The Opposite of Ripping!

Posted by: nap90 on 07 March 2016

Hi All,

I am a keen subscriber to Qobuz for music discovery (PC connected optically to Dacmagic). Any albums I like I have then bought on CD to play on my CDS2. Some albums however I purchased as downloads from Qobuz before I had the CDS2. Question is, if i burn the wavs to an audio grade CD, will the sound quality be the same as a pressed CD? My downloads are uncompressed WAVs. 

 

Regards

Matt

Posted on: 07 March 2016 by Adam Zielinski

I'm not an expert on this but, but most likely not.  Easiest way is to test it.

Posted on: 07 March 2016 by CharlieP

Agree that you should try and listen.  I have not investigated this myself, but I seem to recall some discussion of this.  Do a search.  I think there were some credible reports of case where the burned CD sounded better...  How this could occur is beyond me, and I make no claims other than it may be worth investigating.

Charlie

Posted on: 07 March 2016 by EJS

Yep, works perfectly and I do this all the time. Only caveat is whether your CD player likes CD-R as a medium. The quality of the burner, and the software used, are important considerations, too - I use XLD on a Mac, and get best (error free) results if I burn from FLAC as opposed to WAV or AIFF. Your milage may vary.

If you want to burn hires, obviously you'd have to downsample to redbook first - but if you've purchased via qobuz, you could simply redownload the 16bit files.

Cheers

EJ

Posted on: 07 March 2016 by Adam Zielinski

One thing to note. Most CDs are encoded as PCM (SACDs use DSD encoding). 

Ripping will most likely result in either WAV or AIFF (lossless format). So by burning a CD-ROM you will be listening to WAVs /AIFF.

What that means in practice? Only tests will tell you.

Posted on: 07 March 2016 by Solid Air

From long-distant memory of messing around with plastic disks: you should burn them in 'Audio CD' format and at the slowest pace possible, eg at 1x. Burning at high speed seemed to degrade the sound. After that it's down to the quality of the CD-R and ability of the laser to detect the data. CD-Rs don't work in quite the same way as mass-produced CDs, so the result is a bit unpredictable. Might sound the same or worse (not sure how it would sound better, but there's no accounting for people's ears). 

Quite honestly, an NDS is the way to go . . . 

Posted on: 07 March 2016 by EJS
Adam Zielinski posted:

One thing to note. Most CDs are encoded as PCM (SACDs use DSD encoding). 

Ripping will most likely result in either WAV or AIFF (lossless format). So by burning a CD-ROM you will be listening to WAVs /AIFF.

What that means in practice? Only tests will tell you.

Use a dedicated audio CD burner such as iTunes or XLD, or their Windows equivalents, and the resulting disc will be PCM encoded.

Posted on: 07 March 2016 by Solid Air

Also the PCM thing won't make any difference. If you burn two identical CD-Rs from the same original, one in PCM and one in WAV, you won't be able to tell them apart. They're not really comparable things: WAV files sort-of 'contain' the PCM data, and the music bit is the same either way.

Posted on: 07 March 2016 by EJS
Solid Air posted:

From long-distant memory of messing around with plastic disks: you should burn them in 'Audio CD' format and at the slowest pace possible, eg at 1x. Burning at high speed seemed to degrade the sound. After that it's down to the quality of the CD-R and ability of the laser to detect the data. CD-Rs don't work in quite the same way as mass-produced CDs, so the result is a bit unpredictable. Might sound the same or worse (not sure how it would sound better, but there's no accounting for people's ears). 

Quite honestly, an NDS is the way to go . . . 

In the good old days we had a good choice of different brands... currently most of them come from a few manufacturers, and they all seem to be of decent quality - I have not had any dropouts or other nastiness in self-burned discs for years.

On my  CD-Rs sound as good as the digital files played from USB - but I confess I never bothered to compare against printed discs or different brands of thumb drives. 

As to why bother going through all this hassle when you'd simply be streaming, well, CD's are merely the three dimensional manifestation of the emotions retained in the folds between the 8th and 11th dimensions - short of the act of sublimation itself, CD is the best way to sample what utopia is like.

EJ

Posted on: 07 March 2016 by EJS
Solid Air posted:

Also the PCM thing won't make any difference. If you burn two identical CD-Rs from the same original, one in PCM and one in WAV, you won't be able to tell them apart. They're not really comparable things: WAV files sort-of 'contain' the PCM data, and the music bit is the same either way.

Yes but most CD players can't play WAVs from a CDROM...

Posted on: 08 March 2016 by Innocent Bystander

When I first ripped my LPs I wasn't thinking of streaming, but with a very good CD player I had decided to preserve my LPs by converting to CDs. So I ripped to wav files, and burnt CDs. 

Some were great, buttoo high an incidence of skipping on playback led me to experiment with different CD-R types, eventually blowing the economy and using audio rated CDs, which seemed to fix the problem once and for all.

... Until CD player started playing up!that marked my move to streaming instead. Streaming is better because you dont have to have the real-time reading and associated error correction if any read errors, the data being available far faster than from a spinning CD, so SQ is less likely to be degraded as it all too readily can when playing CD if anything is less than perfect.