Just not feeling the love :: NDX

Posted by: intothevoid on 17 June 2013

So here I am, the proud new owner of an ex-dem NDX and, frankly, I'm just not getting it.

 

I've been using a Sonos ZP90 via a DC1 in to the SN DAC for the last couple of years and have been very happy with it, albeit with a nagging doubt that there is more to be heard.

 

So I took the plunge and bough an ex-dem NDX from those very nice people at Signals; a 2012 model with 24/192 capability.

 

The NDX is sitting on full-fat Fraim, powered via a Power-Line and connected to the SN with a Hi-Line (rest of system in my profile).

 

The NDX has been powered up for the last two weeks and runs quite warm to the touch. I spent the first week just playing music in the background but not really listening. This last week I have been sitting down and listening more critically…

 

The first thing to say is that the NDX produces more information. I'm hearing things that have never been there before. I'm also listening louder than before, I guess because of the lower noise floor - proper 'inky blackness' to the quiet bits.

 

These two things are good, in a hi-fi kind of way. What's not good, and what is bothering me, is that the music is flat and lifeless. It's like the musicians are playing the notes but their minds are elsewhere. Vocalists sound disinterested. There is no boogie factor.

 

This is not what I was expecting.

 

Has the law of diminishing returns set in with a vengeance? Have I inadvertently come to the end of my upgrade path? (There's no point upgrading further if the returns are so minuscule).

Posted on: 19 June 2013 by Bart
Originally Posted by intothevoid:

Played JL's 'Imagine' and SWMBO remarked that it was the best she has heard yet, so must be on the right track (forgive the pun).

 

Do not discount this evidence   Sometimes we get our heads and minds around the hardware "questions" so much that it is hard to be objective about what we hear.  Your wife is making more of a "blind" assessment -- she likely (maybe...hopefully?!?!?) is right. 

Posted on: 19 June 2013 by ragman
Originally Posted by Bart:
Originally Posted by intothevoid:

Played JL's 'Imagine' and SWMBO remarked that it was the best she has heard yet, so must be on the right track (forgive the pun).

 

Do not discount this evidence   Sometimes we get our heads and minds around the hardware "questions" so much that it is hard to be objective about what we hear.  Your wife is making more of a "blind" assessment -- she likely (maybe...hopefully?!?!?) is right. 

Bart,

 

you are really a guy knowing a lot of the psycological aspects of hifh end and women .........

Posted on: 19 June 2013 by Hook
Originally Posted by Bart:
Originally Posted by intothevoid:

Played JL's 'Imagine' and SWMBO remarked that it was the best she has heard yet, so must be on the right track (forgive the pun).

 

Do not discount this evidence   Sometimes we get our heads and minds around the hardware "questions" so much that it is hard to be objective about what we hear.  Your wife is making more of a "blind" assessment -- she likely (maybe...hopefully?!?!?) is right. 

 

This is some of the best advice I've heard to date on this forum.  Whether it's your SO, a good friend, or a trusted dealer, enlisting a second pair of ears to help assess the impact of changes and/or potential upgrades can be invaluable.  

 

Yes, at the end of the day, trusting what your own ears tell you (versus the opinions of others, or even versus published reviews with objective measurements) is important.  But, to use the old Reagan cold-war philosophy, it is always best to "trust, but verify".  

 

Mrs. Hook has been my #1 blind test subject over the years. In most cases, she has verified that my sighted impressions were correct. But every once in a while, she'll hear things very differently. And almost every time that has happened, I have been guilty of over thinking and over analyzing.  Funny how she, with no real knowledge of (or interest in) in the audio hardware, is able to more easily focus on musicality. Fortunately for me, she can play multiple instruments, and has always had a very good ear for pitch, rhythm and harmonies. She can usually tell pretty quickly whether my tinkering has made our setup more (or less) melodious.

 

ATB.

 

Hook

Posted on: 19 June 2013 by intothevoid

Bart, Ragman, Hook - I couldn't agree more.

 

I've always found that, because I expect changes, I'm the least qualified person to objectively measure or experience them.

 

SWMBO has the ability to listen without expectation so is a very trusted and reliable judge.

Posted on: 19 June 2013 by murkku
Originally Posted by Simon-in-Suffolk:

Hi Allen, perhaps there is large NDX sample to sample variation. I definitely prefer the sound of the NDX on its own as opposed to under another PSU (specifically 555PS). It just sounds right, organic, warm and has a lovely bounce on its own. Yes the dynamics and frequency extremes are slightly constrained but that IMO really plays to the NDX's musical strengths. This is my expierience with 'my early production run NDX' with upgraded streamer board running 3.17 feeding into a 282/Hicap2.

I couldn't agree more with you, Simon.

 

As some may recall, I originally had nDAC/XPS2 (into 252/250.2), but after a few weeks of home audition I decided to purchase the NDX. Even with the awful early days of nStream, it didn't take long before I sold the nDAC as I felt NDX/XPS2 was a better combo than NDX/nDAC/XPS2. This was spring 2011 or so.

 

I've since had the NDX upgraded to 24/192 board and sold the XPS2, too. And while my streaming "downgrade" may have been partly influenced by my love for vinyl replay, there's no denying that the bare NDX/PL/Hi-Line is a sweet music maker and a rhytmic beast on it's own.

 

Cheers,

M

Posted on: 20 June 2013 by intothevoid

ok, this is interesting. Playing with JRiver - I have somehow configured it to transcode to 24bit WAV, and it sounds a whole lot better.

Posted on: 21 June 2013 by gert

Does it make a difference to completely turn off the network configuration and play a track directly from an USB stick?