Next upgrade: What to do?

252 ( or 282 ? ) - said quickly and without hesitation!

ATB,

Mark

varyat posted:

252 ( or 282 ? ) - said quickly and without hesitation!

ATB,

Mark

I'd agree but add that both 252 and 282 need to be listened to before deciding which best presses your buttons. They are quite different and tend to divide opinion. 

I would turbo-charge your nDAC first.  Following the principle of 'source first'. 

MDS posted:

varyat posted:

252 ( or 282 ? ) - said quickly and without hesitation!

ATB,

Mark

I'd agree but add that both 252 and 282 need to be listened to before deciding which best presses your buttons. They are quite different and tend to divide opinion. 

I agree with the above.

The 282 is very good with a Supercap. You may prefer it to the 252.

555PS for the nDAC second.

Yes, change the preamp first. The 102 is not good enough for the 250.2, even with a Supercap powering it. 

The 102 is far out of sync with the rest - so would shoot for that...

The 555PS on the DAC will transform the musical performance, possibly beyond what you may think is possible. It's good. And it will get even better when you hear it through a better pre amp. I would do the DAC first. No wait; I would listen to the options first. You have to use your own ears. If you are unable to do this you may as well flip a coin or draw straws. If you are on a long term upgrade path and contemplating upgrading more than one thing in the medium to long term, then you can't really lose either way. If that situation applied to me I would put a 555PS on the DAC. However, I wouldn't try to tell someone else that what works for me will automatically work for them.

If you can possibly listen for yourself then you must do so.

Hi Luke - What do you have feeding the Naim DAC?

252 if you can afford it, 282 if you can't. The 252 gives a far more refined sound than the 282 did in my system and I preferred it. Your preamp is definitely the week link in your set up.

Ken

Well, I would say it depends on the Money, A good deal 282, not so good of a Deal 252. based on the following Archives I filed away. Can't Remember the source, but appears to be an Objective View of Naim's Products!

""

Naim NAC202 The NAC202, 282 and 252 are alarmingly similar inside. The main differences in the range are that the full potential of each pre amp is only possible with better power supply options. A NAC202 can only utlise a single HiCap so a HiCap with a digital PSU is as far as you can go with this very capable performer. From £600.

Naim NAC282 The Naim NAC282 is poor value, but still popular, this is largely a NAC202 with the ability to add a second HiCap. Not much else is different in real terms except some marginal improvements in earthing arrangements. Optimum configuration is two HiCaps and a NAPSC. From £1500 second hand.

Naim NAC252 As far as comparisons go with the NAC252 and NAC52 they ought to be similar, but they sound quite different. It's a long way off a NAC552 and not a massive improvement over a NAC282. Again, the ability to power this unit from a SuperCap is the secret, giving it far more individual supply rails raises the performance of an other similar design. Optimal configuration is with a SuperCap PSU. From £2,000 second hand.

Naim NAC552 Naim's outstanding product of the moment.""

Nac 202 ruled out doesn't make the Cut!

Nac 552 ruled out makes the cut, but I'm assuming to much Money! 

Hence, 282 or 252 depending on the Deal! 

I own a 282, Forum member swayed me this way with his past experiences! 

I've had 282 with HC and SC, 252 and 552. Clearly, 552 is the best - there is just a certain "rightness" to it that it is instantly recognizable.

If I had to do it all over, I would have gone straight to a 282 with supercap and stayed with it until a secondhand 552 became available.

A 282 with supercap won't resolve absolutely everything from the recording, but it will be close enough that you never care, IMO.

JMHO

Allante93 posted:

Naim NAC252 ........... Optimal configuration is with a SuperCap PSU. 

That's an interesting way of putting it

Allante93 posted:

 If I had to do it all over, I would have gone straight to a 282 with supercap and stayed with it until a secondhand 552 became available. 

I don't think I wrote that - but it pretty much sums up my view - with hindsight and leaving the S1 preamp well out of the equation.

Support for most of the previous comments. The 102 is the Weak link in an otherwise balanced system.Although source first is usually a good starting point in this case I would start wth a significant pre upgrade . A 282 will give a lot more and would give you the balance you need. 252 brings a lot more . You need a good home demo of both to decide; ideally borrow both for a few days.

I'm definitely getting a 252 over a 282 (my preference after a few demos) but I was worrying about my existing speakers. Are they not the weakest link?

Chris Dolan posted:

Hi Luke - What do you have feeding the Naim DAC?

Mac Mini.

lajlaj posted:

I'm definitely getting a 252 over a 282 (my preference after a few demos) but I was worrying about my existing speakers. Are they not the weakest link?

If they are in some way damaged or very poorly positioned and set up they will be a weak point. But if they are good speakers which work well in your room they will positively sing if fed a better signal.

Harry posted:

lajlaj posted:

I'm definitely getting a 252 over a 282 (my preference after a few demos) but I was worrying about my existing speakers. Are they not the weakest link?

If they are in some way damaged or very poorly positioned and set up they will be a weak point. But if they are good speakers which work well in your room they will positively sing if fed a better signal.

Harry, I agree, if it ain't broke don't fix it!

As it pertains to the Speakers! They will only be enhanced by the Sources Signal.

The OP has also made a wise decision, taking advantage of the 252's PS, with his SC DR,  just as long he doesn't go near a Nac 552!

Now to the Issue at hand, The Source!

I assume the OP's  favors digital signal as opposed to the analog TT,  in which case he has an excellent building block with his Ndac!

However, there are choices amongst the digital realm.

Cdx2 with It's superb internal dac, or build upon your existing Ndac with 555PS and US uniti.

Of Course, ruling out the 25K CD555 and the 13K NDS!

Can I get someone's opinion on the NS01?

And price, I couldn't find it!

Remember a new paradigm shift, multiple choices in the digital arena, depending on music and mood!

Adam Zielinski posted:

I would turbo-charge your nDAC first.  Following the principle of 'source first'. 

Thanks Adam, I'm glad someone's enjoying my babblings!

My how time flies, it will soon be 1 year, since my first post on the Forum. And as you can see we both agree that a 555PS would be a nice turbo charge!

Thanks again, I just learned we can like an Reply! WOW!!!!!

lajlaj posted:

I'm definitely getting a 252 over a 282 (my preference after a few demos) but I was worrying about my existing speakers. Are they not the weakest link?

No, I think it's not a bad idea to add a PSU to the DAC and improve preamp before touching the speakers.

Have you by the way tried the more affordable DAC PSU alternatives, e.g. XPS? That might save money for the preamp upgrade, or for getting a 300 later on. Although your NAP 250 is probably a good match with the Audience 50's (assuming they have some similarity with the Audience 52 SE - which I remember having a very light bass end).

lajlaj posted:

Hi all,

I have the following:

• Naim DAC
• Naim Supercap DR
• Naim NAC 102
• Naim NAP 250.2
• Dynaudio Audience 50 speakers

 

Which of the following upgrades would you make first?

• Naim NAC 252
• Naim 555PS
• Harbeth 30.1

 

Cheers,

Luke

I see your point Felix, it's rare Forum members actually incourage saving the OP's Cash, usually we enjoy spending the OP's  Cash. But I think the OP has this one figured out, first 252, second 555PS, and last Speakers. I think the OP realizes 2nd bargains can be found with non Dred 555 PS's!

I tested an XPS on my nDAC - there is an improvement., but I'd describe it as 'subtle' 

waiting now to test 555ps

lajlaj posted:

Chris Dolan posted:

Hi Luke - What do you have feeding the Naim DAC?

Mac Mini.

Not arguing against a new preamp, I found that the nDac is VERY sensitive to the quality of the digital source.

Assuming you use an optical cable from Mac Mini to nDac I would suggest you give other alternatives a try, currently I´m very happy with Audiophilleo2+PurePower USB/SPDIF and audio quest carbon digital cables.