Intergrated headphone amp

INTEGRATED, not INTERGRATED.  This is the second recent thread with this spelling error.

The answer to your question is YES, in my experience with Naim amplifiers.

Dungassin posted:

INTEGRATED, not INTERGRATED.  This is the second recent thread with this spelling error.

The answer to your question is YES, in my experience with Naim amplifiers.

Oh dear yes well spotted on my error sir, do you think an extended burn-in may get rid of the extra "R" in my Intergrated

It's an interesting question you pose because I'm not sure how much the burn in of the pre itself effects the sound of the HP amp on an integrated. I've always assumed (maybe incorrectly?) my SN2's swingy burn in period was primarily associated with the amp. I really didn't use my HP out while the amp was burning in - only ever checked that it was working. The slight burn in I noticed with my former Headline when it was new was over in a matter of a day or so.

eazyryder posted:

Dungassin posted:

INTEGRATED, not INTERGRATED.  This is the second recent thread with this spelling error.

The answer to your question is YES, in my experience with Naim amplifiers.

Oh dear yes well spotted on my error sir, do you think an extended burn-in may get rid of the extra "R" in my Intergrated

I wouldn't have posted it, but I checked your profile, thinking English might not be your first languate, and the same spelling error is in there as well.  Sorry, I was just feeling insomniac and grumpy when I posted last night.

To further elaborate on your original question.  I have had quite a lot of Naim stuff over the years, and it all seems to improve with 'burn in'.  However, I have NEVER heard a piece of equipment (Naim or other make) transform from poor to good/OK with burn in.  All my Naim kit has sounded good from first switch on.

eazyryder posted:

Is there a "burn in " period on a new nait XS2s intergrated  internal class a headphone amp.

I feel the amplifier has gone through its burn in period as its really opened up and sounds great through my AE ref 1s, now I have started using its headphone output with my Grados I feel it sounds a little dull and closed in.

It IS dull and closed in. You could do waaay better with any $500 Yamaha, NAD, Onkyo, Cambridge or even a $300 Musical Paradise tube amp bought off Amazon.

As far as I'm concerned Naim lost a lot of credibility points on that one.

Iconoclast posted:

It IS dull and closed in. You could do waaay better

As far as I'm concerned Naim lost a lot of credibility points on that one.

I agree. Rather lifeless on my 250Beyer T70s which were splendid on my FCXS powered Headline.

The new integrateds HP amp might be intended for 32Ω HPs.

What Grados are you using?

What are you comparing it to? What were you using before?

Solid Air posted:

What are you comparing it to? What were you using before?

I have tried my grados in a Cambridge audio headbox s - Audiolab mdac- nad 375bee integrated and my current chord hugo and IMO the naim XS2 is probably the poorest sounding.

I don't really use headphones so it isn't a big issue really, was just trying out the Naims built in offering.

I have Grado SR60i (32Ω) and Beyer DT880 (250Ω) and they both sound lifeless as did the Shure 840s and Senn 600s that I also tried. The headphone out on my cheap Klipsch Promedia computer speakers is much more involving.

With the exception of late night TV and movies I don't even bother listening to HPs on my main rig anymore.

I suppose Naim want you to buy the Headline. If I was really into headphones I'd look elsewhere. Naim obviously haven't understood what a large part of the market they're losing out on by offering such lackluster HP products.

My experience was the opposite.  Straight out of the box I thought my XS2 was excellent with Grado SR60is.

I'm using a headline now in my second system and I think it's roughly the equal of the HP Amp in the XS2.  

SR60s sound ''OK'' and better than the Beyers but even a very basic smartphone or MP3 player can drive those. It's clear and articulate (good for dialogue) but far from the punchy and engaging sound that I like for music. I'm not a bass head but when I listen to headphones I like to feel the bass and kick drums. If that's a colored sound then I like color in my headphones.

Ian Brown posted:

My experience was the opposite.  Straight out of the box I thought my XS2 was excellent with Grado SR60is.

I'm using a headline now in my second system and I think it's roughly the equal of the HP Amp in the XS2.  

Well I have had my Grado SR80is for many years now and have tried them with many different sources.

After your comment on the headline I think I shall be avoiding that one.

Do whatever makes you happy.  I think the headline is good - I think you'd have to go very high-end to beat it.  One of the advantages of the Headline over the XS2 is that you get to leave your phones plugged in (I'm using sr225s now) when you're listenning to your speakers.  But I also like my sr60s with my unitiqute - so maybe I'm just a naim headphone amp guy.

I use Grado SR325e and have a very high opinion of them. I rarely use them with my main system, but whenever I do the combination seems excellent - great timing, transparency. and musicality. More commonly I use them with my office iMac, Dragonfly and Jitterbug, and they're great there too, although leaner, with a fraction less depth. 

I hesitate to suggest buying more expensive headphones - I understand that yours have sounded better with other kit, and it's fair enough to expect Naim to match or exceed that - but the SR325e really is a huge step up, and you might find it suits the amp better.

Solid Air posted:

I use Grado SR325e and have a very high opinion of them. I rarely use them with my main system, but whenever I do the combination seems excellent - great timing, transparency. and musicality. More commonly I use them with my office iMac, Dragonfly and Jitterbug, and they're great there too, although leaner, with a fraction less depth. 

I hesitate to suggest buying more expensive headphones - I understand that yours have sounded better with other kit, and it's fair enough to expect Naim to match or exceed that - but the SR325e really is a huge step up, and you might find it suits the amp better.

The headphones are NOT the problem. 

Solid Air posted:

I use Grado SR325e and have a very high opinion of them. I rarely use them with my main system, but whenever I do the combination seems excellent - great timing, transparency. and musicality. More commonly I use them with my office iMac, Dragonfly and Jitterbug, and they're great there too, although leaner, with a fraction less depth. 

I hesitate to suggest buying more expensive headphones - I understand that yours have sounded better with other kit, and it's fair enough to expect Naim to match or exceed that - but the SR325e really is a huge step up, and you might find it suits the amp better.

 I have actually had interest in SR325e but with the idea of using them with my Chord Hugo.

ICONOCLAST has posted about using many different HPs with the XS2 and found its performance subpar.

I think using more expensive headphones would exacerbate the XS2s poor HP sound output

Have you tried your Grado SR325e with other sources apart from the XS2 and IMAC?

My SN2 internal headphone output sounds great, until you compare it to my Hugo output which is just miles ahead.  Can't comment on other Naim built in headphone amps but the SN2 is no more than OK in my opinion.  I'm using Meze 99 Classics as headphones

dayjay posted:

My SN2 internal headphone output sounds great, until you compare it to my Hugo output which is just miles ahead.  Can't comment on other Naim built in headphone amps but the SN2 is no more than OK in my opinion.  I'm using Meze 99 Classics as headphones

Are you comparing the bare Hugo to the SN headphone amp being fed by the Hugo?

Ian Brown posted:

dayjay posted:

My SN2 internal headphone output sounds great, until you compare it to my Hugo output which is just miles ahead.  Can't comment on other Naim built in headphone amps but the SN2 is no more than OK in my opinion.  I'm using Meze 99 Classics as headphones

Are you comparing the bare Hugo to the SN headphone amp being fed by the Hugo?

Yes

dayjay posted:

Ian Brown posted:

dayjay posted:

My SN2 internal headphone output sounds great, until you compare it to my Hugo output which is just miles ahead.  Can't comment on other Naim built in headphone amps but the SN2 is no more than OK in my opinion.  I'm using Meze 99 Classics as headphones

Are you comparing the bare Hugo to the SN headphone amp being fed by the Hugo?

Yes

That's very interesting - I'll have to keep my mind open. 

The difference is huge, I was shocked to be honest.  I don't use headphones a great deal so I could easily live with the SN2 output, it's certainly not bad, but the Hugo is brilliant in comparison.  On the plus side the Sn2 output is 'free' so to speak

dayjay posted:

On the plus side the Sn2 output is 'free' so to speak

That is certainly how I've looked at it since Naim added the headphone amps to the integrated (I think that's the correct spelling!) range.   I really have to give that Hugo a listen to!  

dayjay posted:

On the plus side the Sn2 output is 'free' so to speak

I'm glad to see that your glass is half full.

I waited quite a while before jumping on the Naim bandwagon mainly because they didn't include a HP out on their integrateds. I jumped when I learned they had added this feature. I'm not much of a headphone fan anymore so, for my needs, I can live with the mediocre output on my XS2. It just bugs me to see that Naim didn't make more of an effort. Like they say: If your going to do something, do it right.

I think they improved a lot with NAC272 with HP out, not at Hugo or even Mojo level in my opinion, anyone who is little bit serious about HPs should try Violectric V200, it is not the best of the best but still can not beat it for VFM.

What i want is a top contender headphone amp from Naim, now that they have the headphones ( Focal Utopia ) to go with it.