CD or Server

ken c posted:

i have US SSD and NetGear ReadyNAS. works perfectly.

enjoy

ken

Nice.. sounds very clean and efficient

Simon

It would be useful to know more about the system being set up here - I see mention of the Sopra 2 and 250DR, and somewhere else an ND5xs. The latter is not really up to the quaility of the amp and speakers. A 272/XPSDR would work, as would an NDX/XPSDR and a 282/Hicap. I'd also question the need for a CD player at all; why not just rip the CDs you have, as you are clearly happy with downloading for new stuff. 

I have owned a UnitiServe in the past, and while it's great for ripping CDs, once that's done its benefit is far less and a NAS is far easier to maintain. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

Snip

I'd also question the need for a CD player at all; why not just rip the CDs you have, as you are clearly happy with downloading for new stuff. 

In my case it's because the CDX2 is a thing of beauty which is a pleasure to use. Aesthetics not solely SQ, although I do like the SQ fine too.

best

David

David Hendon posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

Snip

I'd also question the need for a CD player at all; why not just rip the CDs you have, as you are clearly happy with downloading for new stuff. 

In my case it's because the CDX2 is a thing of beauty which is a pleasure to use. Aesthetics not solely SQ, although I do like the SQ fine too.

best

David

I have also been considering buying a CD player, exactly for the reasons you mention. Aesthetics is also one of the reasons why I do not like NAS based solutions. These would force me to run an ethernet wire to the living room which I do not want to do. A further drawback of virtually all the streaming (via USB, LAN, ...) solutions I came across is that control points running on tablet computers or mobile phones do not support browsing the booklets that meanwhile every serious provider makes available together with an album's .flac or .wav files. Unfortunately, the Naim app is no exception in this respect. However, having a well-tagged collection of .flac files also has obvious advantages (against a collection based on physical CDs only): I have just finished tagging all my files with a "work" (composition) tag. I can now open Linn Kinsky on my wife's iPad, select a composer, get the list of all his/her compositions, select one, get a list of the different interpretations of that composition that I have, pick up one (or put all of them on the playing queue) and enjoy!

Naimless posted:

Harry,

 What do you use to rip the discs?

 

J

 

Originally I used an HDX-SSD. My one stop rip and play box.  When I went to Asset on a QNAP into a streamer I used (and still use) dBpoweramp. This software came in very handy because when I parted company with the HDX, all my HDX ripped files needed to be retagged. A long job which was nevertheless therapeutic and allowed me to put what I thought should be the correct tags into every album I own.  This process could have been short cut if I had converted my WAV collection to FLAC. But I hear differences between WAV and FLAC playback and prefer to stick to WAV. 

I now rip from scratch with dBpoweramp. The tags can be set up before ripping and/or afterwards. An easy process that gives me complete control over my collection and how it is indexed. For HiRes stuff on BD or DVD I use DVD Audio Extractor. BDs need a little extra help to decode before being passed to DVD Audio Extractor, my choice being AnyDVD. This has just been rebranded but is essentially unchanged as far as I know. There are alternatives.

With us it's SQ only. Aesthetics don't factor in, although our system is hidden from view in any case. But when it wasn't they didn't. Convenience is also by the by. I want best sound. Anything else is coincidental. I'm funny like that.

Aesthetics -- also important in my home too.  Ethernet cables -- are within the walls.  Just a wall plate with an RJ-45 jack; very clean.  No computers on the Fraim - just Naim black boxes.  It looks like a Naim hi fi not a facility for running the New York Stock Exchange.  All computery-type devices are on a rack in a very different part of the home.  

(I do have the advantage that the home was pre-wired with coax for the high-speed internet system, and our typical modern US construction made it not so hard to run the ethernet cables within the walls post-construction.)

Naimless posted:

No, have not used a UnityServe, and the apparent consensus from the forum appears to be not to.   

Thank you all for the constructive input.

 

jim

I don't think there actually IS a consensus but I can give you my take.  If you're comfortable using a computer to rip cd's and manage the metadata, and are comfortable setting up and maintaining software on a nas (or want to learn), then the combination of a nas (as server) and home computer (as ripper) can be very cost effective and provide high quality sound.  If you prefer a solution that "just does its thing and does it well," and are uninterested and/or intimidated by having to 'play with' hardware and software from time to time, then the UnitiServe absolutely is worth considering and has a place in your system.

The "kicker" is that to properly back up the UnitiServe, you need a nas.  And once you have figured out how to get the nas to be a backup, you've figured out 96% of what you need to know to get it to be a server.  

For me too, I wanted a server for occasionally serving movies.  My nas can serve movies to my tv; getting it to serve music was an after-thought.

Sound quality is my prime driver, too, though cost aware - and by SQ I mean as 'accurate' as possible, for which read as close sounding as possible to what I know I hear live at a good gig/venue, accepting never identical.

Aesthetics (to me third afrer SQ and cost): Mac Mini is a small slim silver box, doesnt need to be visible or accessible, GUstard isolator is a small though chunkier black box with a bitrate display, also doesn't need to be visible or accessible. Hugo is a tiny box with coloured lights, does need to be accessible. No NAS needed ( though I have one elsewhere in the house, used for backup).  Whole lot can fit in space of one Naim black box. And I don't need a preamp, Hugo feeding the power amp direct

Bart posted:

I don't think there actually IS a consensus but I can give you my take.  If you're comfortable using a computer to rip cd's and manage the metadata, and are comfortable setting up and maintaining software on a nas (or want to learn), then the combination of a nas (as server) and home computer (as ripper) can be very cost effective and provide high quality sound.  If you prefer a solution that "just does its thing and does it well," and are uninterested and/or intimidated by having to 'play with' hardware and software from time to time, then the UnitiServe absolutely is worth considering and has a place in your system..

But bear in mind that CDs dont always have consistent or complete metadata to be utilisable after ripping, so may still need editing if subsequent library issues arise. A good chunk of my ripped classical CDs are a problem, e.g the different recordings of the same piece being variously  tagged 'classical', 'symphony' and 'orchestral', 

An often asked question and of course more than one answer.  I've continued with CD for 2 reasons.

First - I've yet to hear a PC/Streaming solution that engages in the way that my CDP does.  Only last weekend i was listening to a NDS whilst doing a speaker dem but to these ears it wasn't as fulfilling.  Subjective I know.

Second - Functionality.  I can see the appeal of having all your catalogue and a streamed capability as well at your finger tips but I'm yet to be persuaded that by the time I've ripped and tagged - somewhat a challenge with classical music I understand - it will be any more convenient than CD into tray, press play, enjoy.

Caveat - I'm a not so young unreconstructed old luddite.

Regards,

Lindsay

The Strat (Fender) posted:

 

Caveat - I'm a not so young unreconstructed old luddite.

Really? That surprises me! You looked quite a young chap when we first met.

best

David

Innocent Bystander posted:

Bart posted:

I don't think there actually IS a consensus but I can give you my take.  If you're comfortable using a computer to rip cd's and manage the metadata, and are comfortable setting up and maintaining software on a nas (or want to learn), then the combination of a nas (as server) and home computer (as ripper) can be very cost effective and provide high quality sound.  If you prefer a solution that "just does its thing and does it well," and are uninterested and/or intimidated by having to 'play with' hardware and software from time to time, then the UnitiServe absolutely is worth considering and has a place in your system..

But bear in mind that CDs dont always have consistent or complete metadata to be utilisable after ripping, so may still need editing if subsequent library issues arise. A good chunk of my ripped classical CDs are a problem, e.g the different recordings of the same piece being variously  tagged 'classical', 'symphony' and 'orchestral', 

Absolutely.  But this issue arises with Unitiserve rips, and dbPoweramp rips -- it's endemic to 'music as software.'  Even services like Tidal and Spotify have to figure out what to send out as meta-data.  Humans reading a cd box spine, or cover, or booklet, are much better at determining the data than any of these software solutions!

The Strat (Fender) posted:

An often asked question and of course more than one answer.  I've continued with CD for 2 reasons.

First - I've yet to hear a PC/Streaming solution that engages in the way that my CDP does.  Only last weekend i was listening to a NDS whilst doing a speaker dem but to these ears it wasn't as fulfilling.  Subjective I know.

Second - Functionality.  I can see the appeal of having all your catalogue and a streamed capability as well at your finger tips but I'm yet to be persuaded that by the time I've ripped and tagged - somewhat a challenge with classical music I understand - it will be any more convenient than CD into tray, press play, enjoy.

Caveat - I'm a not so young unreconstructed old luddite.

Regards,

Lindsay

I'm with you on all your points, Lindsay.

On your first I was more than a little surprised when I demoed a NDS/555PSDR and found that I preferred my CD set-up. I had fully expected the reverse.   Pleasing, money-saving, yes, but unexpected.

Mike  

David Hendon posted:

The Strat (Fender) posted:

 

Caveat - I'm a not so young unreconstructed old luddite.

Really? That surprises me! You looked quite a young chap when we first met.

best

David

And yourself David. 

But on reflection I think you've played no small part in this madness   If I remember correctly at the time the talk around the office was about Thorens TTs, Quad amps, BW speakers, Nakamichi tape decks..........

Regards,

Lindsay

You do remember correctly of course and most of the wonderful things I then discussed are now in my loft (except not the speakers which were very large and heavy and I sold on about 20 years ago).

Whete did all that time go?

best

David

True Bart. But it is down to human error rather than poor software. Some of the metadata that comes embedded in files is shit. They must put the office junior on it or sub contract to a zoo.

Harry posted:

True Bart. But it is down to human error rather than poor software. Some of the metadata that comes embedded in files is shit. They must put the office junior on it or sub contract to a zoo.

Hey the zoos and gorillas have been targeted enough this week!

Also a fair point! OK, let's blame the bored person in the office who forgot to take one step backwards when the unwanted meta tagging job was being handed out. Chances are they've never even heard of the artist.

Bart posted:

Innocent Bystander posted:

Bart posted:

I don't think there actually IS a consensus but I can give you my take.  If you're comfortable using a computer to rip cd's and manage the metadata, and are comfortable setting up and maintaining software on a nas (or want to learn), then the combination of a nas (as server) and home computer (as ripper) can be very cost effective and provide high quality sound.  If you prefer a solution that "just does its thing and does it well," and are uninterested and/or intimidated by having to 'play with' hardware and software from time to time, then the UnitiServe absolutely is worth considering and has a place in your system..

But bear in mind that CDs dont always have consistent or complete metadata to be utilisable after ripping, so may still need editing if subsequent library issues arise. A good chunk of my ripped classical CDs are a problem, e.g the different recordings of the same piece being variously  tagged 'classical', 'symphony' and 'orchestral', 

Absolutely.  But this issue arises with Unitiserve rips, and dbPoweramp rips -- it's endemic to 'music as software.'  Even services like Tidal and Spotify have to figure out what to send out as meta-data.  Humans reading a cd box spine, or cover, or booklet, are much better at determining the data than any of these software solutions!

That was precisely my point - a US wont give a perfect library if the metadata is bad or incomplete, so whilst it may "just do its thing and do it well" it doesnt necessarily mean no need to manage metadata, though I don't know if you even can if you need to on the US?

Innocent Bystander posted:

That was precisely my point - a US wont give a perfect library if the metadata is bad or incomplete, so whilst it may "just do its thing and do it well" it doesnt necessarily mean no need to manage metadata, though I don't know if you even can if you need to on the US?

Yes you can edit the metadata of the uServe's rips using nServe (but the number of tags (fields) is limited).  Metadata for what the owner places in its Downloads folder can be edited using any editor -- Metadatics, dbPoweramp, etc etc.  No matter what, classical music is a challenge -- do I focus on composer, conductor, orchestra, solist,  . . .

NBPF, FYI, if you use the Unitiserve to store music on a NAS you should use the US as a server anyway. You'd be mad not to, since the US as server is far superior to most servers built into NAS drives. So you would still be using it as both ripper and server.

Frank.

Frank Abela posted:

NBPF, FYI, if you use the Unitiserve to store music on a NAS you should use the US as a server anyway. You'd be mad not to, since the US as server is far superior to most servers built into NAS drives. So you would still be using it as both ripper and server.

Frank.

I also would expect US owners to use it as a server. But, from many posts on this forum, it seems that many US owners mainly use it as a ripping station. Which is a pity given that the US should offer, among others, high quality S/PDIF outputs.

But I can also imagine why many US owners do so: I do not know which UPnP server is running on the US and I would not know how to install my preferred UPnP server (MinimServer, for instance) on it. I am not saying that this is not possible. But, the last time I checked, Naim was not providing any systematic, useful information about US customizability. Then there is the additional problem of the lack of clean power supplies for the US and the fact that it is not fanless. Not to mention that a server that does not support the various Tidal, Qobuz, etc. internet streaming services seems a bit anachronistic, today.  

I understand that, a few years ago, the US might have been a valid proposition for some users. I also understand that users who happen to have a US have managed to integrate it in a meaningful (albeit often underexploited) fashion in their system. But, at this point, the US is (in my view, of course) an outdated, poorly supported, obsolete product.

I also very much hope that Naim will finally come up with a new generation of low-power, fanless servers based on open OSs, with optional, high-quality USB, S/PDIF and Ethernet outputs, support for internet streaming services and seamless playback from memory of data available on the LAN.

nbpf posted:

 Then there is the additional problem of the lack of clean power supplies for the US and the fact that it is not fanless.

The Unitiserve is fanless. And I suspect that the Naim power supply for it is as clean as any PC or NAS supply that Unitiserve detractors may be using on their alternative approach.

best

David

Adam Zielinski posted:

And I am an odd guy here, who uses both CD and streaming at the same time.

To replay the same piece of music, I hope... But how do you synchronise them?

;-

N