DIY streamer

Posted by: sjt on 21 August 2013

First post!
 
I have a Dac V1 and a NAP 100 on order (looking forward to them turning up) and I am thinking about making a streamer to take advantage of the USB input on the dac. I currently use a squeezebox touch that gets its tunes over a wireless network from a server box, and the squeezebox is connected to my existing dac via coaxial SPDIF. I am wondering if I can improve on the serving aspect of this in terms of sound by making a streamer out of a raspberry pi. (I can't afford a naim streamer at the moment!)
 
I understand that it is better to avoid wireless serving of the tunes (not sure why though), but it is difficult to for me to make a wired network, so I am thinking about having a hard disk with my tunes on it connected direct to the raspi, and the raspi connected direct to the dac via usb. This way, the processing of the raspi should be light when serving the tunes to the usb dac - simply pulling them off the local disk (transcoding?) and directing them to the usb port connected to the dac. All my tunes are flacs, so I am guessing the raspi would have to transcode to a stream that the dac can understand - correct? I dont know how much load this would put on the raspi.
 
I would use wireless network to rsync the tunes onto the raspi's disk from my main server and for remote control.
 
I did a bit of searching and there are a couple of operating systems dedicated to streaming that look good:
raspyfi
 
picoreplayer
 
I would try both of these to see which is best. One is confirmed to work with the dac v1, and the other says it can handle asynchronus usb so it should be OK with the dac v1.
 
I reckon I could do all this relatively cheaply - I would need a raspi, a usb disk, a wireless usb plug, a usb hub and a power supply, plus a few cables. 
 
I am quite comfortable with doing things like installing the operating systems and hacking a raspberry pi, but I dont know much about the demands and considerations of serving to a usb stream. So some questions:
 
  • Does the plan sound like it would provide a gain over wireless streaming?
  • Is there anything wrong with the plan? Are there any things I should look out for?
Thanks for any advice from experts here!
Posted on: 21 August 2013 by ragman
Originally Posted by sjt:
First post!
 
I have a Dac V1 and a NAP 100 on order (looking forward to them turning up) and I am thinking about making a streamer to take advantage of the USB input on the dac. I currently use a squeezebox touch that gets its tunes over a wireless network from a server box, and the squeezebox is connected to my existing dac via coaxial SPDIF. I am wondering if I can improve on the serving aspect of this in terms of sound by making a streamer out of a raspberry pi. (I can't afford a naim streamer at the moment!)
 
I understand that it is better to avoid wireless serving of the tunes (not sure why though), but it is difficult to for me to make a wired network, so I am thinking about having a hard disk with my tunes on it connected direct to the raspi, and the raspi connected direct to the dac via usb. This way, the processing of the raspi should be light when serving the tunes to the usb dac - simply pulling them off the local disk (transcoding?) and directing them to the usb port connected to the dac. All my tunes are flacs, so I am guessing the raspi would have to transcode to a stream that the dac can understand - correct? I dont know how much load this would put on the raspi.
 
I would use wireless network to rsync the tunes onto the raspi's disk from my main server and for remote control.
 
I did a bit of searching and there are a couple of operating systems dedicated to streaming that look good:
 
raspyfi
 
picoreplayer
 
I would try both of these to see which is best. One is confirmed to work with the dac v1, and the other says it can handle asynchronus usb so it should be OK with the dac v1.
 
I reckon I could do all this relatively cheaply - I would need a raspi, a usb disk, a wireless usb plug, a usb hub and a power supply, plus a few cables. 
 
I am quite comfortable with doing things like installing the operating systems and hacking a raspberry pi, but I dont know much about the demands and considerations of serving to a usb stream. So some questions:
 
  • Does the plan sound like it would provide a gain over wireless streaming?
  • Is there anything wrong with the plan? Are there any things I should look out for?
Thanks for any advice from experts here!

Cool

 

Keep us informed.

IMHO control by an IPAD or Samsung Pad is a must!

Posted on: 21 August 2013 by SamS

Hi and welcome sjt,

 

I would not be in such a hurry to ditch the SB Touch if I were you. Assuming you have robust wi-fi and do not currently experience drop outs etc., then at least initially sticking with the SBT might make some sense.

 

If you were not already aware there is a simple software mod for the SBT that turns its USB 'in' into an ascynchronous USB out + allows output from all digital outs up to 192kHz/24bit. The mod is easy to install and easily reversible.  Look at the Squeezebox forum for more information, under:

 

User Forums > Squeezebox Touch > Announce: Enhanced Digital Output app - USB Dac and 192k Digital Ouput

 

According to the EDO compatability list accessed from the above thread, it would appear the Naim DAC-V1 is compatible with this mod (can anyone here confirm?) - so no harm trying it before you go building streamers.

But even if it didn't work via USB I am sure the sound via COAX or Toslink would be great. The EDO app is said to improve all the digital outs - not sure why but some of it may be due to shutting down the SBT's analog out which becomes inoperative as a result of installing the app.

 

I currently use my SBT with EDO via USB into a Micromega MyDAC with excellent results.

 

I have never tried it myself, but hanging a large hard drive off a streamer may not be optimal. From what I have read this is certainly the case with the SBT as reading a large library and serving it up does in fact use quite a bit of resource and results in slow and unreliable operation with the SBT. The raspi may be different, but I wouldn't bank on it.

 

Enjoy your new kit.

I would love to hear how the DAC-V1 sounds with an SBT, but I am currently content and lazy.

Let us know how you get on.

 

Sam

 

 

 

 

Posted on: 21 August 2013 by likesmusic

I've got the EDO USB mods for my SBT working - an extra payoff is that your Touch will then do 24/192 over s/pdif. I think the author of the EDO plugin, aka "Triode" is working on some kind of Raspberry Pi SBT replacement so you could hunt around the forums. Sorry can't post links on here as it's against the site rules. The computeraudiophile website also has an interesting article on "How to build a Beaglebone Black MPD Music Server" which might give you some ideas, and having a look at the Beaglebone community might give you some other leads. Another possibility, if you had the inclination and resoures, might be to get an Audivo EMAS module.

 

But I have to say that if you wanted to stream, why did you buy a DAC-V1 as opposed to something with integral streaming capability?

Posted on: 21 August 2013 by sjt

Thanks for the very useful replies so far. I did not know about the enhanced digital out of the squeezebox, and I think this changes things significantly in favour of giving the squeezebox a further go. I read somewhere that the usb input on the dac v1 is the best one because it is async and uses the clock inside the dac, and this is the reason I want to try the usb input on the dac.

 

I have applied the EDO patch to my SBT but I can't test it at the moment as I dont have an amp (my old one broke and that is why I am waiting for a nap 100 and a dac v1). I will report when the gear shows up.

 

I take the point about attaching a disk direct to a raspi may give it some processor stress in serving. (I am guessing the transcoding from the flacs to the digital stream is what takes the effort). The beaglebone music server also looks interesting. It seems this device is more powerful than the raspi so it may have the grunt to do this.

 

I think also I will research the reasons why people say wired ethernet is better than wireless (I think one reason is noise caused by the wireless section in the stream receiver being on).

 

I didnt know I should not post links and I cannot edit my original post. That will learn me to read the terms and conditions! Hopefully a moderator will remove the links.

 

Thanks again

Posted on: 21 August 2013 by Simon-in-Suffolk

Sjt, it's only commercial links and links to other forums that are not allowed. Links to educational resources and non commercial resources are allowed as long as it is not relating to the modification of Naim equipment. (from what I have learnt from the rules and over the years).

 

The RaspberryPi is austensibly an educational resource so I think you are safe, unless the links refer to commercial software on the Pi.

 

I frequently post advisory and educational links on the forum it's what keeps this forum a great place and above the others out there.

Simon