Steel Bike?

I wonder why steel? Weight is pretty important. A few pounds reduction in a bike's weight can make a big difference in riding efficiency and enjoyment (and you have a rather big uphill to climb on your way to work). I moved from steel frames to Specialized aluminum frames (one road, one MTB) years ago and wouldn't go back. Caron fiber frames are expensive unless you're a serious enthusiast or beyond.

Just my two cents. Not to detract, your post does inquire about steel frames.

Some good things to be said about steel. And some nice custom made bikes in the US. For inspiration and more information this might be a good place to start: http://www.2015.handmadebicycleshow.com/  

The best advice is that if you have a good bike shop then pick their brains. I suspect that most major brands don't actually vary that much between their stock bike ranges. They are all going to be very tight on value too. Spesh, Cannondale, Trek, Giant, Scott, Marin-you are unlikely to buy a dog with any of them and it will come down more to choosing what sort of bike you actually want or need. The Diverge you mention looks like an all-rounder with some dirt road capabilities-is that what you need? If you are going to do 100% on tarmac you might get lighter and faster elsewhere in the range.

Are you sure you want steel?

I own two steel road bikes; one fairly inexpensive with traditional build which I ride as a winter bike, the other in stainless steel by Tiziano Zullo. I have (or have owned previously) carbon and aluminium road bikes. I have a Ti MTB and have owned steel and aluminium MTBs

Steel can be tight, fast and 'alive' or a bit heavy and gloopy. Aluminium can be harsh, but not always. Carbon can actually be dead and hard and it is not always light. It can also be magical. Actually I believe that Ti is the perfect 'one frame for everything' material, but it is pricey. Lasts for ever, light enough, stiff enough and sweet to ride. All this comes down to the frame design and construction and the intended use of the frame as well as the inherent properties of the materials themselves.

Don't forget to factor in tyres and contact points when looking at comfort. The vogue for slightly wider tyres now can compensate for a stiff and harder frame. A good seatpost design and material can really improve the ride on a slightly harsh frame, carbon forks the same.

I agree with Joe about weight to a large degree. A heavy but 'soft' bike is uncomfy if it makes every ride a slog. Stiffness does matter too in terms of getting your energy transferred to the road. Steel bikes can be made fairly light but getting down close to the levels of a light aluminium or carbon frame without losing stiffness requires good design and tubeset choice. If you want a bit of an all-rounder with some dirt road capacity in steel that is not going to be a lightweight. Don't ignore wheel choice. I'd rather have top quality wheels on a mediocre frame than vice versa.

If I wanted to consider a steel frame for purely aesthetic reasons (and I do get that) I would get one made for me. I'm not sure how many US bike makers will do off the peg steel road frames now anyway. Getting a custom frame would give you the big advantage of having the frame designed exactly for your purpose plus the huge potential benefit of a really good fit and also the opportunity of choosing the components around the frame. Small-scale steel frame makers are pretty easy to find in the UK, I would be surprised if it was different in the US. It will not be as competitive on price as an off the peg bike (although the tubestets are pretty cheap so maybe not as much as you'd think), but it will be unique to you

I don't know if this helps. Have fun choosing.

Bruce

There are some pics of my Zullo in this thread. https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...82#21277303074707482

Mango,

Does it matter what bike you buy as you'll have changed it within 2 days anyway.

Jim

MM

I am a fan of steel bikes and as Bruce suggests you probably need to get a good one made for you. There will be good alu ones off the shelf and even some steel ones too but to make sure it fits, getting one made for you is the best way to go. As I also live in the UK I cannot comment on decent LBSs near you but there must be one fairly close, even in the wide open spaces in the USA! And as you are in Redmond, there must be lots around you.

Here is a website that lists lots of framebuilders in the USA.

http://cyclophiliac.com/americ...bike-frame-builders/

I am planning to cycle across the USA in 18 months time when I retire and  I will be doing it on my steel frame. I can't wait!

and of course part of the fun of a new bike is just chuffing about it with everyone and every shop. the minutia of which headed bolts are to be used are all worth a discussion. 

james

and just to add, while Moots and Parlee bikes may be very pretty, they are very very expensive over here especially when we have a great many wonderful UK and continental frame builder to use first!

My other custom built steel bike (by Justin Burls in the UK!) was pretty good value at about £900 for a custom built and painted steel frame and carbon fork. Few years ago but doubt it will have altered that much.

I dread to think what my Parlee Z1 would cost to buy now-prices here have shot up as you say. The Zullo was around £1800, similar to Pegoretti prices.

A bike that does not fit and you don't like is going to sit unused and be a waste of money all round though.

bruce

Bruce

Well, I can't sell a bike after using it for a year and make 5-10% on the deal, can I?

Job done...

The Colnago frame reminds me of an incident in Harry Halls Cycling emporium about 25 years ago.

I spotted a display stand containing three Colnago frames and matching forks, priced at about £500. When I lifted the top frame to gauge its weight the forks dropped out of the headtube and hit the crossbar of the frame below. It obviously made a loud clanging sound which attracted a shop assistant. He dashed over, spotted the 5mm diameter piece of enamel missing from the crossbar and stood speechless with mouth open.
Before he could say anything, I said to him “that’s not a very good method of securing the forks into the head tube”.
(They’d pushed the steerer through the headtube and wrapped a dozen or so elastic bands around it, with the intention of preventing it falling through the headtube.)

He just walked off without saying a word.

Any steel fame that can be fitted with good running gear can weigh 10 Kilos, and is not going to be problem on on any hill considering that most cyclist weigh 60 Kilos plus.

To get to a cycle weighing 7 Kilos [via a very light carbon frame for example] makes damn all difference.

Even my 31 year old Carlton [in the less than stellar Reynold 501 tubing] weighs in at ten Kilos ... One good defacation would makes almost as much difference.

ATB from George

Nice to see you back on here George, best wishes

Welcome back, George.

I might be of that school of logic had I not actually educated myself a bit on the topic and tried for myself so I could appreciate the difference a lighter, well-designed frame makes, especially during climbs. There are reasons there is a minimum weight limit on bikes in racing, and racers discard water on hills and near the finish line. The mathematics are simple enough and the rider's weight is considered a constant. Tires are also a big consideration as Bruce says.

As none of us are racers I have no doubt that the effects of a few hundred grams in terms of performance is relatively minor, although I can definitely see it riding in my hilly area. The first 30mins or so of the rides I do from home is generally the same. My fasted and slowest (lightest/heaviest) road bikes consistently vary by about 15% in terms of the average time to that first marker point. Not that I am obsessed by my cycle computer of course.

Weight affects the way the bike accelerates, and that 'zip' when you push on or try to go hard up a hill is a big part of the fun for me. Reduced rotating weight is probably the biggest factor that can be immediately felt, hence my suggestion of good wheels.

I also think reduced bike stiffness (that may be preferred in pursuit of comfort) can rob you of some of the fun. My basic steel winter bike is a bit soft and if you want to crack on it just feels a bit woolly. Great for an all day ride but a bit dull for a quick blast. My Parlee just flicks into action. It is genuinely like driving my Volvo estate vs a 2 seat sportscar.

George, glad you are back. Sounds like your bowels are working well too!

Bruce

Makes me laugh when I see these 'keen amateurs' riding their bikes with no mudguards in order to save weight. Heck it's something like a few ounces each!! Just have a wee and that's the weight saved! 

'keen amateurs'? Are you driving the car in your avatar or just wishful thinking?

Errr... yes that is my (summer) motor... Soon to be taxed.

Errr...

Do you enter races with it or just drive from point A to point B? Taxed or otherwise. Seasons not withstanding.

I sense some antagonism here, but no I don't go racing. Nor do I ensure I have a wee before I set off to offset the extra weight. The point I was making (in jest) was it's pointless saving a few ounces in weight for the plastic mudflaps compared to the mass of the rider.

I doubt it's about the weight - although the weight does make for nice bragging rights.

On the weekend, I took a few bikes out for a test ride. The carbon was really like riding on a plush layer of air. The Aluminum, in comparison, you felt the road.

The Steel Bike was interesting - it made for a similar ride as the Carbon, at Alu prices. However, it did feel like energy wasn't being transmitted properly. I still would have gone for it if but the bike just had a weird fit for me.

The Comp Carbon beckons - but the use case just isn't there. This is mostly going to be a commuter - to and from work (5 miles each way - uphill one way, downhill the other).

Longer rides will have to wait several years till my son is older to accompany me. 

Still ...

In my opinion you can't beat a good piece of reynolds tubing.

My Claud Butler  Super Dalesman (531ST Reynolds Tubing) is still for me, man and machine, in nearly perfect motion. I have aged a tad since I bought it in 1983.

Bought a Cannondale CAADX Ultegra just over a year ago; great cyclo cross, the BMW of GS1200's, a fun bike, on and off road.

Many bike builders still use steel, Mercian, Breton, Shand to name but a few.

I don't like mudgards for a few reasons. Ugly, rattly, flimsy, and three of my bikes don't have attachment points nor clearance (sure you can kludge mudgards onto any bike - see the first three points); and I don't find they actually do much for me. Even when it's wet, (and I commute every day through Vancouver winters) I don't ride with rain gear (hate it) so I get totally saturated with or without mudgards. Mudgards only delay the inevitable. Largely pointless. It has little to do with weight.

Crud RoadRacer mudguards are surprisingly effective, really simple to fit and very skinny/light. They don't rattle. They need a wafer of clearance and don't need a mounting point (all done with rubber bands and zipties)

Do for me all winter. They keep my feet and my backside a whole lot drier.

Bruce

They are pretty common around here. A few guys at the office use them for winter commuting. They seem to spend a bit of (but not much) time adjusting and re-fitting them. One guy tapes over all the rubber bands and stuff with electrical tape in an effort to stop them moving around and rubbing on his tyres. Whilst they can be extended down the back with a half water-bottle so as to protect a following rider  when group riding (which is the real benefit of mudguards) this just makes them wobble around more. As I said, I don't see the benefits outweighing the hassle. I get wet anyway if its raining. And I don't really care.