Ethernet Switch Suggestions?

Netgear GS105 unmanaged 5 port gigabit switch. Reliable (I have 1 x GS105 and 2 x GS108 switches in my network with no dropouts streaming 192 and DSD files).

All SBabby says & +1  NetGear GS series are bomb proof.  

However alarm bells are ringing as you've tried a D-Link & still had drop outs,  the D-Link is still a switch & it should have worked. I also concerned with the circuit ( Modem-WiFi-Ethernet-Switch-NDX ) as that is not a LAN & the switch in that set up serves no purpose;  were is the NAS or whatever storage device ??  or are you just streaming or iRadio from internet?   If you are getting streaming (Tidal or Spotify) dropouts that could be a Tidal issue -  and/or if you are getting the same issue also with iRadio,  then its a ISP/modem/wifi point issue.   Bottom line is I would not be in a hurry to get a new switch just yet.

Mike, OP mentions dropouts with 24/192 material so I assume this would not be Internet/Tidal streaming. However, I also wonder if there is a wireless link in the chain somewhere e.g. the computer or NAS storage to the wi-fi point ?

The problem must be between the D-Link and the NDX... as the setup was running fine previously through my Airport Extreme (before the airport crapped out)... so I think it's a safe bet that the DLink must be the culprit for the drop outs.

To be clear about the internet source... the cable modem / wifi point I am referring to is a single box installed by my cable company last July. It is fed from a single coax cable that comes into the house from outside. This box provides wifi for the house, as well as having some ethernet "outs" that can be used for wired connections.

I have a long ethernet cable running from the ethernet out... this cable previously went into an Airport extreme WAN port... and then the ethernet out on the airport extreme went into my NDX. 

Now I want said cable to go directly into a switch, and from that switch out again the NDX.

Zipperhead,

You can't replace the Airport with a switch -- you will need a router behind the cable modem to route between your LAN and the WAN connection presented by your ISP. If the Airport has failed you'll need another router (which will no doubt have a switch on board). You could try a new router with its built-in switch, or you could try a router with a switch behind it (connected to one of the router's LAN ports).

The NAS is a hard drive connected to a mac mini... forgot to mention that bit.

Adrian_P posted:

Zipperhead,

You can't replace the Airport with a switch -- you will need a router behind the cable modem to route between your LAN and the WAN connection presented by your ISP. If the Airport has failed you'll need another router (which will no doubt have a switch on board). You could try a new router with its built-in switch, or you could try a router with a switch behind it (connected to one of the router's LAN ports).

Really all I'm trying to do is extend the ethernet cable that is running directly from the modem. Can I not use the switch essentially as a pass through for the signal that is coming from the modem? The d-link is working for this purpose... and is fine with internet radio and 16/44 material... the dropouts are only occurring with 24/192 material.

Is the D-Link a router? If so, you will still need this to  connect between the Internet (WAN) and you own local network and to handle the allocation of network addresses to your network devices.

How is the Mac mini connected to your network? Is this by Ethernet cable or via wifi ?

Ideally you should have the Mac mini cabled to the same switch as your NDX.

I use a D-Link equivalent of the GS105 and it's been faultless, including 24/192. Shouldn't be a problem with it unless faulty.

sjbabbey posted:

How is the Mac mini connected to your network? Is this by Ethernet cable or via wifi ?

Ideally you should have the Mac mini cabled to the same switch as your NDX.

Ah... good point.

When I was running the Airport, I had an ethernet cable running from the Airport into the mac mini... I might not have plugged that cable into the switch. Will check when I get home.

This is all getting a bit confusing ZHB,  not mentioning the MiniMac is kinda important ........  

You need ......    WiFi - Ethernet - Switch    ///  Switch - Ethernet - NDX      ///  Switch - Ethernet - MiniMac

Can you confirm exactly how your LAN is ........... 

As Dave***T says the D-Link (if its a straightforward switch)  should work OK,  plus if its faulty it won't half work,  its all or nothing.   If its OK except 24/192,  then its most likely something else other than the switch. 

Router not withstanding, I have a couple of Cisco SG100D-08 8 port Gigabit un-managed switches that seem to work very well.

I might be missing something here, but how about replacing the AE with absolutely nothing? If you can do without the AE WiFi, and don't need extra Ethernet ports for other devices, why can't you just connect the long cable straight into your streamer?

Zipperheadbanjo - the above mentioned GS105 are cheap as chips and work well as basic switches. Also as said above - if you have spare switch ports on your Apple Airport Express and it is in the right place- then by all means use that.....

However if  you want to ensure your UPnP network discovery is really fast and not wait for servers and NAS to be found - then for a price you can use a managed switch that helps 'condition' the network and devices by running a multicast group IGMP querier - this keeps device statuses all current without having to wait - I use a Cisco2960 to achieve this - but it is a luxury for instant Naim app responsiveness on an iPad with a larger network. The 2960 also allows IGMP snooping to work well - where as the GS105 will simply do a blind broadcast - again a nice to have and not essential for our Airplay and UPnP use... but would be of more benefit if you were to multicast streaming video etc

Simon

Simon,  I don't understand what you mean by UPnP discovery really fast needing a managed switch,  is that not adding unnecessary complexity to a small simple LAN,  &  probably more important adding confusion to this OP's problems.   My system,  like so may others on the forum,  with unmanaged GS105 (& similar) is as fast as it takes to touch the app screen "buttons" 7 has no apparent delay or discovery issues whatsoever.

Mike - drop me a line if you want to know how - its certainly helped a few with larger networks on the forum who have contacted me personally when I have mentioned this before who did get what I was talking about. Please don't add confusion by seemingly undermining my experience or advice. I pointed out a simple option by agreeing with your advice  and also an option that can improve things should they wish with a larger network - i.e. two media servers and two NASs - it would be remiss of me not to mention it. You mention a GS105 - its fine for many  but also has issues in some scenarios- but I don't mention them so as not to cause confusion or conflict with your posts.

The issue can be with cascaded switch ports and multiple devices - the IGMP group discovery can time out and it takes a little delay to a few seconds for servers to be discovered again on the Naim app. With a querier I have found the status of the discovery groups is kept updated without relying on the router- and so multiple media servers etc appear instantly when you click on that part of the Naim app - especially after sleep etc. I replaced my simple unmanaged switch with a managed device offering an IGMP querier capability to remedy this - as per my regular commercial setups - which are also in some very small offices. I like my network configured to the same high standard as my Naim equipment - and its fair in my opinion to expect others to want the same.

Simon

Simon I am not intending to undermine anything, I'm just questioning – asking why - the need for a managed switch in a very simple audio network. I can see the need for more complex systems such as you describe, so in that respect you've answered.

Mike - ok - it looked to me like you were undermining my suggestion because it was necessarily more involved- so if i have got that wrong i apologise. In truth in my experience the benefit can occur on very simple networks too and can be dependent on the router capability which can vary on home networks... but I';ll leave it at that.

So I took back the D-Link... exchanged for the Netgear... installed it and made sure ethernet cables were connected to mac mini... same result (frequent drop outs).

Went into the mac mini networking preferences and saw that both ethernet and wifi were turned on on the mac mini... turned off wifi... now everything seems to be working fine. No drop outs. Fingers crossed.

Depends on how many network components you plan to run. For me a CISCO unmanaged switch with 16 inputs was needed.

Zipperheadbanjo posted:

Went into the mac mini networking preferences and saw that both ethernet and wifi were turned on on the mac mini... turned off wifi... now everything seems to be working fine. No drop outs. Fingers crossed.

That figures for all the problems,  it was streaming over wifi.   

Simon, Mike,

Simon is right about the IGMP discovery delay issue.  Until I adjusted my router's IGMP settings (thanks for the tip Simon - I'm another satisfied customer) IGMP discovery was erratic and often timed out - now it takes a second or two, but it is reliable.  Interestingly a 'factory reset' of my tablet (and a reinstall of all the apps) seems to have improved the consistency of the timing, it's now about 1-1.5 seconds most of the time, and only very occasionally does it take a bit longer.

I use a Netgear GS105 for the switch.  For myself I don't see the necessity to move to the complexity of a managed switch just to remove this slight inconvenience, and have no other need for a managed switch.

Huge,  my BT HH5 router has no IGMP setting facility that can be accessed,  & it seems they have it set up OK as it shows no hints of discovery issues w.r.t. finding, moving around & staying connected to the Naim or any other app or program.

It seems that the OP solved his problems by the least intrusive alternative; a good lesson.  Look for basic conflicts or aberrant settings before embarking on more complicated solutions.  I sympathize; while I have had ZERO (touch wood) network issues for a couple of years now, I went through a phase where I was almost ready to buy a turntable ;-) and bring the cd's back out of storage. 

It's very easy, even with supposedly 'plug and play' home network components, to end up with conflicts such as two routers running creating conflicting IP addresses, two wifi networks running with various pieces connecting to one or the other, etc etc.  Its easy to string together parts that end up with a home network that works some of the time but not all of the time! 

I've run through a few different server solutions over the past year; UnitiServe, Minim on a nas, Synology's media server, and Asset on a nas. Now that I have settled on Asset, the rest are gone from the network.  All of my music library is on the same nas that runs Asset.  I'm delighted that the Naim App sees my network and both players EVERY time; I haven't seen 'cannot play track' and other such errors in months.  Touching wood . . . again.

Oh my goodness Bart, what have you said?