HiLine; a heretic awaits his pyre

Posted by: Will Dias on 16 June 2016

Got a used HiLine on home dem the other day. Gosh, they're fragile & rattly - I would have felt more at ease handling a rattle snake (especially as it was on loan)!

While listening through the old grey, I performed all the massaging and stroking and cooing, and then got round to swapping them. My system's in an alcove - like a fitted cupboard with no doors, and fitting it was a heart-in-mouth-while-swearing-under-my-breath exercise. Cable dressing was done as well as possible in the circumstances.

The result - well there was a difference, but an extremely subtle one, not the 'night and day' some have reported. More interestingly, I didn't really like it. It was definitely smoother, more polite, more 'liquid'(?) - excuse me, I'm particularly not good at this describing sounds stuff. The big problem was, that some of the life seemed to have been sucked out of the music, like the musicians couldn't really be bothered.

When I finally swapped back to the plain stock cable, there was slightly more edge and glare to the sound, but the music was back! I'll live with that, just as I'll live with pops and crackles on records.

I really wanted to like the HiLine, it's a lovely bit of design, and it comes with smart silver tin! Maybe I'm just an old codger who's stuck in the 90s Olive period which is when I got into Naim.

So, Hiline back to the dealers (the missus had to post it, and muttered something under her breath when I mentioned how much insurance cover it would require), and I've got some spondoolicks to blow on more music.

Regards,

Will.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by feeling_zen

gary yeowell posted:
A Snaic cannot be used in place of a Lavender!

Yes it can. But you cannot use Lavender where a SNAIC would go between pre and PSU.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by gary yeowell

Never heard of anyone using a Snaic in place of a Lavender on a CD player…… and i still don't think it can be used.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by feeling_zen

It's not at all unusual. Prior to HiLine it was the defacto upgrade from the stock lead.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by gary yeowell

Really….. then i must have been asleep for those years. Never heard of it, ever!

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Will Dias

MDS posted:
Chris Dolan posted:
I've never really liked Ovaltine - I do however much prefer the HiLine* to the standard lavender cable on my CD player and although others have claimed it to be flimsy I have yet to have an issue with mine.
*I think the Super Lumina is much better still as it the Chord Sarum Super ARAY - my ears my system (mems)
Didn't experience any fragility when I had a Hi-Line either

I didn't actually have a problem with it, I was merely referring to all the reports of its fragility, and that made me rather apprehensive about handling it. My dealer confirmed its pristine state on return. :-)

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Chris Dolan

Neither have I Gary - I would have thought the pin configuration was different and that they do a different job but it's something I have never tried.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by gary yeowell

A quick search and here is a quote from Julian H, from a previous thread…. He seems to agree with me….

'You can't use a SNAIC. You are already using the best lead, the "Lavender" [thats what you should have, it sort of slightly bluey grey, see below] that came in the box. Others like the HiLine but I wouldn't bother. Don't waste your money, put it towards a FCXS.'

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Allante93

FRANK ABELATRADE MEMBER

12/19/0712:41 PM

Asbjoern,

Yes, there are differences.

The 5-pin grey/lavender lead is a Naim interconnect. It is thin and very floppy. It can only cope with signal, not power. The 5-pin DINs on this are 180 degree plugs.

The black SNAIC lead is stiffer and thicker than the lavender interconnect. This is because it carries both signal and power and is designed to be used either between a power amp and preamp or between power supply and preamp or source. Different connections require different plug configurations. A pre/power SNAIC is a 4-pin affair. A preamp/power supply lead is a 270 degree 5-pin item. There are others.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Huge

feeling_zen posted:
gary yeowell posted:
A Snaic cannot be used in place of a Lavender!
Yes it can. But you cannot use Lavender where a SNAIC would go between pre and PSU.

How do you connect it: A SNAIC5 is 5 pin 240°, an interconnect (e.g. 'Lavender') is 5 pin 180°?

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by feeling_zen

You can't use a SNAIC4, a SNAIC5 is required.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Allante93

Gentleman, Frank Albela, didn't clear that little issue!

Anyhow, when I purchased my Cdx2 last year, I didn't have a Lavender.

Hence, was forced to use Linn's rca connectors.

Not bad, but I must say, I did notice an improvement in SQ, once I purchased the Lavender!

Night and day? No!!!!!

BTW: Cdx2--+282--+HCDR--+3 x 250.2

Allante93!

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by feeling_zen

Huge posted:
feeling_zen posted:
gary yeowell posted:
A Snaic cannot be used in place of a Lavender!
Yes it can. But you cannot use Lavender where a SNAIC would go between pre and PSU.
How do you connect it: A SNAIC5 is 5 pin 240°, an interconnect (e.g. 'Lavender') is 5 pin 180°?

Hmmm it may well be one of the "Others". And therefore not as interchangeable as I recall. It certainly wasn't unusual though.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by gary yeowell

Not sure i'd say it was the 'de facto' upgrade. As i say, i have never heard of it, and it looks like i'm not alone.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Allante93

I'm I missing something!

"The 5-pin grey/lavender lead is a Naim interconnect. It is thin and very floppy. It can only cope with signal, not power. The 5-pin DINs on this are 180 degree plugs.

Different connections require different plug configurations. A pre/power SNAIC is a 4-pin affair. A preamp/power supply lead is a 270 degree 5-pin item. There are others."

Or is this Garbage!

Allante93!

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by feeling_zen

No, you're not missing something. A SNAIC can be a dual purpose lead and carry power as well as signal. but it also has use as a signal only interconnect.

Anyway, this innocuous commentof mine has taken the thread off course. Back to the HILine...

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Chris Dolan

Allante93 posted:
I'm I missing something!

An A instead of the I'

I think most of the comments so far are consistent that the 5-pin grey / lavender lead is a Naim interconnect for only signal, not power, with the 5-pin DINs comprising 180 degree plugs. The SNAIC carries both signal and power and the 5-pin version is a preamp / power supply lead that is not a 180 degree 5-pin item.

Presumably the power is carried by the extra pins?

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Huge

Chris Dolan posted:
...
I think most of the comments so far are consistent that the 5-pin grey / lavender lead is a Naim interconnect for only signal, not power, with the 5-pin DINs comprising 180 degree plugs. The SNAIC carries both signal and power and the 5-pin version is a preamp / power supply lead that is not a 180 degree 5-pin item.
Presumably the power is carried by the extra pins?

Correct.

Interconnect: pin2 = 0V, pins 3&5 are signal. 180° DIN

SNAIC 5: pin2 = 0V pins 4&5 are signal, pins 1&3 are power. 270° DIN

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Huge

I know the Mogami W2549 and W2534 cables (DIY) beat the 'Lavender' hands down, but I don't know how they compare to a 'HiLine'. It would be an interesting comparison.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Allante93

That's what I love about the Forum, very informative, when used properly!

Happy Fathers Day To All!

Allante93!

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by hungryhalibut

gary yeowell posted:
Never heard of anyone using a Snaic in place of a Lavender on a CD player…… and i still don't think it can be used.

That'll be because it cannot be used. Anyone who thinks it can is wrong.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Mike-B

Huge posted:
I know the Mogami W2549 and W2534 cables (DIY) beat the 'Lavender' hands down, but I don't know how they compare to a 'HiLine'. It would be an interesting comparison.

I tried numbers of cables - inc HiLine - when I was experimenting & eventually ended with Mogami W2549. HiLine for sure improves on the Lavender, I managed to borrow one for 4 weeks. Its better in the frequency extremes, more detail, dynamics & texture & very nice it is too; but it has an edge that I found hard to define & it took a while to get tuned in to it. Mogami has the same plus points in frequency extremes, dynamics & detail but not the hard edge. It has a slightly warmer overall presentation mainly from the bass. I just found it more satisfying overall (just) - personal taste in other words.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Richard Dane

Can't be used except to power the analog output stage on a CD3.5, 5, 5x, 5xs with a flatcap. SNAICs are only used on some power amps and power supplies. Never to take signal out of a source component.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by gary yeowell

That clears that up then, thanks Richard. That is exactly what i thought.

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Allante93

Richard Dane posted:
Can't be used except to power the analog output stage on a CD3.5, 5, 5x, 5xs with a flatcap. SNAICs are only used on some power amps and power supplies. Never to take signal out of a source component.

Posted By Frank Albela:

"The 5-pin grey/lavender lead is a Naim interconnect. It is thin and very floppy. It can only cope with signal, not power. The 5-pin DINs on this are 180 degree plugs. /True

The black SNAIC lead is stiffer and thicker than the lavender interconnect. /True

This is because it carries both signal and power and is designed to be used eitherbetween a power amp and preamp ?

or between power supply and preamp /True

or source.?

Different connections require different plug configurations.

A pre/power SNAIC is a 4-pin affair.

A preamp/power supply lead is a 270 degree 5-pin item.

There are others."

Math Major not an English Major, Mr Richard Dane, What Do you think about the above quote?

Gary the way to stick with your Beliefs!

Not trying to ruffle any feathers, just make sure I'm Correct!

Personally, I always thought for Source, say CDP, it was Lavender, then Hi Line, and Now SL 5 pin Din to Din for source!

Then SL IC Din to XLR, Between Amp and PS, unless one is using The Statement!

And in an Active System SL IC between Snaxo and Pre Amp!

Followed by SL Speaker Cable, and one has the Full Loom!

A Front & Rear End Dred System, Naim's Evolving New Sound, A hybrid between Flat Earth & Round Earth!

Allante93!

Posted on: 19 June 2016 by Chris Dolan

gary yeowell posted:
That clears that up then, thanks Richard. That is exactly what i thought.

That's encouraging