Allaes V Arivas

Nick,

The Allaes are quite a different beast from the Arivas. The Arivas are a more traditional sounding speaker, placed in free space in the room and even some toe-in may apply. Allaes need to be placed close to a rear wall (about 10cm or less from the back of the speaker, almost never more) they need to be set up with the spring in the base allowing them to oscillate when nudged and there should be almost no toe-in. When set up correctly they show much more punch or slam, but they do not have the weighty sound you get from Arivas - not unless it's in the music signal. They're not warm in the sense that Arivas are always warm.

Regards,
Frank.

Hi Frank, thanks for the reply. I have them 9cm from a solid rear wall, no toe-in, perfectly level with a nice spring in the base suspension. I'm running them with Naim A5 cable with Naim speaker plugs. They have deep bass when it's there, they just don't have the enjoyment factor of the Arivas, I'm going to give them a while to settle and live with them for a bit.

Regards,

Nick

Nick,

I got a pari of Allaes for my system near the end of last year. These replaced a pari of Intros that I was running on my system for a long time. I also upgraded my preamp and power supply around the same time. Currently running them on the end of LP12/CDI/82/Supercap/250 and they sound amazing. Just before I purchased them I felt also that they might lean a bit towards the "clinical" vs. "warm" and I wanted to make sure so I listened to a pair of Devore's which definitely felt more warm and fuzzy but as I "A-B'd" back and forth between the warm, engaging sound of the Devore's to the more crisp and clean sound of the Allaes I finally decided that I should go with the Allaes.

One factor for me was that since I had the Intros on my system for so long I knew I liked the Naim speaker sound. It did make a difference that I replaced the HiCap I had with the Supercar and had already replaced my 72 with an 82.

I have to say now, after playing the Allaes in my system for over 6 months now that I never looked back once. They sound amazing. And as seems to be so often the case with speakers and other hifi - what might sound "impressive" at first might become overly shaded or even tiresome after long listening. Not so the Allaes. In my room they sound crisp, engaging, accurate, rocking and many other great descriptive words.

Another plus by the way is that they have a high WAF... my wife loves the sound of them as well as the look of them. She enjoys good music and loves listening to music in the house as I do but she has never really commented much on the system before other than to know she loves it and that music in our house sounds much better than music in most people's houses we go to. She had never previously commented on any particular piece of equipment. When I was home auditioning the Allaes and deciding whether to take the money step of stretching for them when I had already just upgraded two other pieces I told her I wasn't sure yet about the speakers and she told me we should definitely get them as they sounded great and looked great. Now that is a "win-win" as they say.

I don't know your room, or how they would sound in your space, but I can tell you that these lovely speakers sound great with anything I throw at them, look great, and I am pretty sure will be my speakers for many years to come no matter what upgrades I choose to do in front of them. And, no matter how long I listen to them, or how long I have had them, I always appreciate their presentation.

Good luck with your choice and whatever speaker you wind up keeping.

Best,

Gary

Nick,

Give your head time to get used to the new presentation. Also, don't assume that whatever position the Arivas were in is necessarily the right one for the Allaes. (If you have done).

I'd definitely check the Allae's manual for placing tips if you haven't already.

Chris

I have Allan's in my spare room on the end of Rega Cursa/Maia fed from a DVD5 and find them great fun. 1/2 a cm was the difference between one note bass and tuneful so play around with positioning when you get the urge. 

What's rest of the system?

Thanks for the replies, I really don't want to give up on them. I have them about 4" from the rear (solid) wall and will try to move them out into the room although I can only go about another 5" more. They seem a bit boomy and congested in the mid range at the moment. I'll try positioning them differently. I have a Superuniti feeding them and it sounds superb with the Arivas.

Nick

Nick,

The boom you describe is not dissimilar to mine when I tried mine close to the wall.  They are a boundary design, but I believe the biggest influence on their performance is actually your room.  Despite trying numerous times to get them to work close to the wall, mine now sit with their back 44cm from the rear wall with no toe in and they sound sublime!  

I'm afraid it sounds as though they need to move out a bit.....not necessarily as far as mine, but sometimes things just break convention and do something their not supposed to....step in the Allaes!!

Do put the effort in though, they are incredible performers if you can get the synergy right.

Dalamtian posted:

The [Allaes] seem a bit boomy and congested in the mid range at the moment.

Can you try them further apart?

C.

I've just moved them to 8" from the rear wall, they are about 5ft apart but this is the max distance, they are approx 3ft from the side walls. I have a concrete floor.

Nick

IIRC Naim specified minimum of 140cm apart so you should be ok with 5'.  Richard Dane or Frank Abela will be able to confirm, perhaps a few others too.

See how you go with 8" behind them.

Not sure where you find old manuals these days.

C.

I also have allaes. They perform very well but they miss some sort of sparkle, they are a bit clinical and dry

Any tips on placement to beat boom, Robin?

C.

I have a somewhat small room, with slightly higher ceilings which is good. My Allaes are 8.5 inches from the back wall and just over 5 ft. apart. As others here have mentioned I had some initial bass boom and had to experiment with moving them out from the back wall a bit. When I found the sweet spot the "boom" went away. I would love to have mine further apart but have don't have a lot of room to expand.

Christopher_M posted:

Any tips on placement to beat boom, Robin?

C.

I use the golden ratio's regarding speaker placement especially for the distance to sidewalls. In my case the distance between the speakers should not exceed more than 1,7 m (centre woofers), more and they sound out of balance and you can hear each speaker apart, that's not stereo!  Boom is very unpredictable.

Just had a quick 2 minute listen and they seem a lot better, the voices were more focused and the bass was a lot less boomy. I'm at the limit of my adjustment, I'll have to have an extended listen although that won't be until Thursday to decide.  They certainly aren't clinical and dry, the Arivas have very dry bass with no boom at all, maybe as Christopher M said I've got to get used to them.

Nick

Dalamtian posted:

Just had a quick 2 minute listen and they seem a lot better, the voices were more focused and the bass was a lot less boomy. I'm at the limit of my adjustment, I'll have to have an extended listen although that won't be until Thursday to decide.  They certainly aren't clinical and dry, the Arivas have very dry bass with no boom at all, maybe as Christopher M said I've got to get used to them.

 

Nick

They certainly are clinical next to other brands, but if you can get the bass right they perform better than most!

I always find it interesting, especially for the many years now I have owned, and been listening to, Naim gear to wonder about this idea of "dry" or "clinical" sounding speakers or other hi-fi. Is it that a piece of equipment is actually clinical or is it that we have grown to appreciate a certain coloration in our music reproduction in our homes? This is certainly a "taste" thing that each person has to work out for themselves however I have found that with some sound "coloration" it might sound good, as in warm, alive, (or fill in the blanks with whatever adjective you want) at first but it can become fatiguing after a while. Some thoughts or musings anyway on this most personal of choices...

Dalamtian posted:

Just had a quick 2 minute listen and they seem a lot better, the voices were more focused and the bass was a lot less boomy. I'm at the limit of my adjustment, I'll have to have an extended listen although that won't be until Thursday to decide.  They certainly aren't clinical and dry, the Arivas have very dry bass with no boom at all, maybe as Christopher M said I've got to get used to them.

 

Nick

I never really understand what dry bass is supposed to mean. I've heard Arivas a few times and they were always underwhelming, yet many people seem to really like them. I would expect the Allae to be much better in every way, so long as it works in the room. I tried a pair at home once and could not get them to work properly, despite placing them in the theoretically correct position. Yet I have heard them working very well elsewhere. So just because the Allae is the technically better speaker, the one that's right is the one that's best in the room. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

Dalamtian posted:

Just had a quick 2 minute listen and they seem a lot better, the voices were more focused and the bass was a lot less boomy. I'm at the limit of my adjustment, I'll have to have an extended listen although that won't be until Thursday to decide.  They certainly aren't clinical and dry, the Arivas have very dry bass with no boom at all, maybe as Christopher M said I've got to get used to them.

 

Nick

I never really understand what dry bass is supposed to mean. I've heard Arivas a few times and they were always underwhelming, yet many people seem to really like them. I would expect the Allae to be much better in every way, so long as it works in the room. I tried a pair at home once and could not get them to work properly, despite placing them in the theoretically correct position. Yet I have heard them working very well elsewhere. So just because the Allae is the technically better speaker, the one that's right is the one that's best in the room. 

I think that's spot on HH.  I struggled to get many speakers to work or sound 'right' in my room.  My dealer never really liked or should I say 'gelled' with Allaes because he couldn't get them to work in either of his dem rooms.  Some years back, on the recommendations of many here and based on the fact I would not financially lose anything if they didn't work, I took a punt on my Allaes, having never heard them.  I just had a gut feeling they would work, which was daft, but I took that punt and never looked back.  They just gelled with my room, where many others, costing up to three times the price, just didn't.  Truth be told I have no idea why, I didn't think my room was particularly unusual, but there you go.

They've seen me through many upgrades, now with NDS/555 282/supercapDR/200 and I have even had a try of a 552 on them and they have clearly shown every incremental change.  

So Dalamtian, they can be a serious performer if you can get the placement and electrics right, and hopefully, you will.  Good luck and keep us updated!

Update on the speakers, I now have them 9" from the rear of the speaker to the wall and they sound superb ! As I moved them further from the wall in a couple of inches increments, it was like focusing a camera, they now are sounding as I hoped they would. The bass is deep and controlled, voices are life like and three dimensional, I'm hearing instrument placement I've never heard before. Thanks for all of your advice, I've never had speakers that were so sensitive to placement, I'm glad I percivered, I couldn't be more happy.

Nick

Great news Dalamtian, that sounds more like it!  Enjoy.

Result! 

C.

Nothing wrong with allaes. One of Naims most likeable speakers in my opinion. Set them up right and fed them good signal and happy daze. Added bonus is they look quite nice which isn't something you can say about SBLs . Miles better than Arrivas or Credos

Update.  I've lived with/listened to the Allaes for over a week now, I definitely made the right decision to keep them. I not very good at describing what I'm hearing, the speakers do things so differently, I can hear instruments and placement on my favourite songs  I've never heard before. I'm having to recalculate what and how I'm listening they're doing so much different. They seem very true to the original recording and don't  colour the way it's reproduced, they give a three dimensional sound to the recording which I'm loving. Great speakers, very pleased can't stop listening. 

Nick