NAC 82, SUPERCAP, NAP300 No or extremely low sound.

Might you have a mute button engaged ?

No definitely not. I've gone over everything several times. all cables are connected correctly.  Input cd selected. Mute is off. 

I get no audio. When I turn it up beyond 12 o clock position I can hear a feint sound from both channels. Is it likely to be a power amplifier problem or a pre amplifier problem. 

Initially I was connecting the nap 300 to chord Hugo. Using a RCA to standard xlr connection. I was only getting audio in one channel. And I discovered that to do this successfully I needed to get a custom cable made to attach a non Naim pre to a Naim power amp. So I decided to just stick with Naim pre/power. And yet the problem persists. 

Might I have always had a faulty nap 300?

i cannot diagnose the fault as I have no other equipment that I can swap around to test  

Khan

Double check you have the supercap to 300 cables the right way round as these are 'handed' 

The reason why you'd have only got one channel working with the Hugo with the standard RCA to XLR cables is that the XLR input sockets on the 300 are wired slightly different for each channel. I suspect only CH1 would have produced sound with an off the shelf RCA to XLR cable. 

hey guys,

what a relief, i went to pack up the nat 82 and a came across a little not from the previous owner stating that the longer din cable is an output only cable to headphone amplifier. so i used the alternative din to rca and everything came to life.

im ecstatic right now. off to enjoy my first full naim system.

thanks for all your suggestions.

Khan

Good stuff - Enjoy 

Let us know how it sounds

Excellent news Khan .. enjoy.

Khan - one more thing (not related to the sound volume). 

If your 282 has been used by another owner, it might be a good idea to re-set the pre-amp to its factory settings. Just in case some input assignment has been configured. The manual has a brief note on it - page E18, section 14.7

Hey Adam, I have the 82 does it still apply?

Oops - I thought it was 282. Not sure actually...

Adam Zielinski posted:

Khan - one more thing (not related to the sound volume). 

If your 282 has been used by another owner, it might be a good idea to re-set the pre-amp to its factory settings. Just in case some input assignment has been configured. The manual has a brief note on it - page E18, section 14.7

Khan posted:

Hey Adam, I have the 82 does it still apply?

Adam Zielinski posted:

Oops - I thought it was 282. Not sure actually...

Kahn , Given your remote location, initial and current questions it might be better to ask Naim customer services direct.

Click on this link : info@naimaudio.com      

Just reporting on my initial impressions of my system NAC82/SUPERCAP NAP 300. I have to say that this is a whole new level of transparency. I cannot believe how much information other equipment was masking. Now as I read over the previous posts I understand that my system maybe revealing shortcomings in other areas. Although I considered the Chord Hugo to be absolutely sublime with my Creek EVO100A integrated, I feel like there is a mismatch here perhaps. Or maybe its my digital media that is lacking in quality. I say this as I am experiening considerable highs. I wouldn't say the treble is harsh but just very pronounced compared to before. And this is from Harbeth SHL5 plus which have a roll off at the top end. The bass is also anaemic. i guess one can say it is more controlled which it seems to be but it is definitely a lot less obvious than before. Has anyone else experienced this with similar gear? please remember this is after one day of listening with a brand new NAC A5 cable so the presentation may change slightly.

Hugo has no problems as a source to amplifier at your level, it is being used with 252/SC/250.2 by a member on this forum.

I have tested it with 552/500 and against such sources like NDAC and the Hugo is not outclassed at all or lacking in any way. (although I do like the NDAC for what it does and indeed I have never heard a Naim source that I did not like. They are so musical)

If your NACA5 is brand new (and has brand new soldering) then it will take a few days till it sounds better.

How old is your kit and when was it serviced?

I never heard an 82, but the 282 is quite a revealing amplifier, however the Hugo is very good with my 282, no complaints at all.

Hi Khan

I had a similar experience with my 82/250 Harbeth SHL5 system when I used an earlier model from Chord (QuteHD). While it was miles more revealing than the DAC I was using prior, the Chord sound was a little on the lean side and together with the brightish NAC82, made some recordings hard to listen to. Even the warm sounding SHL5s weren't enough to even things out. My personal thoughts are that it is the combo of Chord DAC and NAC82 that's giving you the bright sound. The olive Naim gear (esp. 82) have to my ears, always had a bit of glassy brightness about their sound that was greatly improved with the later black era of 282, 252 etc. Couple that with the slightly lean presentation from Chord electronics and the balance is tilted in that direction. Have a read of John Darko's excellent reviews of DACs on his site including the various Chord models where he talks about lean/warm presentation. I think the Chord DACs are staggeringly good (fast like Naim and amazing VFM), but need to be balanced out with some body and warmth from the rest of the system for my taste. I guess I'm especially sensitive to perceived brightness in the music I listen too.

While anything but ideal,  warm leaning interconnects such as Wireworld can act as tone controls to redress things a little, but I suspect you may want to move to a more modern Naim preamp at some stage. Stay well away from leaner sounding interconnects such as Nordost. I went from the 82 to a Supernait, and while it was quite a step down in fidelity, the balance was restored and I could enjoy all my music again. 

I might be way off the mark for your situation, but that is how it worked out for me. All the best!

you can also try another digital source with the 82 to understand the source of the problem

The hugo is one of the most gentle and analog sounding Dacs I have heard....

Just sit back and give it a week or two. You should find that the slightly thin trebly sound will change as the speaker cables run in. Don't even think of changing anything in the short term!

Longer term, given that you have a 300 and Supercap, is the idea to swap the 82 for a 52 or 252?

Or at least 282. It's a good combo: 282 and SuperCap.

Yes i plan to fit in the 52 next. Although I am going to enjoy this setup for some time I suspect. Fyi I just changed the chord Hugo to a HRT music streamer pro and I cannot believe the difference in sound. The music has more body to it. The bass is more loose but   there is more of it. It sounds a bit more sweeter than analytical now. If ever the notion for 'source first' was evident. Even with a DAC that I picked up for £200 compared to a £1400 DAC. system synergy should not be ignored. I am witnessing it so clearly right now . I will surely let the whole system bed in with the HUGO for a few weeks and report back. 

Thanks

I'm  using a NDX into a 82 sounds brilliant seems to suit the system that I am using.

Please elaborate. How would you describe the sound of the ndx. Tonal balance wise

The NDX is an extremely  well regarded device it works extremely  well with the 82 seems to have a good all round ability just plays music in a way that you expect with a Naim product and it doesn't sound like a digital device so enjoyable with all types of music, all my cds are stored in a Synology NAS very rairly do I use my CDI player the NDX is really that good.

Khan posted:

Just reporting on my initial impressions of my system NAC82/SUPERCAP NAP 300. I have to say that this is a whole new level of transparency. I cannot believe how much information other equipment was masking. Now as I read over the previous posts I understand that my system maybe revealing shortcomings in other areas. Although I considered the Chord Hugo to be absolutely sublime with my Creek EVO100A integrated, I feel like there is a mismatch here perhaps. Or maybe its my digital media that is lacking in quality. I say this as I am experiening considerable highs. I wouldn't say the treble is harsh but just very pronounced compared to before. And this is from Harbeth SHL5 plus which have a roll off at the top end. The bass is also anaemic. i guess one can say it is more controlled which it seems to be but it is definitely a lot less obvious than before. Has anyone else experienced this with similar gear? please remember this is after one day of listening with a brand new NAC A5 cable so the presentation may change slightly.

Thanks to Simon-in-Suffolk , I learnt that my 282 is not source input grounded properly, and I think you have the same issue with your 82.

The 82 should be grounded properly to get the best out of the 82 and the Hugo.

The highs will be better and the bass will get more solid when it is grounded.

Speak to Naim directly how to do this, as this is a public forum and it can be easily misunderstood (signal earth and mains earth are different issues).

One way is to have a Naim source (NDX/NDAC/UQ) (with the ground switch set on chassis) and the DIN-DIN should be connected to the preamp.

Another way is to connect a Naim CD player, which is signal grounded by default.

There are others ways to do this, but speak to Naim directly about it.

Thanks for your reply. I don't seem to be getting a loud hum at all but a very faint one for sure. I'll look into this. Since my last posting the sound has transformed greatly. The highs are more subtle and the bass has filled out nicely. I can only attribute this to the cable burn in or the equipment warming up. And before anyone suggests it's me getting used to the sound I assure you I know my own room acoustics very well. It wasn't only me that experienced it. My cousin whom only comes to visit clearly said there is a stark difference in sound.  And he was not listening  daily like I was.

Thanks for the suggestion. I will contact Naim to see if I can improve the sound even further by grounding the signal. 

Also would you recommend getting the Chord Hugo grounded or just purchasing a Naim DAC instead?

this is personal for me, and of course there will be some pushback from the usual suspects on the forum doubting what I say, but when I first heard naim in the Uk, it was a 202/200, with B&W speakers 805S, and it sounded completely amazing to me.

I could never replicate that sound at home even though I bought the same amp and same speakers.

So when Simon mentioned my sources are not grounded, I quickly checked my DAC V1, which was on floating, and when I put it on chassis, slowly my system started sounding better to me, to the point, where I could finally understand the difference in sound quality. it is subtle, but it does exist. The bass got a LOT firmer and solid, soundstage increased, and the highs got better. It isn't like the system sounded bad before, but it improved after the DAC V1 was signal earth grounded.

I then remembered in that UK demo, there was a Naim CD player attached, so it was grounded properly with regards to signal earth.

Anyway there is no need to sell the Hugo as it is a fantastic DAC, just get the signal earth terminal from behind the 82 properly grounded and the system should sing even more.

This is from the chord website, but better to speak to Steve Hopkins @ Naim, as they have another solution which is probably better. The chord 2 qute DAC has an earth terminal which can be connected to your 82 earth terminal, and should deal with the issue.

I am not going to sell my Hugo, and there is no need to sells yours either.

There is another thread on this topic called "Naim ranting, its about the damn grounding." has more details about it.

"Naim amplification has the mains safety ground and the signal ground separated. Naim grounds at source.

To ensure that there is no possibility of mains hum or buzz when the Hugo is connected to a mains charger, it is simply necessary to ground the Hugo as it will be a source component, and Naim expects it to be grounded.

The easiest way is to connect a wire from the earth pin of a standard 13A plugtop to the Naim Supernait terminal marked 'SIGNAL GROUND' on the back panel. This terminal is internally connected to the braid of the signal connections connecting Hugo to the Naim amplifier.

There are no high currents or voltages involved and a simple piece of thin flexible insulated wire will suffice.

The 13A plugtop with the single earth wire added is plugged into the wall adjacent to the Naim amplifier mains plug and completes the ground path and eliminates the hum.

(This is often not required as introducing a correctly wired Naim source into the system will deal with the signal and electrical ground connection and so no hum would ever be experienced.)

Please contact Chord Electronics if further assistance is required."