nDAC really sings...

When I added a 555PS to my DAC  in place of XPS2  I thought it was a bit lean and lacking in weight.  Over four days I became accustomed to its "less is more" style. I was only too pleased to put the XPS2 back and return the 555PS to the dealer. But only until I got home after  taking  it back. Where had all the music gone? Sure, these was some excellent HI Fi going on, but  not much else. Anyone who wants 500 level DAC should listen to DAC/555PS.   It's that good.

Congratulations. Big fun ahead for you.

Interesting Adam.  Your findings and conclusions match my experience, though I use a CDX2.2 as a digital source.  

I found the XPS2 and XPS2DR gave a fairly  modest performance improvement on my nDAC when I tried them against my, then, XP5XS.  Not enough of an improvement to justify double the cost of the XP5XS. However a 555PS on the nDAC was a whole different league, outperforming the XP5XS by a country mile.  

I'm a very big fan of the nDAC and even prefer it to the much more expensive NDS. The firmware update gave it a significant performance boost, and free one too 

Mike

MDS posted:

Interesting Adam.  Your findings and conclusions match my experience, though I use a CDX2.2 as a digital source.  

I found the XPS2 and XPS2DR gave a fairly  modest performance improvement on my nDAC when I tried them against my, then, XP5XS.  Not enough of an improvement to justify double the cost of the XP5XS. However a 555PS on the nDAC was a whole different league, outperforming the XP5XS by a country mile.  

I'm a very big fan of the nDAC and even prefer it to the much more expensive NDS. The firmware update gave it a significant performance boost, and free one too 

Mike

Mike - forgot to mention: I also run my CDX2.2 into the same nDAC - prefer it that way. This is now a seriously good CD player. Looks a bit impressive  too - 3 boxes 

Adam

Adam Zielinski posted:

 

* Quality of the source, irrespective of a pre-power / integrated is of paramount importance. Cannot expect a good preamp to improve a poor quality source it was all lost at the start.

Agreed. That's what Ivor Tiefenbrun was trying to tell us decades ago, but the message seems to have got lost somewhere over recent years. The logic may get forgotten, but it will never go away!

Hi Adam, enjoy, your findings match my experiences too. The 555PS on the NDAC really is vital to fully enjoy the NDAC potential.

i would say the better your amps, the more accepting of lesser sources ithey appear to be in terms of making them sound enjoyable... I have found that pleasantly surprising and counter intuitive. That aside enjoy your NDAC, BTW I found Powerline into 555PS and the standard lead into the NDAC aux power subtly provided the best performance..

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

 I found Powerline into 555PS and the standard lead into the NDAC aux power subtly provided the best performance..

Interesting. I can see why this may work - the internal nDAC power supplies feeds the digital sction of the nDAC.

For now I have PowerLines on both, but will test the standard Naim lead.

I only have had a DR'd 555PS on nDAC and liked it a lot before going to NDS for more detailed, refined and airy, where nDAC seemed to be a bit more forward and immediate. I wonder sometimes in what terms some of you preferred non-DR 555PS to 555DR on nDAC.

Chag -

I find nDAC to be a bit more 'organic' and 'analogue-like' with a non-DR version of 555PS.

Chag... posted:

I only have had a DR'd 555PS on nDAC and liked it a lot before going to NDS for more detailed, refined and airy, where nDAC seemed to be a bit more forward and immediate. I wonder sometimes in what terms some of you preferred non-DR 555PS to 555DR on nDAC.

Chag -

For me the nonDR 555PS helped the NDAC sound organic and appealing... The DR 555PS to made the NDAC sound more clean and detailed but less enjoyable or what perhaps might be said less 'musical'. However this was on the earlier firmware and might be different now. Interestingly I found the NDS sounded more 'musical' and enjoyable with the DR 555PS.

Simon

Adam Zielinski posted:

Interesting. I can see why this may work - the internal nDAC power supplies feeds the digital sction of the nDAC.

Indeed but to my way of thinking the Powerline should have improved both feeds, but the sound lost some of its organic appealing signature with a Powerline on the aux digital feed. Perhaps this might also vary from environment to environment...but absolutely worth a try.

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Interestingly I found the NDS sounded more 'musical' and enjoyable with the DR 555PS.

Simon

My observation too.

"NDX with 555PS a bit off"

Maybe a change in amp would correct this.  Not completely sure, but I believe NDX with non-DR 555PS was Naim's top streamer combination at one stage.  This set up would eliminate a few components in the chain.

DAC is an upgrade for NDX and on top of that there is  the option of adding power supplies to the DAC. A few people ran NDX/PS with DAC/PS and said it was the best of all combinations.

Agree with Harry.
Adding a 555PS to an NDX seemed a little bit too much for it - it took the performance to another level, but also exposed some of the not-so-nice features of the NDX.

NDX + nDAC + 2 555PS it better sound good, because it became a very but very expensive source.... it is still better value compare to CD555

I wish i can listen to it...

Enjoy it Adam

Emre posted:

NDX + nDAC + 2 555PS it better sound good, because it became a very but very expensive source.... it is still better value compare to CD555

I wish i can listen to it...

Enjoy it Adam

 

 

Emre - there is only one 555PS on the nDAC . There are two digital 'transports' connected to the nDAC (NDX and CDX2.2).

The other 555PS (DR) is connected to my NDS, residing in a living room.

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Hi Adam, enjoy, your findings match my experiences too. The 555PS on the NDAC really is vital to fully enjoy the NDAC potential.

i would say the better your amps, the more accepting of lesser sources ithey appear to be in terms of making them sound enjoyable... I have found that pleasantly surprising and counter intuitive. That aside enjoy your NDAC, BTW I found Powerline into 555PS and the standard lead into the NDAC aux power subtly provided the best performance..

I agree! also with an active system, but this finding is rejected by most. I am still surprised how good my Bluesound node original version sounds into 252.

Claus   

Adam Zielinski posted:

Emre posted:

NDX + nDAC + 2 555PS it better sound good, because it became a very but very expensive source.... it is still better value compare to CD555

I wish i can listen to it...

Enjoy it Adam

 

 

Emre - there is only one 555PS on the nDAC . There are two digital 'transports' connected to the nDAC (NDX and CDX2.2).

The other 555PS (DR) is connected to my NDS, residing in a living room.

sorry i thought there was another one connected to transport, you got too many stuff it is hard to keep count  

So NDS+555PS vs NDX+nDAC+555PS ? 

Emre posted

sorry i thought there was another one connected to transport, you got too many stuff it is hard to keep count  

So NDS+555PS vs NDX+nDAC+555PS ? 

Yes - Mrs Z thinks I'm a little bit insane, but realises it's a farily harmles hobby and she does appreciate good music.

* NDS + 555PS is in a living room, connected to 252 / SCDR / 250DR.

* NDX+nDAC+555PS is in a library connected to a SuperNait2

My finding too.

NDac + XPS2 a bit underwhelming and almost preferred the NDac naked! I then added a pre-loved but serviced 555PS to my NDac with the recent software upgrade and the whole system went into orbit. Everything took on a holographic sense of realism with better PRAT and instrument timbre. I'm also using a CDX2.2 as the transport. I'd actually wondered if there was any further benefit from perhaps putting an XPS2 onto the CDX2 to provide a more stable supply? Yes, I know this then becomes a 4 box CDP but if it improves things further why not?

Geko posted:

 if there was any further benefit from perhaps putting an XPS2 onto the CDX2 to provide a more stable supply? Yes, I know this then becomes a 4 box CDP but if it improves things further why not?

I once asked the same question and the answer I got that there would be very little gain. However some of the forum members reported improvements, when NDX (used as a digital transport into nDAC / 555PS) was powered by an XPS.

Adam Zielinski posted:

Emre posted

sorry i thought there was another one connected to transport, you got too many stuff it is hard to keep count  

So NDS+555PS vs NDX+nDAC+555PS ? 

Yes - Mrs Z thinks I'm a little bit insane, but realises it's a farily harmles hobby and she does appreciate good music.

* NDS + 555PS is in a living room, connected to 252 / SCDR / 250DR.

* NDX+nDAC+555PS is in a library connected to a SuperNait2

I think I need to also become a little more 'insane'...my wife says it's work in progress 

Adam Zielinski posted:

Emre posted

sorry i thought there was another one connected to transport, you got too many stuff it is hard to keep count  

So NDS+555PS vs NDX+nDAC+555PS ? 

Yes - Mrs Z thinks I'm a little bit insane, but realises it's a farily harmles hobby and she does appreciate good music.

* NDS + 555PS is in a living room, connected to 252 / SCDR / 250DR.

* NDX+nDAC+555PS is in a library connected to a SuperNait2

Mine is same, keep me at home chatting with middle aged man on power supplies etc

which one do you think is a better source Adam? Almost same price right?

Emre posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

Emre posted

sorry i thought there was another one connected to transport, you got too many stuff it is hard to keep count  

So NDS+555PS vs NDX+nDAC+555PS ? 

Yes - Mrs Z thinks I'm a little bit insane, but realises it's a farily harmles hobby and she does appreciate good music.

* NDS + 555PS is in a living room, connected to 252 / SCDR / 250DR.

* NDX+nDAC+555PS is in a library connected to a SuperNait2

Mine is same, keep me at home chatting with middle aged man on power supplies etc

which one do you think is a better source Adam? Almost same price right?

Difficult to tell both are very good and sound fantastically un-digital.

Looking at list prices NDS/555PS is still more expensive than NDX + DAC + 555PS. It also has two advantages: two boxes vs 3 boxes and one mains lead vs 3.

Geko posted:

My finding too.

NDac + XPS2 a bit underwhelming and almost preferred the NDac naked! I then added a pre-loved but serviced 555PS to my NDac with the recent software upgrade and the whole system went into orbit. Everything took on a holographic sense of realism with better PRAT and instrument timbre. I'm also using a CDX2.2 as the transport. I'd actually wondered if there was any further benefit from perhaps putting an XPS2 onto the CDX2 to provide a more stable supply? Yes, I know this then becomes a 4 box CDP but if it improves things further why not?

Geko - I've had a XP5XS powering my CDX2.2, used as a digital transport, since I bought it.  When I came to do this I already had a nDAC (then my only piece of Naim kit) and was feeding it from a Accuphase CD transport. I wanted to try an XPS on my nDAC.  My dealer brought one round and it sounded pretty good, but he brought round a CDX2.2 on the hunch that it might outperform my Accuphase transport. It did.  Of course, I then wanted both but my dealer persuaded to be patient as he wanted to try the newly released XP5XS on both i.e. the CDX2.2 and the nDAC.  when that was tried it was pretty clear that a four-box CDX2.2/XP5XS to nDAC/XP5XS outperformed the tradition three-box CDX2.2 to nDAC/XPS2.  I've had a four-box CD set-up ever since.

So a long way of saying 'yes' to your question but I would save a bit of money by putting a XP5XS on the CDX2.2 rather than an XPS2 as it seems that most of the sonic benefit comes from simply separating the PSU from the transport rather than the quality of that PSU.