Is there a Statesman in British Politics ?

It should be a decision for Parliament. The electorate is too prone to influence from the Daily Hate and the like to be able to take a fair view. Have you read the Mail? People belive the bile that is spouted daily is true. It's truly frightening.

A bit like the Scottish referendum then? 

And the first Common Market Referendum.

I distrust Parliament to take such vital decisions. I'd rather leave it in the hands of the electorate - the electorate has an un-erring ability to get the really big decisions right, unlike the government of the day, which [of any political stripe] seems rather more concerned with getting re-elected than the long view.

ATB from George

I'll probably move to France.

I think a referendum is the right way to make really big decisions in our society,  assuming that most people agree with my point of view, OTOH I would leave it to Parliament if the right party were making the decision.

More seriously, I agree with HH that the electorate is unable to make a sensibly informed decision, for three principal reasons:-

First, there is no unbiased, easily digestible package of information made available setting out and evaluating the key issues behind the referendum.

Secondly, the media, (basically newspapers, television and radio) don't make available unbiased people to help explain this unbiased, easily digestible package to people

Thirdly, the average voter IMHO (ok, i'm just guessing here) probably votes on a 67% sentimental hunch  + 33% long-term economic/quality-of-life evaluation of the main issues

And get Marie La Pen, which would be far more worrying than Nigel Farage!

ATB from George

Ah, but the wine, the climate, the fact that everyone isn't fat and covered in tattoos......

All decisions are subjective as no person has yet sat down in the Throne of Objective Truth before making a decision!

I would be deeply distrustful of a Whitehall Pamphlet explaining the pros and cons of anything!

On the other hand with the wide range of views that are expressed in a free society such as ours is, then at least one get find some common sense among some of it. Perhaps one may even have some fine thoughts one's self!

ATB from George

I believe that pre-War Germany was a pleasant place in Nazi times in many ways, provided that one was not of a type the Government did not like ...

ATB from George

If your wife speaks perfect French then it's a great idea! You don't have to talk to anyone, everyone is friendly and the French are generous to a fault.

Not perfect by any means, but good enough..... 

And to suggest another policy decision best left to Parliament: what would be the likely outcome if there were a referendum on re-introducing the death penalty? Hmmm, now what would the Daily Mail promote? 

Even I have enough French to survive, but France has no appeal to me.

Look at history, and sensitive or liberal the French are not.

I am glad to be half-Norwegian.

At least they are tolerant, should I win the Lottery and be able to emigrate ...

ATB from George

Quite ...

+1 - also for his real concern for world poverty.

One of the most ridiculous features of UKIP's policies (and there are many to choose from) is their  opposition to both immigration and to foreign aid. Short of mass slaughter, the only realistic way to deter people from wanting to move to our country is to make staying where they already live more attractive  as an option.

We clearly agree on most of this, you have nicely explained why some of my three observations are true.

As for the "Where did you get this from?" response to my third point, as I said   "(ok, i'm just guessing here)"

Hmmmm, well................possily but.............

he does lack charisma, IMHO .....

and he screwed up pension arrangements in the private sector big time, so I am somewhat biased against the man.....

But I conceed  he might, just might, be a possible candidate. But surely there is somebody better ?

No, I'm still here Dave. Just been a bit busy, had a few bollockings to administer.

If I had to nominate some (real) individual then it would be Gordon Brown who as Chancellor of the Exchequer kept us from joining the Euro currency which may be the main reason the UK economy has preformed better than the rest of Europe and hence lead to the additional budget demand. Rather ironic really.

Dave

So would I. When I said "unbiased" that is what I meant - unbiased. Sir Humphry wouldn't qualify !

Alex Salmond, Gordon Brown, George Galloway and Ken Clarke are the only ones with any statesman like quality. Oh yes - I forgot - Tony Blair - not popular, but statesman like.

I shall not comment on the nomination of AS, but George Galloway? Really? The guy who appeared on Big Brother/Get me out of here (or whatever those awful programmes are called)? Is that statesman-like? Sorry, Dozey, but I must be missing something here. Irony, perhaps? 

TBH I had forgotten about the big brother incident. I was only considering his speeches in the House of Commons and before that US committee ...

Churchll told a few rather risky jokes but that doesn't stop him being considered statesman like.

Agreed, Dozey. But unlike Churchill, Galloway has always enjoyed the freedom of having no responsibility for anything. Such freedom allows him to play-to-the-gallery and to adopt views that he knows he will never have to implement.