Is NAIM gone mad? Or the value of sticking what we have...

No. I like to pay the least possible. I get more pleasure if I have bought something cheaper than someone else. 

My Nait 2 could be sold at a profit - ignoring inflation 

It happened to me, too. I understand this. But this doesn't explain why members have raved about the Nait2, here, for a long time, and yet other members have bought the Statement.

Exchange rates have fluctuated over the past 15 years or so.

2000 £1 got me $2.6 (we bought our house - yippee !)

2013 £1 got me $1.5 (we thought about selling our house and buying in the UK)

2015 £1 got me $2.0 (we wish we had sold our house last year !!)

When I checked out a Muso last Xmas the price was c.$1,500 ie about the same price as in the UK

Lets face it, the people in VAG, the investment company have to make a living somehow or other..................

There is this magical thing called.... inflation....

12000 in 2002 is the same as 17,739.11 today, according web inflation sites like thisismoney

And UK VAT rate was 17.5% then, and is 20% now. 

so if we take into account the vat shift, its £18116. 

UK price of 552 is £19755 according to mr tom of tomland.  

For which you get a different remote (rcom versus the big thing with the LCD panel)?

And you get a powerline cable which retails for £515, and back then you didnt.

So the real cost change is around a grand, tops. So about 5% in 13 years. 

Not sure your price of 12000 was right for the launch, so I searched. One review in 2003 said "At $22,400 USD for the NAC 552 preamp and $21,950 for the NAP 500" which is 1.02 times the NAP500 price. Current UK price for NAP500 is 18695, so the same factor from then applied to today puts the UK 552 price at £19078. Which is within a sniff of the current UK price

No, I dont think naim has materially changed the price *at all* over 13 years. QED

Jon you forgot to mention that nowadays the 552 comes with a DR psu, worth more than a grand!

No. There's always have been a difference because of currency change variations.

The difference between prices in England and Italy is to amortise the constant moving change gap.

This happens everywhere on imported goods.

I was reading an american turntables producer's price list and i noticed that in other european countries the prices are even higher than here.

So it's not between England and Italy but it's worldwide.

And the Powerline.

I don't want to be rude but it looks like you want to buy a CDX2 but you can't.

But i don't think that people at Naim put down a price to create a frustrated crowd in contrast with lucky few.

I think to understand it's not a matter of lifestyle or symbol of a status.

Gianluigi,

no, I don't want to buy a CDX2, and if I wanted, I could. My point - roughly and somehow polemically expressed, as usual (we have to stick with our cliches to keep the forum alive, don't we?) - was that in some cases - although I believe this happens frequently in audio - some people buy gladly very expensive things because they are expensive, without trying to understand the possible reasons for their cost.

The differences in price from a country to another one are a matter I am not qualified to discuss seriously, so I won't; yet, I remember, years ago, hearing a man from audio distribution commenting that the newly released Ovators cost too little, and complaining that if they had been more expensive they would have sold more....

N

sorry, but your man from the audio business is wrong on the Ovators.

I did not buy them especially for this reason, they are not price competitive (i.e. I found them too expensive)  compared to other speakers from Neat, Kudos and Dynaudio which work quite well with Naim (in the case of Kudos and Neat, they have been designed with Naim amps in mind)

I would rather spend more money on a source and amplifier than on a speaker.

Jon, are you defending the price of the 552?  I thought you didn't think it was worth the extra over lesser models?

I'm sure as well.

Because people tend to connect price to quality or status.

Please consider that the largest gap between costs and price is in low value goods.

A product that doesn't need large investments in research and engineering can go out at reasonable prices and can hit a larger number of customers and let you work widepread.

But if you work on research before marketing or design you have to put all those costs in the price.

And if you want to stay alive you have, you must keep the quality level of your products high with a ramarkable customer service which, again, is not for free.

That is why old Nait2s are still around and are, together with other Naim devices, the spine of very good systems.

A pair of S 400 costs £3950, and in the wonderful rosewood £4350. A pair of Kudos Cardea Super 20 A costs £4400; a pair of Neat Ultimatum XLS (yes, an isobaric design but still a stand mount) costs £4500. It doesn't seem to me that Ovators are expecially expensive. I have always thought they were a good buy, if you had the space (and the money). But, again, it's all down to personal taste.

And yet, I see (and have seen on myself) that while many don't find it too difficult to have a satisfying source and amp, buying loudspeakers is usually much more complex. Source first is unexceptionable, on a philosophical ground, but it's the speakers that interact immediately with the walls and your ears, and have an acoustic voice instead of an electronic one; I would spend more time, if not money, on speakers for sure.

But you don't have to disagree perforce..

Assembling a replay system MUST start with speakers that work properly in your listening space/room.

So many people buy very good speakers that are appropriate to a space much larger than is available ...

Then they try to get over the wrong speaker for the space by adopting “acoustic correction” such as bass-traps ...

First get the suitable speaker - need not be expensive - and then get a sufficient amplifier, and with the remaining budget the best sources that can be had. 

Very simple really.

ATB from George

everyone has a different experience, I have the smaller bookshelf (cost 995 GBP) X16 Dynaudio in my living room and it fills up the room very nicely, no bass issues, no image issues, it just works musically for me... and the 202/200 has actually so much power, I wonder why more powerful Naim amps are needed at all.

ah yes...The trap of buying an expensive and hard to drive speaker.. that is why 

To each their own, and how they want to spend their money. 

As stated on another post, it's not just about power with Naim amps.

George has a very valid point regarding speaker selection though. 

He's gone mono; one less speaker to worry about. 

Thanks I have heard most Naim amps upto 552/500 and understand what you get up the ladder, it is good fun to hear more details, soundstage and musicality as you climb...

It is all good fun, this hobby....