NDX forgets to play FLAC's ?

Posted by: sondek71 on 20 May 2011

Just wanted to know if there are NDX users out there with the same problem:

 

From times to times - not clearly reproducible so far -  the NDX forgets that it can play FLACs. The n-Stream App and the NDX Display state "Error: wrong data format". The error can only be fixed by restarting the device (powering off/on).

 

After the restart it seems to remind that the feature is actually built-in.

 

I am using an ethernet connection. The behaviour hasn't changes while upgrading n-Stream v2.0 to 2.1.

 

It is a bit annoying - especially when you want to do demos of the exceptional SQ of the NDX. Exactly then the effect is there and does not really amuse the public. 

 

Many thanks for your answers.

Posted on: 25 May 2011 by sbilotta
Originally Posted by AV@naim:
Originally Posted by sbilotta:

AV@naim,

if that is the reason i.e. "higher current consumption and RFi generated as a by product of decoding FLAC files, compared to WAV", would the new (still beta) DBPoweramp Flac Uncompressed format bypass this issue ?

 

Thx

Stefano

With FLAC it's a case of more function calls - i.e. reading the FLAC file in, decoding it and then moving the decoded buffer to the DAC.

 

Theoretically it should sound better - but I haven't tested this personally myself with that implementation of DBP, so really I can't comment at this time

 


 

FWIW, yesterday I was listening to an album and after the first song the playback stopped; basically the second track (and all the rest of the album - the first track included) started to give the format error.

Today I converted the album to Flac Uncompressed but it did not play, giving the above error.

Only when I converted to Wav did it play.

Posted on: 25 May 2011 by KRM
FLAC has been working on mine. The files are on a USB plugged into the Unitiserve. Last week I bought the Beatles 24 bit USB and it played. Then I copied the FLAC files and they wouldn't play. I thought it must be me until I found that no files would play. Switching between UPNP and other sources didin't work, but switching the NDX off and on did. Phew!

Keith
Posted on: 25 May 2011 by Peter_RN
Originally Posted by sbilotta:

FWIW, yesterday I was listening to an album and after the first song the playback stopped; basically the second track (and all the rest of the album - the first track included) started to give the format error.

Today I converted the album to Flac Uncompressed but it did not play, giving the above error.

Only when I converted to Wav did it play.

I have had this happen on several occasions now, using the Qute. In fact is started soon after receiving it. I have re-ripped to replace the files, but I can’t remember being able to play any of the files again once they stop playing; not even the re-ripped ones.

 

A worrying trend if now the NDX is displaying similar problems.

 

Peter

Posted on: 26 May 2011 by okli

Hi Peter,

 

regarding your statement that Asset was able to play the files I'd like you to test if it is really sending FLAC stream or LPCM as it was in my case. I've tested this as well and I was very surprised to find out that Asset is actually sending LPCM stream of my FLAC files. I've asked on Asset's forum why they are doing this even if I disabled any transcoding on the server and the answer was that this is actually a feature instead of bug - the transcoding takes place only if the renderer (Qute) sends back that it doesn't support the particular format.

 

In general I'm happy now that even more people are having this problem and hope this to be sorted out very soon for both NDX and Qute.

Posted on: 26 May 2011 by Peter_RN

Hello Okli

 

I will have a look at this as soon as I can. I was expecting the builders in on Tuesday, never happened, but have stripped the system out and stored it out of harms way. Whilst waiting for the work to be started I decided to install several extra RJ45 sockets so even the NAS is not available to me at this time.

 

Will try and get it up enough to run the Qute in the next couple of days and will answer your question here as soon as possible.

 

Peter

Posted on: 27 May 2011 by Tog
Call me old fashioned but flac playback is an advertised ability of the NDX/Uniti/Qute and that if there is a bug that prevents this happening Naim should be moving he ran and earth to sort it out and quickly! Tog
Posted on: 27 May 2011 by Steakfrit
To AV@naim, for fw update don't forget the uniti. There is the same issue
Posted on: 28 May 2011 by Peter_RN
Originally Posted by okli:

Hi Peter,

 

regarding your statement that Asset was able to play the files I'd like you to test if it is really sending FLAC stream or LPCM as it was in my case. I've tested this as well and I was very surprised to find out that Asset is actually sending LPCM stream of my FLAC files. I've asked on Asset's forum why they are doing this even if I disabled any transcoding on the server and the answer was that this is actually a feature instead of bug - the transcoding takes place only if the renderer (Qute) sends back that it doesn't support the particular format.

 

In general I'm happy now that even more people are having this problem and hope this to be sorted out very soon for both NDX and Qute.

Hello Okli

 

Ok, so I temporarily connected the Qute and you are absolutely right, the files stored as flac on the NAS and unable to be played from there are being sent via Asset as WAV files. The Qute is still reporting these files as ‘Can’t Play Unsupported File Format’. This is getting beyond a joke now.

 

A week or so ago I bought a box set of 17 Cd’s and spent 6 – 7 Hrs ripping them as the tags needed attention to keep them all together. These played fine for a day or two and then the Qute began to play-up and they no longer played.

 

As regards to more people reporting this I agree with you, Steakfrit on the post above is a new member who has encountered the same issues, and we know there have been others. Time some help was forthcoming now IMO.

 

Peter

Posted on: 28 May 2011 by Peter_RN
Originally Posted by Tog:
Call me old fashioned but flac playback is an advertised ability of the NDX/Uniti/Qute and that if there is a bug that prevents this happening Naim should be moving he ran and earth to sort it out and quickly! Tog

Hello Tog…..That’s an old fashion idea you have if you don’t mind me saying.

 

The point is we have been banging on about this really from soon after the Qute became available. I was and am, suspicious of the server on my ReadyNAS, but over the months there have been many people complaining of this problem.

 

We now know that there is an acknowledged problem with the NDX that will be sorted, there’s no doubt about that. I am not sure that the same acknowledgement of the Uniti range products problem has ever been made. Very frustrating.

 

Regards

Peter

 

Posted on: 31 May 2011 by okli

Hello Peter,

 

I hope you are online again and the work is done.

 

I'm glad that you can confirm my observations - meaning this is a general issue. Hope to get this fixed soon.

 

regards,

Ilko

Posted on: 02 June 2011 by AV@naim

Hi,

 

Do any of you see this issue on FLAC files without large artwork embedded? The original issue was down to embedding huge artwork inside the FLAC's - which is fixed in beta.

 

BTW the code base for Qute/Uniti/NDX are based on a similar core, so bug fixes will be ported to all products (although their releases may be staggered)

 

Av

Posted on: 02 June 2011 by Peter_RN

Hello Av

 

Well that’s very enlightening, I for one had not realised that there was a size limit on art and usually go for a size of 500x500 (pixels I presume) if possible, not noticing the file size.

 

Unfortunately my system is packed away at the moment (builders are in) but looking at some of the files I know I have issues with in windows explorer, I find a large difference in file size of artwork. For example 148kb, 251kb, 5.5Mb and 9.5Mb; whilst a random look at those I know are playing have sizes around 30 – 50kb, there are many more that I have not looked at of course.

 

I only have a tag editor on my desktop computer (buried at the moment) but will try and get to it in the morning and remove the artwork from some of these files and see if they can then be played, by hooking the Qute up temporarily.

 

Is there a known size of artwork that should not be exceeded?

 

It is reassuring to learn that all the network devices share a basic core code, which should ensure issues could be addressed more quickly.

 

Many thanks for your help; it would be great if the solution to this irritating problem can be resolved so simply. Will let you know my findings.

 

Peter

Posted on: 03 June 2011 by Peter_RN

Hello Av

 

I have now called up one album with artwork 5.2Mb and removed all artwork from the flac files, and find you are absolutely right (of course), the album is now playing away quite happily; the first time for many months. I checked before removing artwork to confirm it was unable to be played.

 

I feel confident that for me this should sort out all my files that will not play, so once again thank you.

 

If you were able to offer a guide to the ideal size of the art file it would be further appreciated.

 

Regards

Peter

Posted on: 10 June 2011 by Steakfrit
I've tried this : I tried to read p. barber, mythologies album. It failed. I've checked image size in tags : about ~1000x1000. I reduced it to 500x500 and now i can listen it. Good ! I use dbPoweramp to check and resize. It can be helpful. Your tip works but a new firmware is also needed. Thx all