202 and 200DR vs. Supernait 2

I tried the 102 & 202 both beeing too sterile closed-in and bit harsh, with less music played I ended up with 72 beeing better to my ears with no need for remote and much cheaper than 202. I wouldn't purchase a new 202 these days, new range could be just around the corner and development in audio changes overnight.

82/282 has more details & resolution but overall musicality affordable = 72 (or 52) imo

Above valid using several Naim poweramp with/without external PSU

I didn't like the original SN at all, no real experience with SN2, I'm in the Nait 2 camp which imo is the best sounding of them all (Nait's)

As you have the two options in your house, surely you can decide? It matters not a jot what others think. Remember that to sound as it should, the 202 needs a napsc power supply. 

I find 202/200 napsc pretty much superior to any SN.

its not warmer is just mature.

Alzo it s not at all subtle the difference, it is not only airier, less harsh,more luminous and not shut In much better in placing  voices and instruments ,  it s just in a total different league. What will replace  it  will be soon l'ooked after

the serious stuff in naim starts there.

Just go with your ears. My ears said 202/200 was not for me and the SN2 was very easy to live with. Having owned a 552/300 in the past, i can live with the SN2 but not the 202/200. It is a transition amp that most move on from, not as complete as a SN2 and far less capable than a 282/250. Anyway that's my opinion which means absolutely nothing, as it's only your ears you have to please. Also note i am talking pre DR, so for all i know, the 200DR could be a completely different animal indeed!

To each his own. Good 

trust your ears.nice

but why Should one consider a 202/200 a transition amp ,its a mistery To me, one should choose the one fits his system best.

and how a SN might be more complete is pure no-sense unless @ naim have Made a great mistake in their line and priced the other way round or , even worse , Classic separates have become Obsolete   And have forgotten to discontinue. Hype is becoming a real threat I reckon

Almost everyone i know moves on from a 202/200. Like i said, my experience, which may be different to yours. No less valid, and i won't start calling your opinion nonsense..

The SN2 is a great amplifier as far I am concerned, and as the OP suggested, I quite like that there's less 'what next?' bait beyond a HiCap, which I have not added.  Starting with the DAC-V1 on my short Naim journey, I considered adding a 200 or 250, but decided that move could wait until I knew where my source was heading.  The DAC-V1 was never intended to become part of my primary source, but it did, and does partner the SN2 very well.  In the future I may try a 282 / 250 depending on developments in the digital / DAC product line, but for now the existing combo is one hell of a good setup to enjoy while I wait to see how things progress.

If they do, and I believe they do, it s because they start tasting great sound and they want more,they become addicted to results.

SN ,SU are ,instead, good solutions for people Who are pleased and less willing to climB, in fact it s the ultimate integrated.

but sound it s a different matter.

Who want s to depart From SN usually bypass the 202 in favour of 282 that s why i reckon people diseegard 202/200 In fact I think it s an opinion which got stronger after the release of the big integrated .and Also because 202 has not been upgraded for long. 

No, not really, more like it doesn't really satisfy long term. The 102/180 was no great shakes, and the 202/200 is cut from the same cloth. So let's just say we disagree.

102 o 72 /180 was and is still better than the original SN.

But the press was all in favour of the new.

US  press .

total immotivated hYpedtrash  imho.

My Nait2 is much better than the original SN! A 72/160 or 72/180 much better too. The 102 however...

I moved from a SN2 to a 202/HCDR/Napsc 200 and thought it more revealing than the SN2...but then moved on up...basically because you can (If a Super Supernait existed then the same temptation would exist). The fact that the 202/200 is near the bottom of the pre-power ladder is not a reason to think it a poor choice.

From (my) experience, I'm with Antonio on this one.

G

The 202/200 left me cold and I much preferred the SN2.  I like it even more with a Hicap DR connected.

Janus posted:

Has anyone else compared these two? I currently own the 200DR and DAC-V1 (as pre). I have had a 202 on loan and I really like the sound of it (sources are digital through the V1 as DAC). I had already come to the conclusion that I prefer the 200DR over the older 200 - even without a pre, second point is that adding the 202 Pre is a major definitely step up (and of course a 282 is even nicer but that is not relevant now).

To compare, I also have a SuperNait 2 on demo. My initial findings is that the SN2 has more muscle and sounds warmer whereas the 202/200DR combination is more 'airy". I think I prefer the 202/200 but I really am not looking forward to upgrading the coming years (getting that upgrade itch). The SN2 is nice because you could add a HiCAP and you come to a dead-end.

Any thought about this and if any others have compared these two combinations - not the old 200 - there seem to be enough threads about this on the forum.

I'm with Hungryhalibut here. Since you have both Supernait 2 and 202/200DR, you surely can decide which will give a "better sound" rather than relying on other people's opinions?

I am guessing you have a slight hesitation to upgrade to the NAC202 as that will pave way for a NAC282 while the SN2 will be more upgrade-proof. Since you have listened to both amps with your system, my advice is to get the one that you like more. I am not sure how the Hicap DR will transform the SN2 but most experiences here also suggest that the Hicap DR will significantly improve the NAC202. You surely wouldn't want to pick something that isn't as enjoyable just because it will stop you from upgrading (the SN2+HCDR) and regret later if it doesn't sound as airy or open as the NAC202/NAP200 DR. At any rate, having the SN2+HCDR may not necessarily suggest that you have reached a "dead-end".

Interesting that you find the NAP 200 DR to be better than the NAP 200. If you don't have the Hicap DR, that does not come as a surprise since the NAP 200 DR is powering the NAC 202. If you have the Hicap DR with the NAC 202, there might be little (or negligible) differences between the NAP 200 and NAP 200 DR.

Antonio1 posted:

If they do, and I believe they do, it s because they start tasting great sound and they want more,they become addicted to results.

SN ,SU are ,instead, good solutions for people Who are pleased and less willing to climB, in fact it s the ultimate integrated.

but sound it s a different matter.

Who want s to depart From SN usually bypass the 202 in favour of 282 that s why i reckon people diseegard 202/200 In fact I think it s an opinion which got stronger after the release of the big integrated .and Also because 202 has not been upgraded for long. 

The NAC 202, NAC 282, NAC 252 and NAC 552 are introduced in year 2000 if I am not mistaken. All of these preamps have (equally) not been upgraded for a long time.

I used to find the 202/200 a little dry, and really required the NAPSC to tame the excesses in the treble. I much preferred the SUPERNAIT2. However, that all changed with the 200DR. In 202/200DR guise, we were getting really quite sweet results and the pre/power was now rather better than the Supernait2. Where the SN2 had sounded balanced, now it was sounding a little dark. The 202/200DR also made the SN2 sound a touch ponderous by comparison.

So overall, it's a thumbs up for the new 202/200DR combo, restored to its rightful place above the Supernait2.

Frank.

Frank Abela posted:

I used to find the 202/200 a little dry, and really required the NAPSC to tame the excesses in the treble. I much preferred the SUPERNAIT2. However, that all changed with the 200DR. In 202/200DR guise, we were getting really quite sweet results and the pre/power was now rather better than the Supernait2. Where the SN2 had sounded balanced, now it was sounding a little dark. The 202/200DR also made the SN2 sound a touch ponderous by comparison.

So overall, it's a thumbs up for the new 202/200DR combo, restored to its rightful place above the Supernait2.

Frank.

I presume your evaluation of the 202/200DR and Supernait2 was without the Hicap DR? Did you compare both 202/200DR and 202/200 with the Hicap DR? If you have, did you find any tangible difference between the two combinations (202/200DR/Hicap DR vs 202/200/Hicap DR) ? 

From your post above, the 202/200 DR > 202/200. Any thoughts how the 202/200/Hicap DR will compare to the 202/200 DR?

I would broadly agree with Frank's opinion of the 202/NAPSC/200DR vs Supernait 2. Both nice, but the separates won it for me. In the end though, I decided to save a bit more money and go for a 282/200DR.

282 with a bare 200DR is actually a surprisingly good combo! I've set it up recently for a friend of mine - it's a joy to listen to.

Thanks all for your input. A couple of closing remarks from my side, I had brought the demo 202 back to the dealer in exchange of the demo SN2 when I posted this, and comparing sound by memory is not an easy task. I think I really wanted to prefer the SN2 (a nice minimal solution) but in the end the 202/200DR was much more revealing and just more enjoyable, this combination really puts a smile to my face, the SN2 did not really. As a source I typically use the Mac Mini with Roon and HQPlayer into microRendu into a DAC-V1. I also own a Nait 2 but have not compared this amp to the 202/200DR combination.

From previous sessions I can concur with Frank - the 200DR sounded a lot better than the normal 200. I have no idea how a NAPSC, HICAP DR or 282 will improve the sound (I am sure it will) but I will not move there soon, focus will be on listening music. Btw, I was able to purchase the 202 ex-demo a bit over half the new price which seems to be a fair deal. Thanks again.

Hope you enjoy the new amp. Forgetting about the gear and just enjoying the music is a good attitude! However, I would consider adding a NAPSC if your finances can stand it, as to my ears it really helps get the best out of the 202 for a relatively small cost. 

+1 for NAPSC - relatively inexpensive and practically a 'must' for 202

Trust me, adding a NAPSC to the 202 is a revelation!  In many ways the uplift is so great I wonder why it is not supplied as standard.

I'm currently running a 202/NAPSC/200DR, very impressed.

Regards,

Mark

regardless what some may say, i mean what they LIKE, the 202 is quite superior when comapred in the same setup with the preamp section of SN, be it 1 or 2, as the 200 (DR or not) is superior to the power amp section in SN, 1 or 2.

so there is no question if 202/200 is better than SN, because is certainly is. the thing is the older generation tended to have quite a different presentation, and some preffer the sweeter/rounder presentation of the SN. nowadays, Naim amps are a bit more neutral, so is is mainly performance-wise that we get to compare them, and it is as easy as day and night to see that 202/200DR is better than SN2.

also, is is fairly easy to see that the 200DR has significant sound improvements over the original 200, even if the PSU for preamp inside is not used!

done the comparison myself for quite a few days with a 172 on the front and S400 on the back-end. i also inserted a 250DR in this mix, and price-wise, the 200DR was the better choice, i heard more significant improvements when moving from 200 to 200DR than from moving from 200DR to 250DR, in this particular setup.

so prefference is one thing and performance is completely another!

we may like our wifes/girlfriends/spouses infinitely more that the latest bikini contest girls winners, but speaking in absolute terms, as "performance" figures, they might not be up to the task. as for cars, some like the more comfortable ride, some the sportier. but speed can be measured precisely and cannot be argued about!

just my (few) cents...

Here we go again....