Mac Mini For Streaming

I would consider as a minimum an early 2009 mini a dual core 2ghz one.

Not really just about the streaming, but these devcies can take the latest OS which will eventually all go 64bit etc as well as being able to take new SSD because its sata and a couple of video output options as well.

If you are considering connecting it optically then i would look for a later model Mac Mini - one that does not have a built in CD drive. These have an improved optical out with very low jitter. You could then connect it to your SuperNait using the Supernova 6 optical cable. 

If you go for an older one with CD drive then you should consider a hiFace or Halide Bridge to connect it. If you do this then use an external Firewire HDD rather than one on the USB.

You may want to ensure it can run the latest OSX to assure you can use the latest software ... 

Hi

I have a slot-loading Mini with dual core 2.53 Ghz processor, 4Gb RAM. It is used to stream (wired) to a SuperUniti and connected via a HiFace as well. I prefer being able to rip CDs using the Mini itself (not an option on the newer ones but not a major inconvenience).

The music is stored externally on a 750Gb G-Drive mini (no need for a power supply, power via mini) so I ripped out the 320Gb HD and replaced it with a 60Gb SSD - it is only used for music. It is headless and I view what is going on via ScreenShare when I need to on my iMac/MacBook. Mini is set up to rip and then eject CD. Easy. All works really well.

Regards

Neil

Thanks guys,

I must admit, i do prefer the thought of having a slot loader so that as Neil says, insert cd, rip and eject... and all controllable via screen share on my mbp. (why do you have your music stored on an external fw hd drive?)

Any particular reason a 'HiFace' is recommended?

Oh, and i will be adding an Ndac soon.

Still learning!

External HD as easier to increase capacity (getting inside a Mini is not too difficult but not for the fainthearted!) and wanted to keep OS and music files completely separate - the original HD was only 320Gb and filled fairly quickly with ALAC. External was the easy option.

HiFace was considered a fairly cheap improvement for USB to SPDIF reducing jitter. I have RCA but BNC is better apparently. I hardly ever play the Mini via the USB but is good for my free Spotify account or if the network is down and uPnP is not available.

Hang fire on the nDAC, see what the SuperNait can do first. May be enough for you. 

Neil

The older Mac Mini has a standard Cirrus Logical audio chip - the newer one has a custom version of the chip. Also removing the CD means less contention. So the jitter is very much lower with the newer model. 

However, you can avoid the Cirrus Logic audio chip by using a hiFace  - this lowers the jitter to almost the same levels as the newer model. It also provides galvanic isolation, so the rubbish generated by the computer gets left behind even though it is not optical and only the PCM music gets through. It will also support high resolution. 

Using a firewired disc for your music gives the hiFace exclusive use of USB and so the feed to hiFace is dedicated.

if using iTunes then get the Bit Perfect app as this sits in the background and optimises the playback chain ... Most importantly it matches the sampling rate of inout to output, which iTunes doesn't. You can set it manually, but as BP costs less than a CD then why mess about with settings. BP will also make best use of RAM and has a few tricks that are beneficial. Using memory for playback makes everything a bit quieter.

if you use an iPad then get two free apps: Apple Remote and VNC. These will let you control your music and access the system in general for software updates without using an external keyboard and screen. However, if you are attaching it to a screen then you may want to consider a model with HDMI as this makes it easy and a wireless keyboard and the magic trackball lets you do it from your armchair. 

As with all these things, it is a matter of deciding what you need and how much you want to spend ... Remember the digital world changes fast and on a newer Mac Mini you can use software like Audrivana to play DSD streams through the Supernait ... which may or may not matter.

Wow...

My head really hurts now!

So, in essence i could do with getting a newer mini, but that would also involve getting a stand alone HDD for ripping, but should sound much better.

If i went for an earlier mini with a built in drive, i would be best to get a HiFace to eliminate any noise created by the internals?

And finally, whichever route i take, i need to get BitPerfect.

Does that sound correct?

I was hoping this was going to be easy

Yes ...  You've got it. 

It is easier to do than write about and the results are superb. 

Ok!

And is there a reputable source for purchasing a HiFace if i go that route?

The only place i have found is that auction site.

M2Tech manufacture the HiFace and have an online store. There is a UK distributor. A newer better version is also available.

Neil

In my opinion, if you want to get a Mini, then use iTunes. If you want to use another ripping engine and playback, then get a PC, IMO. I have a MAC Mini with unmodified iTunes.

Then get a suitable DAC. You may feed this via optical or USB. If you get a DAC able to receive USB [preferably asynchronous USB] you will remove the need for a USB to SPIDF converter. Alternatively you may simply connect to a suitable DAC via optical.

I use the asynch USB method for choice.

ATB from George

I use a Mac Mini with inbuilt cd drive. The last model before removed. I simply put in the cd, told the Mini to rip and eject, using iTunes for replay. The internal disc was full quite fast so I have now connected a Lacie 2TB firewire disc to the Mini. Mini is set up to use the external disc for storage.

I use Hiface BNC and Naim DC-1 into the Dac using remote on iPad, iPhone. It all works fine. I have compared Hiface to optical (plastic) and there`s no contest, in advantage Hiface USB.

Don`t intend to hijack this thread, it may interest starter? I have now purchased a Synology NAS with two 3TB discs. I will rip through XLD and use Mini for replay. What program do I use for that? iTunes?

Wow, thanks for all the help chaps.

I have actually just got hold of an NDac, so if i got for an early mini, i will be connecting via the best method, which, from what i have read and understood, will be HiFace - BNC via Naim digital cable.

Here is a video ... that I have started a little way in because we are not so interested in the discussion about the DAC, but about Bit Perfect .... this shows you what it does. It doesn't interfere with iTunes - just makes it work the way it should do. Once installed/configured (a few minutes) you won't know it is there. 

hiFace BNC with Naim DC1 is an excellent choice ... though you could contact Mark Grant Cables for an alternative digital cable for the hiFace

The hiFace provides an asynchronous USB to S/PDIF and is ideal for a set-up with the older Mac Mini (please double check the OSX version you are running though ... Snow Leopard or later is ideal). Click here for a list of hiFace distributors 

iTunes is a perfectly good ripper, but I use XLD (which is free) because it takes more care and provides a report telling you it has done a perfect job (by perfect I mean it matches the ideal rip according to the Accurate Rip database). There is a thread showing you how to set it up and, once again, it works seamlessly with iTunes. You can also use it to turn downloaded FLAC into ALAC without which iTunes cannot play your downloads from some sites. 

Hope this is of help, Guy

As you have the older Mac Mini, it should sound better with the hiFace - the jitter differences are easily measurable - always good to know theory matches what you can hear (it doesn't always). With the new Mac Mini, optical out is remarkable (even though it looks the same as the old one)

I would just treat the Synology NAS as a external DIsk - as you are using your LaCie. If you are using iTunes now then that is the way to go ... if you have a Naim streamer such as the UQ then I would use nStream and not use the Mac Mini ... the Mac Mini is ideal if you are using the Naim DAC (or another DAC). 

All the best, Guy 

Ok, i think i have this sussed now, although i might have to wait for the HIFACE for now.

The uk distributor does not list the hf2, so ill give them a call in the new year.

The MG digital cable looks good to me.

Whether there is a massive sonic difference between that and the dc1, ill just have to wait and see!

Is there any reason why AIFF is commonly used?

> Is there any reason why AIFF is commonly used?

If using iTunes then your lossless choices are AIFF and ALAC ... they have exactly the same music data, but ALAC is compressed in the same way a zip file is compressed. 

Using a Mac Mini - it will extract the PCM music data from both and send this to your DAC. If you use ALAC then this takes about 8% of the CPU load (depends on the CPU, of course) and AIFF takes about 7% as no decompression is needed. [These are my measurements and I have not had anybody verify them]. 

In both cases identical bundles of music data are sent asynchronously to the hiFace. The hiFace then delivers them to a buffer in the Naim DAC with very low jitter. In both cases the buffer gets exactly the same music data. The Naim DAC then plays it from the buffer. I cannot hear any difference. 

[With other DACs the process may different and there may be differences. With Naim streamers the process is different]. 

You can use XLD or iTunes to turn AIFF into ALAC and back again and nothing changes. Try both and decide if you can hear a difference ... use the one you like best: I use ALAC. If you have enough disk space you may want to use AIFF, if not then ALAC.

And again...

I thank you.

Excellent detailed post.

Im sure i will have more questions once the mini gets here

Guido's post is always as details isn't it?

Quote:  if you use an iPad then get two free apps: Apple Remote and VNC.

Guy, which iPad app for vnc do you recommend? There seem to lots of vnc apps for ipad

Rob

Screens is not free but it's the best VNC ap I have found

I use Mocha VNC.

Thanks Guy

I intend to use Mac Mini as a source, but want my NAS setup, rip and server function to be as prepared for a Naim streamer as possible. I have the NDac with 555PS and have considered a UServe, but have found I want to solve this by using the Mac. I dont even know what format to use yet, so it will be learning by doing. until Now I use ALAC. 

Sorry again for this step aside 

Best S

Using the newest (and lowest spec) Mac Mini bought around Xmas.  The unit is inside a quadraspire cabinet with a glass door and is totally silent with the door closed - and only barely audible if you put your ear on the unit.  Using optical cable to feed into a SuperUniti at the moment and running the latest XBMC (Frodo/v12) as a front end with the Mini plugged into the TV over HDMI.

All music (FLACs) and video is stored on a QNAP NAS 'hosted' in a different room.

Network is over Netgear Powerline 500's ... getting a reported 150-300Mb/s depending on the time of day.

Pros:

- can't tell the difference between mac mini->optical->SU's built in DAC vs. SU streamer directly although more tests pending.  This is as expected as the streamer just shuffles bits and bytes around.

- get a *way way way* better interface than the Naim app on an iPad with XBMC on a big TV

- get a second XBMC interface on a Google Nexus 7 with full album art etc.. and an onscreen remote

- get a third XBMC interface on my Android smartphone that acts as a remote and music/video library browser/selector as above

- also get video so TV, movie, youtube if you like that kind of thing plus loads of other sources via plugins to XBMC

- get excellent artist and album cover and fanart and info

- get playlists and party mode for extended playing (maybe you can do this on the SU+iPad app but haven't found out how if you can)

Cons:

- an extra box

- SU streamer could become redundant

- SU radio seems to have a better selection of stations (although I haven't played with any of the XBMC radio plugins yet) and displays the station+trackname

All this is done in the last week so opinions are still forming but at first pass it looks like it could be a winner from a human interface perspective, loads of extra functionality and no drop in sound quality (that I can perceive so far).

Best from scm