Mu-so Qb

Paradoxically, it will be the success of sales in this market-sector which will allow Naim to remain 'exclusive' and be able to continue to service a forty year old NAP250, returning it to the customer sounding much better than it did when it was new.

The Mu-So QB will also be great for propagating the Naim name out there in 'normal land'.

What's not to like?

John.

jfritzen posted:

This is yet another product with digital amps in it. As Naim are becoming more familiar with this technology, will digital amps eventually accompany the lower end amps in the line, the 100 or the 155? Or a multichannel amp?

This might leave most black boxes discontinued

Most pre/power/psu users will lower their box count due to this 1Kan box, to a degree Naim now will discontinue anything between SN and Statement

I'm looking forward to hearing one in my local Apple store -- hopefully they'll stock it.  I just have to go listen in the middle of the day, during the week.  I saw a Mu-so there, but the store was really busy and just too loud to appreciate much of anything from any source.

b_lund posted:

jfritzen posted:

This is yet another product with digital amps in it. As Naim are becoming more familiar with this technology, will digital amps eventually accompany the lower end amps in the line, the 100 or the 155? Or a multichannel amp?

This might leave most black boxes discontinued

Most pre/power/psu users will lower their box count due to this 1Kan box, to a degree Naim now will discontinue anything between SN and Statement

Of course. I am so looking forward to getting rid of my 52, my six pack of 135s and dbls, and replacing it with another muso - maybe a "muso grande" 

Oh wait...

Graham Clarke posted:

Porsche were criticised in some quarters for entering the SUV market with the Cayenne years ago but the profits from the sales of it has led to even better sports cars (911, Cayman, Boxster). 

Naim aren't abandoning their core products  just like Porsche haven't.

I don't own a Porsche BTW... 

I DO own a Porsche (in fact I've owned three 911s) and don't resent them in the slightest for launching an SUV.  It basically saved the company in the 90s.

Half of their sales (I'm not sure if this is by units sold or revenue) are now SUVs which shows their success and what the general market think of the move.

991?

I'm just a little annoyed with myself that I bought a Sonos Play 3 for a guest bedroom (which doubles as my ironing room) just before Christmas - if only the QB had been released a couple of months ago 

Nothing beats my Sanyo 3 in 1 with Bose speakers!

Wow, what a thread. Who would have thought a little music box would provoke such emotion!

Although most appear to be in favour of Naim's diversification, there has also been (eventually) some rational argument against. I have made my views clear (much) earlier in this thread.

Although there may be differing views over the Muso/Muso Qb, one theme is common among (virtually) all who have posted here. That is the desire for Naim to be successful and thus continue to develop those wonderful black boxes we have all cherished for so long. The key however is to analyse the best way of ensuring Naim continue to produce ever-improving core products that continue to bring us such enjoyment (by 'core products' I mean black boxes that the vast majority on here have valued and have kept us brand devotees).

One thing is for sure. If manufacturers (of pretty much any product) don't adapt to the continually changing needs and desires of it's key markets (that is potential and existing customers), they will perish! As well as serving 'traditional' customers, Naim MUST attract new customers and if that means diversification then so be it IMHO. The proviso being that there is a need to continually invest in the development of it's core products.

I do realise the legitimate fears of some that there is a danger of tarnishing the brand if either diversification is taken too far or if diversification distracts Naim from the continual development of it core product ranges. Some see Muso/Muso Qb as a step too far but most (on here anyway) see no problem with it - in fact most seem to quite fancy a Qb for the kitchen or work space.

My view is that continuing to flog black boxes to a diminishing market is not an option. A gradual fall in sales means little or no money for development which means less and less competitive products longer term. A classic downward spiral which inevitably leads to.....well you know.

The crying shame is that there are a huge number of 'potential audiophiles' out there IMHO. The problem is that they don't know they are audiophiles because many have only been listening to MP3 files on smart phones and crappy earbuds. I exaggerate to make a point. IMHO if many of these potential Naim customers are exposed to real music reproduction it could very well open their eyes (or should that be ears) to what they have been missing. And for sure one thing that puts these potential new customers off is the apparent high cost of entry.

My second (and existing) association with Naim started with a Uniti. I loved the sound and I loved the new streaming technology. My interest in quality music reproduction was established and it wasn't long before I wanted more. I now have an array of black boxes in a Fraim with SL cables and am still plotting my next upgrade. All that was needed was a seed - the Uniti.

But for many the cost of a Uniti is too much to contemplate and I can fully understand that. But what if the cost of the 'seed' could be reduced further. Enter Muso and now Muso Qb. It makes perfect sense to me. And Naim show no signs of being distracted from the development of its core product ranges (I would suggest DR power amps, 272, SL cables as evidence).

Now many Muso/Muso Qb buyers will never upgrade to black boxes. That's OK too with me. But to keep the core product range alive, new customers have to come from somewhere. I will bet that this is partly Naim's rationale for introducing these so called lifestyle products.

Well if you have got to the end of my rather verbose post, I thank you.

Hungryhalibut posted:

I've ordered mine today - hopefully it will rock up on the first of March. Baa. 

Got in before the annual price increase.

robert- posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

I've ordered mine today - hopefully it will rock up on the first of March. Baa. 

Got in before the annual price increase.

Very much doubt there'll be increase on the Mu-so line.

Mine will have to wait until Christmas now - Shure and Apple took my toy money last time out. 

robert- posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

I've ordered mine today - hopefully it will rock up on the first of March. Baa. 

Got in before the annual price increase.

As most on here well know, launch pricing is usually valid for at least the first financial year, so if launched before April the price usually doesn't get revised for more than a year.

Richard Dane posted:

robert- posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

I've ordered mine today - hopefully it will rock up on the first of March. Baa. 

Got in before the annual price increase.

As most on here well know, launch pricing is usually valid for at least the first financial year, so if launched before April the price usually doesn't get revised for more than a year.

Not the case with Statement!

jon honeyball posted:

Graham Clarke posted:

Paul Stephenson posted:

Graham just contact Steve Hopkins naim support and he can arranged a trip, I will make sure I am there

paul

Thanks Paul, I'll do just that.  Will be good to meet you again (we met at the UHES Bentley event June 2014).

Didn't know you were there too!

Yep.  Morning and early afternoon.  https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...ocal-and-bentley-day

Which is why i said "usually" as the Statement situation was far from usual.

rackkit posted:

Graham Clarke posted:

Porsche were criticised in some quarters for entering the SUV market with the Cayenne years ago but the profits from the sales of it has led to even better sports cars (911, Cayman, Boxster). 

Naim aren't abandoning their core products  just like Porsche haven't.

I don't own a Porsche BTW... 

I DO own a Porsche (in fact I've owned three 911s) and don't resent them in the slightest for launching an SUV.  It basically saved the company in the 90s.

Half of their sales (I'm not sure if this is by units sold or revenue) are now SUVs which shows their success and what the general market think of the move.

991?

No, 997.2 Turbo.  I was leant a brand new 991 Turbo S for the day but hated the electric power steering (hydraulic in 997s) as it had no feel.  Plus I almost laughed when they told me what the cost to change would be on my then 2 year old 997 (£85K).  Frankly it didn't move things on far enough to justify anything like that amount.  On top of which the 50bhp extra (550 vs 500) was largely academic given there's virtually no opportunity on UK roads to fully use 500, let alone more...

Graham Clarke posted:

rackkit posted:

Graham Clarke posted:

Porsche were criticised in some quarters for entering the SUV market with the Cayenne years ago but the profits from the sales of it has led to even better sports cars (911, Cayman, Boxster). 

Naim aren't abandoning their core products  just like Porsche haven't.

I don't own a Porsche BTW... 

I DO own a Porsche (in fact I've owned three 911s) and don't resent them in the slightest for launching an SUV.  It basically saved the company in the 90s.

Half of their sales (I'm not sure if this is by units sold or revenue) are now SUVs which shows their success and what the general market think of the move.

991?

No, 997.2 Turbo.  I was leant a brand new 991 Turbo S for the day but hated the electric power steering (hydraulic in 997s) as it had no feel.  Plus I almost laughed when they told me what the cost to change would be on my then 2 year old 997 (£85K).  Frankly it didn't move things on far enough to justify anything like that amount.  On top of which the 50bhp extra (550 vs 500) was largely academic given there's virtually no opportunity on UK roads to fully use 500, let alone more...

Plus yours is a lovely colour Graham!

tonym posted:

Graham Clarke posted:

rackkit posted:

Graham Clarke posted:

Porsche were criticised in some quarters for entering the SUV market with the Cayenne years ago but the profits from the sales of it has led to even better sports cars (911, Cayman, Boxster). 

Naim aren't abandoning their core products  just like Porsche haven't.

I don't own a Porsche BTW... 

I DO own a Porsche (in fact I've owned three 911s) and don't resent them in the slightest for launching an SUV.  It basically saved the company in the 90s.

Half of their sales (I'm not sure if this is by units sold or revenue) are now SUVs which shows their success and what the general market think of the move.

991?

No, 997.2 Turbo.  I was leant a brand new 991 Turbo S for the day but hated the electric power steering (hydraulic in 997s) as it had no feel.  Plus I almost laughed when they told me what the cost to change would be on my then 2 year old 997 (£85K).  Frankly it didn't move things on far enough to justify anything like that amount.  On top of which the 50bhp extra (550 vs 500) was largely academic given there's virtually no opportunity on UK roads to fully use 500, let alone more...

Plus yours is a lovely colour Graham!

Why thank you Tony!

When I bought mine new in 2010 most people seemed to be buying in quite muted colours (e.g. black or dark grey).  I'd never buy a black car due to the visibility of swirl marks these show and grey just seemed ... boring.  Maybe due to the recession people were trying to be discreet in their colour choices?  I thought the blue was really nice, unlikely to date and didn't shout "LOOK AT ME!".

This does look like an interesting proposition  Trouble is SWIMBO really likes the Sonos Play 1's (we 2 in the conservatory and 1 in the kitchen, all Naim kit in the lounge though!) and I doubt very much I'll be able to convince her to change now, especially as you can get 4 of these for the price of one Qb!  

I think you will, if you play her the sound difference

Paul Stephenson posted:

I think you will if you play her the sound difference

I'm not so sure. I am confident that the Qb will sound significantly better than the Sonos speakers but the target market may not see SQ as their top priority. The Qb looks like a lifestyle product and will most likely be used mainly for background listening so ease of use, looks and price may well take priority over SQ.

I have a Mu-So, which I think is great and profoundly disagree with those on this thread who believe it dilutes the Naim brand. 

i agree with Philip though, however great the Qb sounds, Naim have missed my price point for this type of product by quite a margin. I'm just not willing to spend that much on something that will spend 90% of it's time playing Radio 4. But then I think it's more important that people like my 22 yr old son buy it as their first decent replay device than existing Naim devotees like me buy it as their 3rd or 4th replay device in their hones.

Olly

But aren't young 20 something listing to music from their phone's speakers playing music fron YouTube, free spotify and illegal downloads. 

Look at HTC and others,  always trying to improve their phone speakers and reviewer's playing music through them and giving their opinion on it.

Only the rich kids will buy this if they've any interest in it or pushy audiophile father as its not hip and made by an unknow brand to them.

Other 20yo will want bose, jbl, sonos, beats all entry level stuff as £600 on an "ipod dock" is mad.

Phone's are for teens. 20 somethings will want to show they've grown up and moved on. TV is probably the first priority after that I totally see Qb appealing to the higher social/income groups in that demographic. 

Olly

The sound just sneaks up on you no escape

Paul Stephenson posted:

The sound just sneaks up on you no escape

Well it certainly has for me!  The Mu-so bought me back to Naim after a gap of 27 years with Musical Fidelity (actually 35 since I last bought any Naim kit) and a Superuniti soon followed.