made in tiny quantities.
There are plenty of Vineyards in the area - Biddenden is practically on my doorstep - and the passion and potential are there in abundance.
Not forgetting Biddendens lovely cider as well Richard.
Smith and Woodhouse. Late Bottled Vintage, 2001.
I generally drink Tawnys, but this is quite good for an LBV.
Jason.
Just been reading in Yesterdays Daily Mail that Marks n Sparks are the first Uk retailer to start selling wine from Japan. Its called Sol Lucet Koshu.
Perhaps the first M/B poster to try will report back on what its like.
Mista H
Mista Dolan
As Man U flog most things in their supastore so as to make a few bob i was just wondering if they are flogging their own wine yet ? You know made from grapes grown along the side of the manchester ship canal.
Word has it the ex manager has a few bottles going cheao !!
Mista h
Bought this in Lidl Calais a few weeks back. Dont remember what i paid for it,but very,very average plonk. Thank god i only bought 2 bottles.
As Man United sell wonderful high quality merchandise in their megastore …. I was just wondering if they are flogging their own wine yet ?
Not exactly - the official wine sponsor is -
This is the "standard" wine served in the hospitality suites too
Wine for 4p a Litre!
Just been alerted by my UK friends, that currently you can buy a 3-litre box of Lidl's Spanish "Shiraz"* for just £9.99.
Alcohol duty + VAT on wine in the UK is currently £3.28 per litre, meaning that you are only paying 4p per litre for the box, everything on it, the cost of getting it there, Lidl's margin, and of course the delicious wine** within.
Of course, the human price is that some farmer(s) somewhere (possibly even in Spain) is/are going to the wall, but hey, if you can get pissed for 4p, who gives a toss?
* I kinda doubt that
** only a small percentage of which will be piss.
Wine for 4p a Litre!
Just been alerted by my UK friends, that currently you can buy a 3-litre box of Lidl's Spanish "Shiraz"* for just £9.99.
Alcohol duty + VAT on wine in the UK is currently £3.28 per litre, meaning that you are only paying 4p per litre for the box, everything on it, the cost of getting it there, Lidl's margin, and of course the delicious wine** within.
Of course, the human price is that some farmer(s) somewhere (possibly even in Spain) is/are going to the wall, but hey, if you can get pissed for 4p, who gives a toss?
* I kinda doubt that
** only a small percentage of which will be piss.
SWMBO is going to get some today as we also saw the Lidl advert in todays Daily Mail.
Presume this is a`Lost Leader` and Lidl are praying you will spend on other items whilst in their store.
Mista H
Hecula 2011 14.5%
My wife's been shopping …..
A question or two for Rod, or maybe other wine cognescenti
We have just come back from a holiday in the region of Cahors and spent much time cycling amongst the springtime vineyards. Knowing nothing about wine (and not actually being interested in drinking the stuff as a rule) we realised we also knew nothing about the growing of it.
Do the grapes grow on last year or this year's growth? We could not see why the vines were still left to sprout and produce loads more leaves after the fruit had obviously 'set'.
How are they picked? Can it be done mechanically?
How old are the vines-decades...or longer?
Just curiosity. Never been so close to vineyards before. Looks like a very thriving business judging from the extent and the neatness in that area at least.
Bruce
Hi Bruce
Isn't Cahors lovely? Shame you don't much care for wine, because some of the local wines there are fabulous (and highly sought after) Château du Cèdre, for example, is pretty much impossible to buy without visiting them in person. And you could almost make money on buying there and bringing back to the UK...
The vines' budburst happens in early spring and then the flowering, closely followed by fruit-set, occurs some 40 - 80 days later depending on the place and the weather (a sharp frost is an absolute disaster at either of these critical times. In Bordeaux, for example, where cold weather remains a risk, they throw a party after a frost-free flowering).
I'm perfectly sure that by now, 27 May, it will all have happened in Cahors, and was probably doing so when you were there. Malbec is the local variety (now as, or even more, famous, from Argentina) has a notably poor fruit-set, which means subsequent work in the vineyard and summer pruning (or else less good wine due to the inclusion of under-ripe fruit).
There are literally hundreds of ways of training a vine, and no one of them is exclusively used in Cahors. It will be a mixture of bush-vines (called 'Gobelet' in French - as it sounds, close to the ground, difficult to work, limited yields of concentrated fruit) and a Cordon system (called 'Guyot' and more likely - more easy to work, more controllable). This year's cane will support this year's buds/shoots/bunches. After the harvest they will prune, a new cane for next year, and a new bud for the following year's cane. The most helpful explanation of this system is that in Spain it is often called 'Vara y pulgar' "finger and thumb" and it alternates annually. This year the grapes grow on the finger. Next year they will grown on the finger that sprouts from where this year's thumb is/was and so on.
Wine students can take several lectures, and a vineyard visit, to fully get to grips with this, so I hope I have got it across without being dull.
What then grows is the leaves that actually cause the photosynthesis that gives the plant its sugars and enables it to ripen the fruit. These will also be useful for shade later on (it can get ferociously hot in Cahors in the Summer, as you may have guessed). In some cooler places the leaves will be plucked or trained away from the bunches to maximise sunshine, in others deliberately allowed to grow to provide shade.
A vineyard can be harvested mechanically, and lots of big ones are. I doubt this goes on in Cahors because of its history and topography, and possibly the Appellation rules may forbid it.
Mechanical harvesting has the advantage of being quick (and vineyards can ripen quicker than even large teams of pickers can harvest), and it can be done in the middle of the night (much better to pick cool grapes to avoid subsequent spoilage and/or the need for chemicals). The machines harvest by shaking the trunk, so that the ripe berries fall off, but (theoretically) nothing else does. But the plants need to be specifically planted at the right spacing, on relatively flat land, and trained, to suit the harvesting machines. The machines are incredibly expensive, and obviously only really used once per year (in fact they are so pricey that after the northern hemisphere harvest they will often be dismantled, disinfected, and shipped to the southern hemisphere for the harvest there, and then back again). A manual harvest has the advantage that people can be selective and collect only the grapes that they are instructed to - eliminating the diseased, insect-bitten, bird-pecked, under or over ripe etc. Machine picked grapes will either need to be sorted through at the winery, or else everything goes into the ferment: spiders, twigs, leaves, mud'n'all (the Aussies call this MOG [material other than grapes]), cheaper, but the wine will be less, er, sophisticated.
Vines will carry on fruiting almost indefinitely (no one is actually completely sure whether vines ever die of 'old age'. The Great Vine at Hampton Court is still going 600 years after Henry VIII planted it, although it is very well looked after. There are other similarly venerable vines in the Holy Land and Greece). But the older a vine is, the less fruit it yields. The less fruit, the more concentrated the flavours, but it may cease to be economically viable compared to harvesting lots more fruit from the amount of land you have and making more - albeit it less good - wine. Traditionally the French used to routinely replant after 40 years, but after the evidence of Australia (some friends of mine have the oldest commercial vineyard in Australia planted in 1843), many French producers are leaving vines in the ground for much longer - there seems to be a sort-of plateau of low yield that the vine descends to and then stops decreasing.
The term "Vieilles Vignes" on a French label guarantees you precisely nothing "I'm just off to plant a vineyard of vieilles vignes" runs the vigneron joke, but there is a move to make this term mean legally a vineyard of over 25 years (which still isn't really very old) but it hasn't happened yet.
In the 1850s a louse - phylloxera vastatrix - was introduced to Europe from North America. It then ravaged all the vineyards of Europe and destroyed them. The European vine had no resistance to it (the native American vines do have resistance to it, but unfortunately the wine made from their grapes tastes horrible - kind of animal and fox-musky - if you have ever consumed Welch's Grape Juice in the USA, you can get a sense of it, but it is only really fermentation that brings out its true awfulness). To cut a very long story short, the only solution to this problem (and they tried a LOT of other things before anyone came up with the solution) is to plant an American vine in the nursery or vineyard, wait for it to establish a root system, and then cut off the top and graft in a scion of the desired European vine. The two species are close enough that this works (rather as you can graft the branch of apple onto a pear tree and it will grow, and continue to produce apples). But the resulting plant will always have the graft point as its weak part, and some ailment will usually take hold after the plant grows older. Phylloxera has never been in some places. Until recently Australia was one of them, although it's now arrived, and so it is not a matter of whether these old vineyards on their own roots will die, but when.
A neat vineyard - and they do take immense pride in them - is probably a sign of wine made with great dedication, and therefore a good indication, but it is not in itself an arbiter of quality.
Cahors used to be called "The Black Wine of Cahors" and they had a reputation for being fearsomely tannic, brooding monsters of wines which required either lots of time in a cellar or a plateful of wild boar.
These days, the producers (some even taking a leaf or two from Argentina's book) are making less intense and more elegant wines, often including some Merlot in the blend, or more judicious harvesting. The wines can be very good value for money compared to other similar wines from South West France, especially the Bordeaux-alikes. Still nice with wild boar though!
Sorry, I appear to have over-answered your question.
Cheers
What a fabulous and fascinating reply. I will digest it more when I have time
I love it when people are enthusisatic about stuff on this Forum
The Cahors/lLt valley region is indeed lovely
Cheers Bruce
(I did buy a bottle of Monbazillac to try as I just occasionally like a sweet dessert-type wine. One bottle a year at Xmas usually!)
Today: Jeff Carrel's sublime Morillion 2011. The most versatile and idiosyncratic white wine under £40.
Torres Viña Esmeralda 2013