Taking up guitar and having a lot of fun

That is awesome Jonathan - glad to hear you are enjoying it, making progress, and having fun.  It is a cool thing when you play a famous riff and people react to it in a positive way. Or you finally play along with an old favorite, or learn to play something that you previously thought was out of reach.

Very pretty color on your guitar - I think Yamaha makes really good VFM instruments.

However, do I understand that you are somehow playing the guitar through the Naim via the Playstation?  I hope not because that will be a recipe for Naim (or speaker) disaster.  But forgive me if I misunderstand, since I am out of touch with how the guitar game/program operates.

As for learning to play guitar in 60 days...well I have been at it for over 45 years and I still haven't learned to play!

Good for you.

My wife bought me one a few years ago with great intentions for both of us. Alas, time and perseverance (not forgetting having no natural talent) are in short supply while working and balancing kids/family life. Some time though, some time...

Tony,

Your comment certainly made me chuckle but I don't think Forcione has much to worry about just yet!!

Dr Mark - I am playing the game which includes guitar sounds and the backing music through the naim yes but not being excessive with the volume - if I want to play loud I have the Laney for that although I'm not good enough to warrant it yet!  The guitar basically plug into the Playstation via a guitar jack to USB cable and then the playstation is rigged into the home cinema system as normal with the NAP250 driving the SBL's at the front and the Pioneer AV amp driving the surround channels and sub as is normal for movie watching.  To be honest someone like you who can really play would I think love it - check this out for some idea of how it works and what's possible:

I

I actually think this is the finest piece of gaming or music software I have ever seen - it is quite simply amazing... Jonathan

Hi Jonathan,

There's nothing for it but endless practice, I'm afraid, but I found staring at "play guitar" manuals quite boring, and not very stimulating.

Have a bash at this one, 

http://www.guitarpracticedperfectly.com/ 

It's online, and moves with you as you progress. It does cost though, and I'm sure there's probably lots of free ones out there on the net.

Get together with a friend who already plays, as there's nothing better than that lightbulb moment when you realise that you're playing music, rather than just practicing alone. That's what spurs you on to continue regular practice.

Oh, and don't worry about the aching fingers, it'll pass  !

Aw ra best,

Dave.

Yes, Jonathan.

Practice, practice, practice...

Enjoy your new toy.  Just don't do what I did and rapidly acquire another 3 of the instruments.  

You'll find that you seem to stick at a point in your progress for a while, and then suddenly make a significant leap in your skills.  Don't know why that happens, but after a while some things just 'click'.

I would also recommend professional guitar lessons.  If nothing else they will actually make you practice so that you don't seem like a complete p*ll**k at your next lesson.

I'm not usually an impulse buyer but you've sold it to me. I've had guitars for 20 odd years but never played seriously so I hope this gives me the motivation to pick it up more often. I'll let you know how I get on.

Would strongly recommend a couple of lessons, i have been playing for 20 years and take a couple from time to time. You get direction and new ideas from another person. Sometimes one or two sessions is enough, and you can take time to learn and develop what you have been shown.

playing guitar is like climbing under your own steam, and then sooner or later you get to a plateau, and thats the time to get some help to get you climbing again.

playing with others is also good to train yourself to listen. i have heard lots of great guitarists who just fall apart in a group setting, because they don't have ears for timing and other instruments

don't underestimate the importance of guitar theory, knowing your scales and modes really opens up the fretboard.

good luck and enjoy!

Many thanks for all the encouragement guys and for the pointer to the online stuff too

Definitely very interested in how you get on Redmires so keep us posted - I think you'll find it more fun than you can even imagine!

I am currently looking for a good guitar teacher - hopefully one with a rock leaning.  My experience many years ago with saxophone lessons was very dull and I recall tooting my way through too many traditional songs I didn't even want to be able to play and eventually losing interest.  I think that's where Rocksmith has scored with me because from day one I have been able to start playing bits of decent songs.  Tonight it was Rolling Stones 'Satisfaction' and REM 'Losing my religion' - I had to concede defeat on 'Sweet home Alabama' though!!

I bought the book  'Guitar for dummies' and a DVD on electric guitar by Fender to help brush up on theory although I have to keep pausing and rewinding the DVD because it moves on so fast.

I'm thoroughly enjoying it and hope that I'm able to get to where I want to be able to get to which is pretty much to be on the level of the guy in the Santana video posted above!  I find myself watching it and wondering how it's even humanly possible to move that fast and move around the guitar with that level of precision!

I think I'm even more in awe of the talent of great players now because I now know how hard it is!

Jonathan

It's not all about speed of movement. As an extremely average player it almost makes you want to give up completely when you see players like Richard Thompson, sounding like he is playing 3 or more guitars at once and, yet he hardly seems to move his right hand, and is fingering the lead and bass lines with the left.

Chaps

I have always been confident in my abilities and generally speaking, I usually do well at things if I put my mind to it.

In 2004 I decided to learn the guitar and bought a hand made Lowden from in Ireland. 

To cut a long story short, I took one to one lessons and after twelve weeks the tutor told me I was plain bloody useless and I was the worst pupil he had ever tried to teach in his nine years of experience.

I must admit since then, the guitar has remained in a box and if ever one of my family decides to take it up, they can have it as a gift.

Either you got it or you ain't and it completely deflated my ego.

Regards

Mick

Mick - you need Rocksmith!!  I was murdering Carlos Santana's stuff last night and it was great fun!  My wife did say (she was cooking in the next room) that there were times when she was struggling to work out whether it was Carlos or I playing!!  I'm not sure about that but I was certainly enjoying myself!!

J

Dear Mick,

I don't think that there is any reason to be despondent about not having a revealed musical playing talent.

We all have different talents, and I have zero talent with computers for example. As soon as try some additional software beyond the standard operating system package, then I run into trouble. 

When I bought a new MAC Mini a couple of years ago, I simply accepted my limitations, and put nothing on it that was not in the original operating system except iPhoto, which allows for simple cleaning up of old photo scans. 

When I decided to bite the bullet and learn the double bass - a strange choice most would think, given the awkwardness of the logistics involved - I really never thought I would be much use. Taking that low ambition, I surprised myself and delighted many more. I frequently hit technical brick-walls. I'd be stuck on something for weeks sometimes. 

The reason I kept at the practice, was because I knew that I could play in tune. On an instrument without frets, that is not exactly universal. Often this meant that I would rather be the only bass player than have to share the line with someone else who either could not - or did not care enough to bother to - play in tune. 

As soon as you are the only player on an instrumental line, the responsibility to keep the line going is complete. In my early days I was terribly nervous. I never quite lost this nervous element, though it was more or less controlled after ten years. Playing can be a great pleasure, but public performance requires so much concentration that enjoying it as you go along, is so rare in reality. No performance is so perfect that you can ever feel completely satisfied, though sometimes a performance with a few technical fluffs can still be a very good show for the audience. 

I find that fettling something mechanical like a classical design of bicycle gives me far more pleasure than playing music ever did! There is something very pleasing about a bike that is running so well that it is quieter than the sound of the tyres on the tarmac, and decent tyres ride almost completely silent!

As my playing matured, I had an issue with my left hand, and decided that the playing was over, even before anyone else noticed anything wrong. For me playing was either the best possible, or nothing. I prefer to listen to others nowadays rather than play, though I still have played a few concerts since I sold my bass in 2002.

I look back on my concert playing with more satisfaction in hindsight than I ever found in it at the time!

Fantastic memories, and even some of the recordings seem quite satisfactory by now, when the initial moments of stress are long since forgotten - almost all of them!

ATB from George

Hi Jonathan

Congratulations on your new hobby - a much safer bet for a midlife crisis than a motorbike!

I'very been playing guitar for about 20 years, and although I'm mostly self taught, agree with what's been said already about taking lessons. There are lots of learning resources out there and it's all to easy to get bogged down in information and not know what to do with it. Even a couple of lessons can point you in the right direction, and fill in gaps where you "don't know what you don't know". 

I actually post free lessons on my YouTube channel which may be of interest. If so, drop me a pm and I can give you some more info. (Moderators, hope this is not breaching any rules?)

Cheers

Matt

H Jonathan

I've enjoyed reading this thread having started to learn myself 3.5 years ago at the age of 45.  I tried learning a couple of instruments when I was at school and didn't get very far, so I always assumed that playing music was one of those things I could not do.

But one day I thought why not give it a go and like you am absolutely loving it.  It is very clear that I don't have any natural talent, but providing I put the hours in at practice I improve at just enough of a rate to encourage me to stick at it.

I started having lessons after about 6 months and would recommend it if you can find somebody you get on with.  He helped me progress faster than I was with the Dummies book by giving me exercises that really helped with technique, strength, etc.  We do a mix of things I want to do and things which are good for me but which I don't like (improvising for example).  Sometimes as well we talk about music and musicians and the techniques that different players have (which irritatingly he will then demonstrate flawlessly).

One thing I am verging on world class at is gear acquisition.  5 guitars, 3 amps and a overly large pedal board at the current moment!  My excuse is that part of what I'm interested in is learning how different players get their sounds and it is interesting to me to feel the differences between instruments. 

My tip for something to help the learning is an iOS app called Capo.  There are others that do the same thing but this has the nicest interface I have used.  It allows you to change the tempo of an imported track while keeping the pitch constant, or change pitch while keeping tempo constant.  And you can easily set up loops.  So basically allows you to slow something down and break it into sections to help you practice. 

David

I use Riffstation to change the temp without changing the pitch, and also to provide backing tracks for me to try the solos.

Thanks for the tips guys and I will certainly try Capo/Riffstation - my tutor had me trying to play 'Love me do' with the Beatles last week and I was falling behind from the first chord change so that could be very useful!! 

I have been going through a huge Beatles phase again of late and am just marvelling at their musical abilities.  I also sympathise with your gear acquisition issues because I find myself pondering the purchase of an Epiphone Casino and Vox Ac15 to try and get more of that Beatles twang and that's before I can really play anything from their repertoire properly.

The biggest issue I'm having at present is speeding up my chord changes but I have been doing the 1 minute drills from Justinguitar and have bought his introductory book which is quite good.  I have had a lot of fun playing the intro to 'There she goes' by the La's courtesy of one of his Youtube videos - so much so my wife is sick of hearing it!

Thanks again for the tips - it's a perfect winter hobby because all this rain means the push bike isn't coming out very often!

Jonathan

Justin guitar is very good, and he himself is a quite likeable instructor.  (In fact I just copped his version of Neil Diamond's "Sweet Caroline" a couple of weeks ago.)  Another Beatles song I would recommend for a beginner (although it is not really a Beatles song, but one of their covers) is Act Naturally.  I recommend this book:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Beat...dition/dp/0881887579

Most (definitely not all) are in key with the record, and at this point you won't find a lot that you are really able to play yet, but even though I also own the Beatles full scores book:

http://www.amazon.com/The-Beat...Scores/dp/0793518326

I find it easier to just pull out the first one and have some fun.  The first is just chords (fake books usually are) and the second is full tabs.

Unless your instrument is really holding you back (which from your description it is not...and scrolling up, I see it is a fine place to start) my strong recommendation is get an acoustic next.  Not only does it open up a whole different palate of songs for you to play, but it is more versatile than an electric.  I personally think everyone should learn on an acoustic first, but going the other way is certainly another valid approach. 

If you buy one, I would recommend going into the $300-500 range (obviously there may be deals to be had that override this; I am also speaking of new prices) because you will get a guitar that you won't outgrow.  Even if you got good enough to want a more expensive model, a guitar in that range can still be useful and playable forever.  If could be a "campfire guitar", whereas the $150 model would be useful to burn in the campfire once you got "too good" for it.

And as my teacher always told me, "Slow down!"  If speed kills, trying to play at speed when you are not yet capable does likewise.  And keep at it and have fun!

Hi Jonathan

Good to see you are still having fun.  Speeding up the chord changes is, unfortunately, only solved with lots of practice. I'm sure you will be getting good tips from your teacher. A couple of things that work for me:

Just practice the changes with your fretting hand.  Don't even bother strumming.  I found it a faster way to build up strength, flexibility and muscle memory - at least to start with on certain chord changes..

Maybe then progress to practicing the chord changes with a metronome.  So if you have three chords in a sequence you are trying to learn, play a bar of each with a metronome to keep you in time.  Start slow and speed up..  The metronome gives you a way to measure your progress which helps me (important given my slow progress!). 

On on the fear front, for playing at home, an AC15 will be very loud.  An AC4 will be more than sufficient.  For some of the tones that you want to get you will probably need to get the amp cranked up a bit, which at home volume levels is easier with less power.   I have an AC4 hand wired which sounds glorious.  

If if you happen to be in Surrey you would be welcome to come and try it..

david

The AC4 rather than the AC15 for home use is good advice.  I use Blackstar HT1 and HT5 at home, and the one watt HT1 goes VERY loud in a bedroom, and the 5 watt HT5 can be a little too powerful at times!   Why 2 amps? Well, it's useful when a friend comes round to jam with me.

Looking forward to being able to try out my new toy  - an Electro-Harmonix Wiggler - now that the hand clinic say I can soon begin to play again again as the splint on my left index mallet finger will not be needed after next week.

Thanks so much guys for all the advice and David thanks for the invitation to come and hear an AC4 - although I will leave it a while until I get to the point where I'm in less danger of embarassing myself if that's OK

As for the AC15 it's interesting to hear that it might be too loud for home use so it would be very interesting to hear an AC4 and the hand wired version certainly has a stellar reputation.  I'm using the Vox Valvetronix VT20+ at the moment and it's great apart from sounding a bit lightweight and lacking in warmth in my view.  I don't tend to play it hugely loud when practicing but it does have to work fairly hard when I'm playing Rocksmith stuff and using it in parallel with the Naim/AV system.  I find it really helpful to hear what I'm really doing through the guitar amp because I feel if you just listen to Rocksmith's interpretation of what you're playing it flatters you too much!!

I will certainly buy a Beatles song book so am investigating the ones recommended above.

Good to hear you're on the mend Dungassin and will soon be able to play again.  My guitar playing was prompted by a lengthy absence from work which has turned out to be ankle arthritis - not quite sure what career impact that's going to have yet but the guitar has been a great comfort/distraction through a pretty tough few months.

As for the acoustic v electric I'm lucky in that many years ago I bought the missus a rather nice Yamaha electro-acoustic (an APX-5 I think) so I can use that because she hasn't stuck with it and it's been sitting in its case in the dining room for ages - perhaps I will dig it out and have a blast!

My instructor has already had me strumming rhythms with a metronome and I found that much easier than quickly switching chords bit but as you suggest I think it's just a question of practice, practice, practice. 

One thing I'm learning has been how important sitting position is.  Playing on the sofa is pointless but I'm much more consistent if I perch on one of the breakfast bar stools or my Daughter's keyboard stool.  As you can imagine my wife just loves me rearranging the lounge furniture and trailing yet more cables around the place...  She already claims the naim/AV rig makes the house look more like Abbey Road than a domestic lounge (which in my view is a good thing)!

Jonathan

Well I'm still bashing away on the guitar and having a lot of fun although still battling with chord changes - I have been working on Twist and Shout recently but I'm no rival for the Beatles yet!!

A little windfall from work this month led me to consider investigating all the hoopla around valve amps.  I popped into Andertons in Guildford today to try some options for a couple of hours (amazing shop) and after trying lots of amps from Fender, Marshall, Orange and Vox came out with a Vox AC15.  I just fell in love with the thing - it was somehow more rich and organic than anything else I tried and I loved being able to crank it and feel it driving the room as well as hearing it.  I realised this week that because I run Rocksmith through the Naim/Pioneer/Kef AV rig at fairly high levels the little Valvetronix was being outgunned by the NAP250 and SBL's - it just didn't have the power or scale to keep up.  I think the AC15 is probably a match for the SBL's in terms of impact though due to my wife's Sctrictly Come Dancing addiction and the need to photograph a bonfire/fireworks display for the local village magazine I haven't had chance to play with it at home properly yet tonight.  I'm itching to fire it up but it's going to have to be done quietly until tomorrow when I can let rip!!

It's strange that I much prefer transistor amps for hi-fi reproduction and yet the reverse for guitar amps - in fact I found myself not liking the Orange (valve) amp because to me it sounded like a transistor amp!  Odd really.

What I am sure of is that the AC15 is not justified by my current incompetence as a player but I feel it's an amp I can grow with and it's inspiring to play through something so nice.  There's also something very calming about the lovely orange glow of those valves in the back of the cabinet and I'm tempted to have a bash one day at building myself a little valve hi-fi amp just for fun.  There is certainly something nice about the whole simplicity/history of them.  The other revelation for me was how affordable this seems by hi-fi standards - a 12" highly regarded Celestion speaker, valve amplifier, cabinetry, upholstery and switching/electronics for the price of a budget hi-fi amp. 

I've never been a spirit drinker really but tonight I think I'm going to pour a decent whiskey and admire that soft orange glow as I peruse the manual...

Jonathan

PS I know some of you suggested the AC4 but I do have a best friend who is a drummer and we're planning to jam once I'm capable so the 15 seemed a better bet for that over the medium term.