Centre speaker choice

Hmmm. The Axent's absolutely huge & as rare as rocking-horse poo so I'd discount those. Axess would be good but difficult to find; an n-Cent is the obvious choice and probably easier to locate but still pretty rare TBH. Unless you're very patient you'll probably be best off trying Centres from the likes of B&W etc.

I would get a sub. though - for movies you really do need the oomph for best effect. nSubs are excellent but if not I can heartily recommend BK subs. British, excellent value and the company's a pleasure to deal with.

Thanks Tony.

I pretty much already knew that my chance of finding an Axcent/Axess is slim to none, still no harming in hoping! I have seen a couple of N-Cent's for sale currently, but they are the ones with the silver grills which ,to my taste anyway, look hideous.

The Pioneer receiver arrives today, so will spend the weekend getting things all setup. Will evaluate as I go along if I need to install a sub, or two, the receiver is 9.2. Focus for now is trying to find a decent centre to replace the Whardedale, and next big purchase will be a 55 or 60 inch screen to replace the ageing 40 inch that is currently in use.

Simon

II have a Spendor C5e and really like it - very smooth sounding speaker without too much of its own personality (it that makes sense) would probably integrate quite well. 

Remove the CC speaker and run 4.1 for a while, you may be surprised with the results.  And you really do need a sub (or two!).

Karl

I'd recommend the new'ish PMC Twenty.C, fantastic centre speaker on it's own, extremely clean and detailed, will work really well with the Pioneer but I'm not sure how well it will integrate with your fronts, if not maybe look at the PMC DB1i centre, it's more laid back so may be a better option, these do show up second hand occasionally.

The LX75 is a fantastic reciever though, especially for movies, so fast and dynamic, I'm sure you'll be watching loads of films over the coming weeks 

Thanks for the responses all.

I was hoping to get everything setup this weekend just past, unfortunately due to a shipping problem, the receiver did not arrive on Friday  Should now arrive sometime this week, I hope!

Simon 

Simon,

I would agree with fasterbyelan and try running with a phantom centre - NOT that I expect you to stick there, but it gives you a benchmark against which to shoot.

Picking a centre is a complete pain, if there is no dedicated one available - and it is SO important.

I have owned a selection, and having wasted money over the years my advice would be:

1. Find a test piece where someone is talking as they walk across the screen, and they move 

    between speakers

    This is the test for me, as the pitch and tenor changes with a poor match.

2. Borrow speakers, new or 2nd hand, and live with them for a few days - which means buying from

    a dealer; and will cost you in postage.

3. Don't rush.

When I used Kans I didn't find a centre that really integrated.

I then moved to Art Skibos, and bought the dedicated centre - great.

My last speaker move was to Living Voice Auditorium IIs, and the Skibo centre works very well with them - pure luck.

M

So the LX-75 arrived yesterday, finally.

Speakers and cables were all in place already, so I did a quick auto setup using the supplied microphone last night. First impressions are very positive, sound quality in room is impressive. Although the Pioneer MCACC setup software thinks my front right NBL is out of phase for some reason.  I need to dig into the menu's on the pioneer and tweak as well.

I need to play with the surround speaker placement, the height of the IBL's even in HNE granite plinths is a little low (my couch has a fairly high back). I currently have them either side of my head when seated, not yet sure if this is optimal, I think the couch is absorbing too much of the surround information, but it was only a very quick test. Will try to get a better position for them, or the couch at the weekend when I have some time.

The little Wharfedale 10cc is actually surprisingly good for the price, though obviously outclassed by the NBL's it does it's job OK. Will also play around with a phantom centre at the weekend. Also I may have managed to find an Axess, but I am not sure yet what condition it is in, or if it can be shipped to me.

Simon

Hi Simon,

I currently use Allaes as the front speakers in my system.  After hearing so many times that a centre channel was 'essential' for proper AV listening, I asked for a loan of an nCent.

Unfortunately, it sounded terrible compared to phantom centre mode.  Being a smaller speaker and having a very different tonal balance, the scale of voices shrunk in the mix and the different presentation just drew attention to itself all the time.

Based on this experience with Allaes, I can't imagine that an nCent will work particularly well with your NBLs.

Adding the nSub on the other hand...........

I now run quite happily with the Allaes (soon to be replaced) doing voice duties on movies.

Good luck with your search.

Ian

Thanks for all the feedback.

Well, I never expected to find one, but I have just purchased a second hand Axess from Germany. Black ash unfortunately, where my NBL's are cherry, does match the IBL's though.

Am pretty surprised at finding one so quickly, and in pretty good condition, a few small marks but nothing horrible. It took me two years to find my NBL's !

Still have not had a chance to sit down and watch a movie all the way through yet, but did sit down for 15 minutes yesterday and watch the attack on Gondor scene in return of the king. Hearing the nazgul scream from behind, to along side to the front of me was amazing. The bottom end is pretty impressive with "just" the NBL's providing it, but I suspect a sub will come at somepoint.

The little Wharfedale 10cc is surprisingly competent, more so than I was expecting, but does not really blend with the NBL's. With only having viewed clips of movies so far is hard to say what it would do immersion wise. Anyway, with the Axess coming shortly it's now redundant anyway.

Nice Christmas bonus coming next month, so next on the list is a 55" screen. Leaning towards the Samsung UE55ES7000 at the moment. First though I need to replace the dead oven, or my girlfriend will not be amused if I buy anything else first!

Simon

Simon,

Great news - look forward to reading your thoughts on the Axess.

M

I found one ... but not through work! I got one off "a certain well known internet auction site" that was listed as "a big centre speaker" and - a little oddly - has no serial number or product label on it and has a dent on one of the curved edges. 

Definitely - I run a pair of n-Subs with my NBLs (and even with the DBLs if I'm using those) for movies only, not for music, but if you can't get n-Subs then I'd suggest that you look at sealed box subs ... I always find ported subs get a bit flatulent when the going gets tough.

Phil

Odd .. I used to run an n-Cent with my nibbles and didn't find that it was that bad ... You do definitely need "as good as or better than your main speakers" amplification for the centre though otherwise it will fall behind.

Phil

Well done Simon! That'll work an absolute treat with your main speakers. Before buying my Axess I ran a Kef top-of-the tree Centre (whose model no. escapes me now) & the Axess was in a completely different class. It started off partnering my SBLs, then my SL2s and finally my DBLs and it's worked well with all of them.

Phil, I'm intrigued to note you run subs with your DBLs. As part of the quid pro quo deal with SWMBO over getting the DBLs through the door I had to get rid of my nSubs, and although the Dibbles go DEEP I still fancy trying a sub or two for movie effect. I'd be very interested in learning more of your experiences with subs & DBLs for home cinema use.

I'm sure you know my email address...

Phil

I am really rather pleased with finding an Axess so quickly, to put it mildly. Will probably still look out to see if an Axcent ever pops up, I can just about accommodate one, but a sub will probably come first.

The thought of dual nSubs with DBL's is rather scary! I have a suspicion my neighbours are probably going to hate my movie watching already, luckily in a semi with very thick concrete walls.

Hoping to have the Axess next week, looking forward to setting that up and enjoying some good quality movie watching/listening.

Simon

So my Axess arrived yesterday from Germany. After finally working out how to get it out of the box, some serious packaging Naim did there, put in place, wired up to the Pioneer and ran the setup routine, again. One of the dogs really hate's the tones that the receiver put's out to calibrate!

Anyway, got out the Blu-ray of Apocalypse Now, and OMG, what a revelation. I thought the little Wharfedale was OK, but suddenly realised how poor it was, in comparison . A whole new presence on the centre channel, what a difference. Dialogue is clearer, movement from side to side is clearer and much more obvious. It also surprised me that it seemed to improve the front to back effect as well.

At the weekend I did try removing the Wharfedale and running a phantom centre channel, which I found unconvincing, and to be fair to the little speaker, for it's price (120 euros), it wasn't bad, and if running a separate surround system and not wanting to break the bank, the Wharfedale Diamond 10 series speakers are pretty decent.

The clear thing is that the front L/R/Centre speakers must be tonally matched. As I have only used the IBL's for surrounds, I am not sure if the same is true there, but having 5 Naim speakers in the room is fun!

My girlfriend jokingly said last night that she can see me ending up with the NBL's as surround speakers at some point in the future! Now there is a thought, DBL fronts, NBL surrounds, IBL's as side channels and the Axess in the middle!!! Unfortunately I don't think my living room could accommodate all that, so I guess I will need to forget about the IBL's as side channels

As a side note, the DTS-Master HD encoding on Apocalypse Now is amazing, it's a great surround track. Helicopters were coming from every direction, perfectly co-coordinated with what was on the screen. Also the jungle scenes had various bits of wildlife all over the place, very convincing.

Simon  

*chuckle* Been there ... my landlord and his wife (I rent someone's roof) went on holiday to Cuba for a month and while they were away I did set up dibble fronts with a pair of n-Subs, axent centre, nibble rears and n-Cent centre-rear. It was fun and I *WISH* I still had photos (lost on an iPhone that decided to go skydiving without a parachute ).

But on a serious note, the rears don't take that much advantage of being big full-range speakers (even on Dolby Digital and HD Audio soundtracks) I think your IBLs as rears will be working very very well in that setup.

Very glad that you like your Axess - good find!

Phil

I get the impression the Axess is more of a tonal match for the discontinued speakers already mentioned above - Allaes, IBLs, SBLs, SL2s and DBLs rather than Naim's new range of BMR based Ovators?  

So your advice for an Ovator would be...?

I understood from Richard and others that the Axess should still work fine with the Ovators but given its rare appearence on the 2nd hand market I am more than happy to look into alternatives.

I've been looking for a center as well to match Ovators. So far looks wise i like the audio physics celsius 25. Have to try one to see if they match sonically though.

Arjan,

please report if you do the testing anytime soon.