Looking to Upgrade - but What?

Get an NDX, swallow your prejudices and get an iPad. All the Powerlines in the world won't make up for source deficiencies. Of course, you already know that.

Thank you for the advice.  I know that it's the NDX I want but I've got to justify spending > 10x more to replace the SB Touch which works well ... and sacrificing the ease of access throughout the house, too.

Would the sound improvement be that great, particularly as my FLAC lossless library was not ripped with a Naim device?

We do have one iPad ... 

Hi MusicMad,

The NDX will be great and worth spending. 

Ripping music to Flac can be done with any decent tool (i.e. DbPoweramp);  the quality of the ripped files doesn't have anything to do with a Naim piece used or not.

i don not understand your fear against QNAP working together with the NDX. This works flawlessly. Maybe you are pointing at Twonky, the upnp software that is often used on a QNAP (but also on other brands). If you do not like Twonky, simply use another upnp software.

i would ask your dealer to try an NDX at home. 

Cheers,

iver

Musicmad: Have you tried a linear PSU with your SB Touch? You may be surprised the improvement it brings.You sound happy with your current set-up. By going to a NDX you will loose a lot of system functionality and convenience. IMHO I would upgrade with great caution and care.

I'd vote for the nDAC. The digital streaming stuff is commodity - the DAC is where the rubber hits the road.

If you can, listen to the SBT into the Naim DAC.  NDX is a more compact solution, but you may decide to keep the SBT and plug it into the NDX anyway, if you want to use Spotify.  I quite liked the NDX, but did not think it sounded much better than the SBT, both into the Naim DAC bare.  I did not have time to test the NDX without the DAC.

Nick

As far as I know nothing can match the functionality and convenience of the Touch.

Personally - spending 10x the amount of the Touch to improve SQ by 10% while losing that convenience is not worthwhile.

I love this description. Yes, nDAC is considered an upgrade component to all naim streamers except NDS and this speaks a lot!

Let me add something into the mix.

I was faced with a similar issue, and cautiously purchased a second hand linn sneaky.

comparing the analog outputs of both, sounds to me that the sneaky is better, after spending some time doing A/B with both.

The SBT seems to me bright and digital, and lacks some refinement. 

The Linn on the other hand is fine, detailed, and sounds like a product made by a real hi fi company. Still not ideal, and not refined enough for an amp at the 202/HCDR/200 level. Lacks dynamics. One side by side audition compared to an ADS is enough to walk away from a sneaky.

SBT vs Sneaky : I don't miss my SBT that much, and am looking to go for either NDAC, NDX, NDS or an Akurate DS or maybe even a KDS, when I have the chance to audition these side by side.

WTGR the OP is, wisely, already using the SBT digital output so the SQ of the analogue output isn't relevant. I can't comment on the SQ of the SuperNait digital inputs but the DAC-V1 works wonders on the SB Duet and the Touch is rated a better device but I'm using a quality linear PSU as well which definitely helps.

Obviously the SBT analogue output is very limited.

A good DAC evens things out considerably sound-wise.

There is the audiophilleo USB to SPDIF convertor also, which can use the SBT EDO USB output.

expensive, but much cheaper than NDX or NDAC.

Wow, thanks to all for the considered replies.

Things have moved on ... owing to my local dealer having shut-up shop nearly a year ago, today we went to the next nearest: 90 mile round-trip.  Yes, I could have arranged a demo but given the different surroundings just how informative would this be ... and I couldn't see the dealership loaning me such equipment to test at home.  So, undecided ..

... I've ordered both the NDX and nDAC (I have a lovely wife!).

The question now is: do I try one without the other for a while so as to get two upgrades?

Delivery due late January so plenty of time to think about it.

Thanks again.

Is it Musicmad or Moneymad? I wish I had that kind of money to throw at something that I hadn't even demoed. Is that the way you make all your purchases? If you want a good home for your Touch give me a call

Thank you, Iver, for this info re: the QNAP ~ NAS connectivity.  My concern is largely due to my ignorance in such matters.  When I commenced streaming I did so from WMA Lossless files on a HD drive (USB connected to my PC) which I streamed wirelessly to the SB Touch.  I suffered numerous drop-outs and the HD would often go to sleep.

I had an ethernet cable installed which dealt with first problem and then bought the QNAP NAS, running the LMS software.  But my research told me that I had to convert all of my WMA files as the QNAP would not recognise them.  I've converted them to FLAC lossless using foobar2000 which is easy apart from the tags and I've spent many hours correcting these.

I am worried that I may have to undertake another conversion if the NDX does not recognise the QNAP FLAC Lossless files ...

Cheers,

Mitch

I hope I disagree with you but time will tell!

Mitch

Mad?  Yes ... but I'm taking a lot on trust.  Naim has provided me with much pleasure these last nine years and I shall be surprised if I don't get some benefit from the upgrades.

I did buy my last two cars without test driving them ... 

Mitch

Sorry, but I don't know what you mean by "a linear PSU".

Mitch

Yes, we have one iPad in the house ... the next upgrade may be the purchase of a second one!  I've held off buying an NDX for a few years because of the lack of an Android app ...

... and watched the price of the NDX rise faster than the interest on my savings.

I keep hoping that Naim will release an Android app.

Mitch

The nDAC removes jitter, so you could feed it with a piece of wobbly wet string held by a recovering alcoholic and it will still sound great.

Louis-Andre is spot-on. You were obviously just looking for a Naim solution which I suppose if that is what you want, and can afford, then so be it. Me I've got no brand loyalty whether it's hi-fi or washing machine or anything else. I bought the DAC-V1/NAP100 because, at that particular price point, I believed it represented excellent value for money and I did demo other options. SBT + Linear PSU = approx. £500-600. NDX + nDAC = approx. £5,000 and people are saying the SBT solution is at the very least comparable. What was that recent thread titled "is there a Naim cult"? I think we know the answer but being a member comes at a price (Can I say that here?)

Well, the NDX has been up and running for three days now and I'm enjoying the improved sound detail immensely.

The SBTouch (digital into the SN) provided excellent results ... so good that I had to seriously question the need to change ... but so far, without a doubt, the NDX (analogue DIN into SN) is a better, all-involving, sound.

The lack of functionality as compared with the SBTouch, though, is another matter.  I'm using TwonkyMedia (on the QNAP NAS) and find it less than inspiring, not helped by the NDX display/iPad app ... More research/enquiries required there.

And, when I dismantle the Fraim and rebuild, I shall incoporate the Naim DAC so maybe (hopefully!) further sound improvements forthcoming!

Mitch

Mitch, if you haven't done so already, turn off the digital output, disable any unused inputs and set the display to turn off. Some icing on a very fine cake.