Burning in burnt cable! Tellurium q

Hi Knipester,

I am also a fan of TQ cables, although not quite at the level of the Black Diamonds. I use TQ Ultra Black speaker cables and interconnects in my main system.

I have always been a little sceptical about lengthy 'burn-in' times for cables (or for that matter any piece of hi-fi kit). However, I must admit that I did notice an effect over time that could possibly be attributed to 'burn-in' (rather than just familiarisation) in respect of not only my TQ cables, but also my recent amplification upgrade. Next I may even begin to accept the possibility that designer ethernet cables can have a positive impact on SQ, but maybe that's just a step too far.

Seriously though, although I did notice a significant improvement over time with my Ultra Blacks, it doesn't sound as though the effect was as dramatic as your own. One suggestion I might have is that the effect could be related partly down to powering down your amp in order to swap the cables. I have noticed that when I have powered down my amp (admittedly for a longer period of a number of days or more), it can take a couple of days at least before my system is back on song. Is this a possibility, or would you rule this factor out?

Intellectually, despite having heard (or at least believing I have heard) the effect of 'burn-in' myself, I still find it difficult to accept.   

Ummm...My TQB Din-Din sounds much more balanced now than it did when first connected into the system on Saturday.

G

I've previously spoken to Geoff the CEO of TelluriumQ and he absolutely confirmed that burn-in does exists and takes longer with their cables than most of their competitors. I fully accept this as when I introduced a brand new black diamond interconnect between my DAC & AMP, replacing a TQ black interconnect that i was very familiar with, it took days to start making a difference and finally surpass the old cables performance.

My amp was only off for 3-5mins so residual heat was maintained whilst the speaker cables were swap. I'm convinced even second hand cables need to settle in, obviously not to the extent of a new cable but 30% maybe?

I must say the TQ burn in CD is worth a punt.  Tt has 3 tracks, track 1 is a test for  speakers, e.g. Left, Right,etc, Track two is 1hr long and is like space age techno that is designed to burn in new equipment, track 3 is a 10 min refresh for existing systems. for a mere £17 download or £20for a physical CD its well worth it. Its not exactly easy listening so I have tended to leave it playing overnight or whilst out.

I have non doubt whatsoever that there is such a thing as burn in for cables.  I am just under a week into my new TQ Black interconnect and it is still improving.  For the first 24 - 48 hours it was virtually unlistenable with ragged lows and high frequencies and a really shouty tiring character, although there was still some areas that impressed including bass and soundstage.  After five days I played ELO's A New World Record and found myself enjoying it and things have been improving ever since with the sound now pretty settled but continuing to open up.  Well worth the wait as this cable, along with the matching speaker cables is already proving to be an improvement on the more expensive Chhord Anthem Reference that it replaced.  It has better bass, a bigger soundstage and quite possibly even more detail but it presents this in a much more musical and coherent way.  Looking forward to seeing just how good it will get.

I always expect a mini burn in even with second hand stuff albeit I think it's much less tortuous than with new stuff. I wonder whether it's something to do with temperature stabilisation or something similar... stuff seems to get pretty cold when in transit.  

Having lived with Tellurium Q Black Diamond DIN-DIN for over 6 months now I see benefits in using Track 3 from the TQs burn-in disc. That's the '10 min yoga session for the cables and the system'.

the most noticable difference: treble and mid-range open up.

Burning in burned-in cable ....

.... just when you think you've heard it all!

Then again, this is a site for audiophiles and we do have an image to maintain.

joerand posted:

.... just when you think you've heard it all!

Then again, this is a site for audiophiles and we do have an image to maintain.

Your point being?

If it's not possible to burn in cables for someone else, doesn't this prove that it is in fact the ears that are burning in rather than the cables? The brain has to learn how extract the most information from the changed system.

Adam Zielinski posted:

joerand posted:

.... just when you think you've heard it all!

Then again, this is a site for audiophiles and we do have an image to maintain.

Your point being?

My point being that audiophiles can make outlandish suppositions and no one can truly tell them they are "wrong" for what they are hearing. Its all subjective and realistically untestable. I don't doubt some initial burn-in, but beyond that reburn-in becomes voodoo to the practical minded. Same goes for the freakin' burn-in and yoga-session refresh CD. Come on! Somebody is laughing they got £20 for that. If you want a suitable burn-in CD that will test your system's limits grab this appropriately titled disc out of the bargain bin ...

My point being that audiophiles can make outlandish suppositions and no one can truly tell them they are "wrong" for what they are hearing. Its all subjective and realistically untestable. I don't doubt some initial burn-in, but beyond that reburn-in becomes voodoo to the practical minded. Same goes for the freakin' burn-in and yoga-session refresh CD. Come on! Somebody is laughing they got £20 for that. If you want a suitable burn-in CD that will test your system's limits grab this appropriately titled disc out of the bargain bin ...

 

I suggest you actually do get hold of a TelluriumQ disc and test it, rather than simply make sweeping statement. If you don't hear any difference I suspect TelluriumQ will be happy to refund the money.

My post / comment was refering to the 3rd track of that disc, which is called 'System refresh' (or something along those lines).

I bought some ex dem speaker wires last week. On installation they sounded great,  but now after nearly a week the system is sounding considerably better. I do think that used components take a while to warm and settle, which could be described as re-burning in if you like. It's certainly nothing like the changes that occur with brand new components, but it's there nonetheless, albeit to a lesser extent. 

jfritzen posted:

If it's not possible to burn in cables for someone else, doesn't this prove that it is in fact the ears that are burning in rather than the cables? The brain has to learn how extract the most information from the changed system.

I have often wondered that and burn in, in the past for me, has been fairly subtle and could have easily been me adjusting rather than the equipment. However, with this latest cable teh sound was so bad I would have taken it back had it stayed the same and, crucially, it was so bad that the majority of the burn in was done with the mute button pressed.  Others may be sceptical and I don't blame them but I have absolutely no doubt now that certain items burn in

Adam Zielinski posted:

I suggest you actually do get hold of a TelluriumQ disc and test it, rather than simply make sweeping statement. If you don't hear any difference I suspect TelluriumQ will be happy to refund the money.

I'll give it due consideration once I finish paying-off the wooden volume and balance knobs that make my SN2 sound so much more organic.

I am dubious as to whether the properties of the cable change after the initial run in. It would need to be measurable for me to believe it but I won't argue if someone shows me a quantifiable (measurable) and reproducible change.

On the other hand, the amps have components which have been run in driving a specific load value range according to the previous cable and speaker parameters. Changing the cables changes the load seen by the amp and therefore it may be the output stage on the power amp that is in fact being run in and accounting for the differences heard since it is now having a different load that it was not originally run in for.

Mike-B posted:

If these burn-in / workout discs & downloads really do what they say,  I wonder why Naim don't have one

 

I'd just say - test it. 20 quid is not much versus what we've put into our beloved NAIMs.

I was as skeptical as most of the members on this thread - voodoo was the word I also used.
Then I said to myself - what the heck - I can surely afford to 'waste 20 pounds'. I've tried it on my CDX 2.2  and streamers (NDX and SuperUniti and Qute) and it's actually quite amazing what it does. And no - I don't work for TelluriumQ

All I'm trying to say - it's a good gadget and it works.

Adam Zielinski posted:

I'd just say - test it. 20 quid is not much versus what we've put into our beloved NAIMs.

All I'm trying to say - it's a good gadget and it works.

Then I can send you the ripped version of track 3 from that disc to hear it Provided we don't get prosecuted for advocating piracy

Mike-B posted:

I'm willing to give it a go,  the "Yoga" track,   test before buying etc..   e-mail is on profile 

I'll take this seriously & report back on the forum.  

OK - let's call it an independent verification by the NAIM forum member. I look forward to your comments and observations.

I'm expecting the file size to be too big for email.  No probs if that's the case.  

I've sent you an email on that one.
Could you please have a look and let me know wheter I got the right email?

@Mike-B, are you going to be able to take measurements to prove or disprove the run-in disc changes the electrical properties of the cable? If so, what and how?

Sorry to be a pedant about this.

Mike-B posted:

I'm willing to give it a go,  the "Yoga" track,   test before buying etc..   e-mail is on profile 

I'll take this seriously & report back on the forum.  

I'm also happy to try with my TQ Black, email is in the profile too.  If music was about just about measurements we'd surely all own the same, best measuring kit?