Wireworld Matrix 2 Disappointment

Posted by: rsch on 07 November 2015

Last week i ordered a Matrix 2 6 Schuko sockets power block.

I was using a pretty mundane Vimar plastic 5 Schuko socket strip with Klimo fixed cord.

Reading some reviews on this forum I  was expecting a mild improvement at least.

However conntecting my Powerlines with the same order 1 Hi:Cap 2 555PSU, 3 Nap 250, 4 Napsc.

Connection from power strip to wall socket was done with standard  Nap 250 cord.

After a couple of cd i did not notice improvements whatsoever, on the contrary i had the impression that

something was lost.

Talking with the Italian distributor, he was not so much surprised, he also told me that Matrix 2 is not

actaully a star wired design but it has a sort of copper rails inside.

Alternatively, he suggested me an Acoustic Revive power block,if i wanna get a real improvement

but you know at 4k euro or 2.7k euro at least for an ex demo, for now i think it's better to splash this sort

of money on a black box upgrade.

Today i just collected another Powerline for the Napsc, the only still standard, i' m really

curious whether it' ll make any difference.

 

Regards

Roberto

Posted on: 07 November 2015 by nigelb

Why don't you try the new Powerline (the one you got today for the NAPSC) between the wall socket and the Wireworld block and see if there is an improvement. Apolgies if you have already done this or I have misunderstood the arrangement.

 

I only have one Powerline and I use it between my Wirelworld Matrix and the wall socket. I must admit I haven't experimented placing the Powerline elsewhere but as it was a significant improvement over my previous Grahams Hydra I left it alone.

 

Worth a try?

Posted on: 07 November 2015 by Darke Bear

I use a Wireworld Block to good effect and prefer it to other 'star-earth' blocks I've tried - but it is sensitive to plug-in ordering.

 

If it is the version with 6 sockets and a metal case and internal bus-bars then I suggest the following:

 

1. Always place the Power Amp socket direct into the wall if possible, into a double-wall socket next to a Power-line that feeds the block.

 

2. Numbering the sockets 1 to 6, where 1 is nearest the wall-plug lead entry and 6 the last socket on the block, plug items in order 1 to 6:
 1. Power Amp (if you have not put that direct to wall)

 2. Pre-amp

 3. onwards the Sources

 

3. In an Active system (like I use) then I put all three Power Amps direct into the wall, have the Snaxo Supercap supply next to the wireworld block feed and then have the Pre in socket 2 (leave 1 empty as it does not sound as good) and then the source supplies - in my case Analogue 555PS in 3, 4 and 5 empty and 6 for the Digital 555PS (the gap helps).

 

4. If three Active Power Amps need to go into the block then order bass-mid-treble 1, 2, 3 sockets then Pre in 4 and sources 5, 6.

 

Have a play and experiment.

 

DB.

Posted on: 07 November 2015 by rsch

Thank you for your replies but i have already returned it to the dealer.

DB, I' ll try this seequence on my own block

Next week my dealer will borrow me a star earthed one.

Just returned home with a new Powerline and oddly the Aluminium plaque with the Naim logo, lays

turned 45° once plugged into the Napsc, not at 12 o'clock but 3 o' clock.

 

Regards

Roberto

Posted on: 07 November 2015 by rsch

Ok, i changed the order this way,

socket 1 to  where the first is the nearest the incoming power cord.

1 Nap 250

2 Hi-cap

3 555 psu

4 Empty

5 Napsc

There is something odd with this new Powerline into the Napsc, aside the aluminium plaque with the

Naim logo turned 45°clockwise  (looking the the Napsc panel from behind) the plug itself seems

twisted. Usally when you insert the plug the cable is already directing with Naim logo at 12 o' clock

 

Regards

Roberto

 

Posted on: 08 November 2015 by sharik

 

i too had an unplesant experience with Wireworld products, once bought myself an Aurora power cable, it sounded worse than every other cable i own including the stock ones.

Posted on: 09 November 2015 by Naimiac

Roberto,

 

on WireWorld's website, the Matrix 2 is advertised as a star-wired strip. How is it that the Italian distributor says it is not?

 

N

Posted on: 09 November 2015 by Darke Bear

My very first WW block fell apart after a few years due to a design fault, but I managed to get the replacement version free of charge, so I used that. It is definitely not star-earthed inside, but later ones may be.

 

The main thing is not the earth in fact but the actual mains-carrying conductors inside the block. A power supply has a diode that turns on and off spiking many amps in bursts into a low-impedance load and that is where most noise comes from in a HiFi. How you arrange all the cables so that the noise injected into the mains by normal operation of your equipment is what determines some of the 'sound' you get in the end.

 

There are of course noises injected from outside the HiFi that need to be reduced, but the reason mains-leads make such an important impact is because they are closest to the source of the main noise-injection - the bridge rectifiers in the equipment.

 

In any case I tried star-earthed blocks and circular ring-connected mains-wiring blocks - the latter was 'nice' but muddled the low frequencies to my ears. A linear-connected block allows one to impose selected order on the sequence and I found that works best for me - so far!

 

I definitely think there are better blocks about - I've not got round yet to investigating and finding one, so the WW one I have works well enough in meantime.

 

DB

Posted on: 09 November 2015 by 911gt3r

Hi Roberto.

I really do think you should give the Music Works ReFlex ' lite' a chance. It is recommended by Naim and works a treat in my system being fed straight into its plug-in from my seperate 6mm consumer box cable/ earth spur and yes it is star-earthed. For what it dishes up sound wise you cannot go wrong! 

I have experimented with plug in sequence like DB and found this to work the best for me: Mains power- 552 PS- 555PS Analoque- 555PS Digital- 500 Amp. Keep the revs up Peter

Posted on: 09 November 2015 by rsch

Hi Peter,

For the moment i' ll  stick with my old strip, probably not much different to the WW.

Instead, i have a deal to sell my 282 and upgrading to 252.

 

So your plug sequence has the 500 amp at the end of the block

DB suggested me instead the amp at the beginning or straight into the wall socket

 

Regards

Roberto

 

Posted on: 10 November 2015 by Darke Bear

Some prefer the sequence one way around- some the other.

 

I found getting the Power Amps first (at the wall) in line to mains and then daisy-chaining away along the block with sources at end gave a cleaner more open and relaxed sound with better low-level detail.

 

The other way around seems preferred by many, but I found it rather too 'busy-intense' and 'in my face' with muddled bass and the performance not presenting coherent whole. Exciting, but fatiguing for me.

 

When Naim visited to install the Statement Pre they stayed to listen for an hour and were remarking on how the bass response was exceptional and they had never heard the S800 do that before, so my sequence can't have been too awful!

 

Main thing is it is easy to try and see which you prefer.

 

DB.

Posted on: 10 November 2015 by CharlieP

DB and Peter are prefering different plug order in their distribution blocks.  I am wondering if this is because the two of you have different preferences for the sonic presentation, or if it is because the design of the distribution blocks differ?

 

Charlie

Posted on: 10 November 2015 by Darke Bear

In any system there can be things that work well in one system and not so well in another. In either system they do the right thing, but not in the other.

 

For example: a system with greater low-frequency extension may have demands that one which does not place those demands does not have on it.

 

Or another good example is the use of 'empty fraim shelves'. On some systems these give a clearer sound and work well, but when I tried them I hear an awful ringing sound from the un-loaded glass shelf which goes when something suitable is placed on it, so I tend not to use these. Some is personal preference and some is the system capabilities and resolution.

 

My plug-in placement is based initially on engineering then on listening that it actually worked. The Power Amps are the only boxes that are not operating in 'class A'. Class A which means they draw a constant current from the power supply - but the Power Amps are 'class AB' which means they mostly don't draw constant current, and in fact draw a dynamic current correlated to the music demands into the speaker.

 

Placing these at the wall gives them the lowest impedance path to draw their current from the mains and hence also reduces voltage drops on the mains as their power-supply regulators turn on and off cutting into the mains waveform at the peaks. You can see this on a scope if you look. Placing the other stuff away from all that noise by a few mains leads seems to filter-out some harshness - and the lower voltage drops interfere less with the source and Pre supplies.

 

When you put the Power Amp at the end downstream of the sources you superimpose these drops directly onto the other upstream supplies.

 

But in fact only your ears reveal what you prefer, so none of this matters once you find what gives a pleasing result for you!

 

DB.

Posted on: 10 November 2015 by CharlieP
Originally Posted by Darke Bear:

In any system there can be things that work well in one system and not so well in another. In either system they do the right thing, but not in the other.

 

For example: a system with greater low-frequency extension may have demands that one which does not place those demands does not have on it.

 

Or another good example is the use of 'empty fraim shelves'. On some systems these give a clearer sound and work well, but when I tried them I hear an awful ringing sound from the un-loaded glass shelf which goes when something suitable is placed on it, so I tend not to use these. Some is personal preference and some is the system capabilities and resolution.

 

My plug-in placement is based initially on engineering then on listening that it actually worked. The Power Amps are the only boxes that are not operating in 'class A'. Class A which means they draw a constant current from the power supply - but the Power Amps are 'class AB' which means they mostly don't draw constant current, and in fact draw a dynamic current correlated to the music demands into the speaker.

 

Placing these at the wall gives them the lowest impedance path to draw their current from the mains and hence also reduces voltage drops on the mains as their power-supply regulators turn on and off cutting into the mains waveform at the peaks. You can see this on a scope if you look. Placing the other stuff away from all that noise by a few mains leads seems to filter-out some harshness - and the lower voltage drops interfere less with the source and Pre supplies.

 

When you put the Power Amp at the end downstream of the sources you superimpose these drops directly onto the other upstream supplies.

 

But in fact only your ears reveal what you prefer, so none of this matters once you find what gives a pleasing result for you!

 

DB.

Interesting, Darke Bear.  I had not thought about the impact of dynamic current draw from a "noise on the power line" perspective as you described.  I wonder if this could account in part for the improved sound of the new DR power amps?  Do they produce less "spiking" noise?

 

And, yes, it makes sense to listen and trust you ears.  As an engineer, I can over think things but still miss an "optimum" solution because my mental model is wrong or insufficient.

 

Charlie

Posted on: 10 November 2015 by Darke Bear

The DR supply may have better 'line rejection' as well as 'load regulation', so may reduce the impact a bit more. As power Amps bite into the peak mains then the voltage everything else gets to see is also reduced, so the voltage upstream of the regulator drops - some of that will get through the regulator, as line rejection is never infinite, so always good to try to reduce it to begin with.

 

I hope when I eventually get my set of 500 Amps DR updated they will be so much improved it won't matter any more! But at present it is easy to hear and worth getting right I found. I know it annoys people who 'know' without trying that this is all rubbish.

 

DB.

Posted on: 10 November 2015 by 911gt3r

Interesting, the power amp first is the ONE only configuration I have not tried. Just received second pair of jumpers from Dynamique Audio to test on my Fact 12s and am desperately trying to get them burned in, as they are showing early signs of greatness. I will indeed try proposed sequence when things are settling and shall report back asap. Bonkers game this really!  ATB Peter

Posted on: 11 November 2015 by Dustysox
Originally Posted by Darke Bear:

I use a Wireworld Block to good effect and prefer it to other 'star-earth' blocks I've tried - but it is sensitive to plug-in ordering.

 

If it is the version with 6 sockets and a metal case and internal bus-bars then I suggest the following:

 

1. Always place the Power Amp socket direct into the wall if possible, into a double-wall socket next to a Power-line that feeds the block.

 

2. Numbering the sockets 1 to 6, where 1 is nearest the wall-plug lead entry and 6 the last socket on the block, plug items in order 1 to 6:
 1. Power Amp (if you have not put that direct to wall)

 2. Pre-amp

 3. onwards the Sources

 

3. In an Active system (like I use) then I put all three Power Amps direct into the wall, have the Snaxo Supercap supply next to the wireworld block feed and then have the Pre in socket 2 (leave 1 empty as it does not sound as good) and then the source supplies - in my case Analogue 555PS in 3, 4 and 5 empty and 6 for the Digital 555PS (the gap helps).

 

4. If three Active Power Amps need to go into the block then order bass-mid-treble 1, 2, 3 sockets then Pre in 4 and sources 5, 6.

 

Have a play and experiment.

 

DB.

Not wishing to detract from the op, but wow o wow DB! You the man eh bear!!

 

I have put my 500 PS at the "front" and i noticed an immediate performance gain. Not tried the gap with Digital 555PS yet. i will but I just want to savour this zero cost upgrade.

 

Thank you DB, where does this all end..and don't say the S word!!!!!

Posted on: 11 November 2015 by Michael

Following DB's advice my Musicworks block is now configured thus:-

Socket 1 500PS, Socket 2 552PS Socket 3 555PS(Analogue) Socket 4 555PS (Digital), Socket 5 NDX and Socket 6 Radikal.  Before I had it arranged as recommended by Musicworks, CD Player Pre, Power, other sources. I agree with you Dusty a free to try and very worthwhile experiment... I urge you to try it Peter when your new links have settled in. May the madness continue!!!

Posted on: 12 November 2015 by Corry
Originally Posted by Michael:

Following DB's advice my Musicworks block is now configured thus:-

Socket 1 500PS, Socket 2 552PS Socket 3 555PS(Analogue) Socket 4 555PS (Digital), Socket 5 NDX and Socket 6 Radikal.  Before I had it arranged as recommended by Musicworks, CD Player Pre, Power, other sources. I agree with you Dusty a free to try and very worthwhile experiment... I urge you to try it Peter when your new links have settled in. May the madness continue!!!

 

If you have access to a socket that's on a different circuit, you might try plugging the Radikal into that: Although the Radikal is a vast improvement on the Lingo, both are said to pump some nasties into your mains, and consequently there are sonic benefits to keeping them well separated from the rest of your gear.

 

I have two radials/spurs from my fuse box, one for the Radikal, and one for everything else (all of which are plugged into an Audience ar6 PDC).

Posted on: 12 November 2015 by Michael

Thanks Corry I could try plugging the Radikal into the ring main normal house circuit.

 

I have converted my spur from a single to a double socket this morning so now I am running the 500PS direct and the rest through the block to good effect.

 

Something else to try.

Posted on: 12 November 2015 by Darke Bear

Putting the Power Amp on the wall-socket and then having the other boxes on a dis-board may sound strange - why not put them all into the wall?

 

But actually the extra inductance of the dis-board lead to the other grouping of plugs on the dis-board helps filter some of the noise from the Power Amp power supply and it just sounds better - nicer HF and cleaner bass.

 

Also the reasoning for leaving socket spaces when I put the Digital DR supply at the end - it has more HF noise from all the digital stuff and a bit more spacing worked better - it slightly surprised me that it did, but it did.

 

A little-explored part of HiFi is the huge current transients and voltage noise on the mains supply and its resonant reaction with other things plugged-in.

 

But experiment easy to try if one is inclined.

 

DB.

Posted on: 13 November 2015 by 911gt3r

Hi DB and Michael.

Sadly the configuration with the 500 first in my MM block made my system sound too laid back and loosing its magical presence. I have reverted back to my original lay out and hey system is sounding pretty damn good with my new Dynamique Audio jumpers.

Cup of coffee, legs up and some good blues, thankfully it's Friday afternoon!  ATB Peter

Posted on: 13 November 2015 by Darke Bear

You tried it Peter - that is the main thing to get it right for you and also know it actually does make a difference!

I understand your comments of being 'laid back' - that is how it sounds to me too, but in a more positive way for my system.

 

DB.

Posted on: 13 November 2015 by Michael

I echo DB's thoughts, Peter you never know until you try these things... I didn't work for you so it proves it is system and room dependent.. and I guess how we like to listen to our music... we all listen in different ways. Glad the new jumpers are doing a great job.

Posted on: 14 November 2015 by Dustysox
Originally Posted by Michael:

Following DB's advice my Musicworks block is now configured thus:-

Socket 1 500PS, Socket 2 552PS Socket 3 555PS(Analogue) Socket 4 555PS (Digital), Socket 5 NDX and Socket 6 Radikal.  Before I had it arranged as recommended by Musicworks, CD Player Pre, Power, other sources. I agree with you Dusty a free to try and very worthwhile experiment... I urge you to try it Peter when your new links have settled in. May the madness continue!!!

Spot on Michael.

 

I have now tried various configurations and can't believe the effect it has. I have finally settled on 500 PS first into Musicworks then 552 PS > 555 digital & then into the last available socket the 555PS Analogue. I did try 500PS straight into wall socket but favoured the bass when plugged straight into Musicworks block.After a couple of evenings of plugging and trying to find the best config for me I found my "audio memory" was not as good as I had hoped and began to lose a sense of reference. 

 

Peter was round mine last weekend and suggested we move my Ovator 600's closer together. I have always enjoyed a wide stereo dispersion and wasn't sure about this until I heard the affect. This coupled with mains order my system is really enjoyable and sounding the best it ever has. The system sounds "fuller", a better low end and a more sense of "being there" and a better connection with the music. 

 

I often think that these "tips" offered by DB etc should be as a post in FaQ's as they really do work and new comers to Naim get to enjoy these benefits straight away.

 

Thank you to the OP for allowing us a bit of self indulgence on his thread, very kind.

 

Everyday's a school day eh!!!

 

Posted on: 14 November 2015 by rsch
Originally Posted by Dustysox:

 

I often think that these "tips" offered by DB etc should be as a post in FaQ's as they really do work and new comers to Naim get to enjoy these benefits straight away.

 

Thank you to the OP for allowing us a bit of self indulgence on his thread, very kind.

 

Everyday's a school day eh!!!

 


Indeed !

 

R.