Impressions of Statement from Hifi Corner Falkirk Event

I was very underwhelmed when i heard it on what I think was the Focal Grande Utopias. I was suitably blown away when hearing it on Ovator 600's however.

I can never shake the feeling that if it were not for the business arrangement (marriage of necessity) that Naim would never give Focal speakers a second thought. 

Not saying anything bad about them but they have always struck me as about un- Naim as you can get. 

I've heard that like Ovator's they are very divisive but at the opposite end of the scale. 

Plenty find that Naim electronics and Focal speakers make a superb combination which is great. But knowing how different they are from the sound of any speaker Naim ever built, Focals can't have been in mind when designing the electronics. I am always surprised they use them in shows. Always wonder whether they chose to or are obliged to.

Yes the old Focals like the Utopias spoil a Naim system. The harshness is exactly the problem. How or why the Focal Sq people find this sound signature to be the best is beyond me. In a few years there will hopefully be a Focal model matching the statement voiced like the new Sophra 2 and 3 models. 

@Claus-Theogersen just so my coment is not misunderstood, I don't have a problem liking the Naim-Focal sound. I just don't believe for a second the result is what Naim have in mind. To that end, pairing them at shows doesn't make sense beyond not pissing off the mutual investors.

I also heard the focal so before with statement set up and also found it a disappointment, I guess the mentioned harshness also comes from the Focals...

I would have liked to have heard my SL2 driven by the full Statement, and not the Focals that were played at the time. At least i heard a Forum members active DBL with S1 pre, so i know what it's actually capable of.

I've always wondered about those really expensive Focals. To me it looks like the same cone material in the mid/bass units and the same tweeter as what I have in my Chorus 806 WSE's. I use them in a bigger room than that square(!) demo space and there's no harshness. Too much speaker.

Just looking at the proximity of the Utopias to the wall and corners I'm not surprised there was harshness.

Regards,

Lindsay

Why demonstrate vanguard amplification with sub-par loudspeakers in an inappropriate room? I just don't get it.

Surely someone sets it up and has a good listen before opening to public scrutiny? If it's not up to it then better not to expose your flagship product to this sort of reception I'd have thought.

G

Naim used Dynaudio to demo the statement series at the 2016 Axpona show that I attended, harsh would be the last word I would use to describe the sound.

I attended the Statement system demo, and I concur with quite a number of the comments made above.

My impression of the system (as a whole) was that it sounded absolutely stunning on a few of the demo tracks, underwhelming on others, and pretty unpleasant (strident and harsh) on a small number of the tracks played.

It's difficult to isolate one particular component for blame, since I have never heard any of the elements individually before the demo, but I would agree that the problem probably lay with a combination of the speakers (at least in conjunction with the Naim amps and cables),  the relatively small size of the room for speakers of that sheer size, and coupled with the fact that a number of the CD tracks (selected by participants in the demo) were probably themselves flawed in respect of their production.

I have no doubt that the Focal speakers can sound very good in the right circumstances, but in this case the bass had been significantly tuned down to cater for the room limitations and so I don't think they were heard at their best. Also, the music was played at a very high volume which probably exacerbated the treble harshness on a number of the tracks played. I suspect that many who attended the demo (like me) play music pretty loudly on their own systems, but because of the sheer power and scale of the Statement and Focals we probably didn't appreciate just how loud the music was. I feel that this also contributed to my view that the system sounded awesome on a few of the tracks, but quite unpleasant on some of the other possibly less well recorded material.

To illustrate this, when I got home I immediately listened to a couple of the demo tracks on my own two systems.

The first track I listened to at home was "Gaslighting Abbie" by Steely Dan. This was one of the tracks that had underwhelmed me at the demo. I first played this on my main system, and the track sounded hugely better to my ears than on the Statement system. The bass was much more pronounced, articulate and dynamic, and the slight harshness I had heard at the demo simply wasn't there. The track did not sound quite so good on my second system, but still very good, and  far preferable to my ears than on the Statement system. 

However, I then played what for me was probably the stand out track at the demo by a band I had never before heard of - "Keep the Wolves away" by Uncle Lucius. Now this track  sounded absolutely amazing at the demo, with an absolutely effortless power and dynamics,  but retaining the subtlety of some of the background instrumentation. I have access to Tidal, and so was very keen to hear the track (and other material from the group) on my own system. Now the track did sound great on my systems, but there was definitely something missing by comparison. Good though I think my system is, it just couldn't rival (to my ears) the sheer scale and effortless power of the Statement system.

So my conclusion is that the system would probably sound absolutely fantastic in the right room, and playing the 'right' music. However, I would probably want to hear the Statement with a number of different speakers if I were seriously considering a purchase.  

By the way as an aside, the NDS with twin 555 power supplies was introduced at the demo as being Naim's top of the range streamer "at the moment".

Also interestingly, the tracks played (all CD quality and not high-res) were apparently a mixture of FLACS (no transcoding on the fly) and WAVS, but there didn't appear to be any clear preference from the perspective of any of the shop or Naim personal for one format over the other.

An enjoyable session, despite the mixed success of the demo as a whole.   

The above Naim- Dynaudio system at this years Axpona was easily one of the best at show, however the best sound by far was the system below.  Hmmmm, what is the common denominator between the two systems. HINT, look at the speakers.

It's interesting how people can attend a demonstration of a £250,000 system and come away underwhelmed. Is it the speakers, is it the room, who knows, but if Naim fans on Naim's very own Forum react like this, something must be amiss, and Naim would be wise to sort it out. Surely people attending should be shouting from the rooftops about how marvellous it all is?

The other thing that strikes me is the comments about some music sounding great and other music dreadful. I've always found that on a really good system you could chuck virtually anything at it, and it would be an enjoyable listen, whether it was a great recoding or not. Maybe this one is just too good, if such a thing is possible. 

Hmack posted:

I attended the Statement system demo, and I concur with quite a number of the comments made above.

My impression of the system (as a whole) was that it sounded absolutely stunning on a few of the demo tracks, underwhelming on others, and pretty unpleasant (strident and harsh) on a small number of the tracks played.

It's difficult to isolate one particular component for blame, since I have never heard any of the elements individually before the demo, but I would agree that the problem probably lay with a combination of the speakers (at least in conjunction with the Naim amps and cables),  the relatively small size of the room for speakers of that sheer size, and coupled with the fact that a number of the CD tracks (selected by participants in the demo) were probably themselves flawed in respect of their production.

I have no doubt that the Focal speakers can sound very good in the right circumstances, but in this case the bass had been significantly tuned down to cater for the room limitations and so I don't think they were heard at their best. Also, the music was played at a very high volume which probably exacerbated the treble harshness on a number of the tracks played. I suspect that many who attended the demo (like me) play music pretty loudly on their own systems, but because of the sheer power and scale of the Statement and Focals we probably didn't appreciate just how loud the music was. I feel that this also contributed to my view that the system sounded awesome on a few of the tracks, but quite unpleasant on some of the other possibly less well recorded material.

To illustrate this, when I got home I immediately listened to a couple of the demo tracks on my own two systems.

The first track I listened to at home was "Gaslighting Abbie" by Steely Dan. This was one of the tracks that had underwhelmed me at the demo. I first played this on my main system, and the track sounded hugely better to my ears than on the Statement system. The bass was much more pronounced, articulate and dynamic, and the slight harshness I had heard at the demo simply wasn't there. The track did not sound quite so good on my second system, but still very good, and  far preferable to my ears than on the Statement system. 

However, I then played what for me was probably the stand out track at the demo by a band I had never before heard of - "Keep the Wolves away" by Uncle Lucius. Now this track  sounded absolutely amazing at the demo, with an absolutely effortless power and dynamics,  but retaining the subtlety of some of the background instrumentation. I have access to Tidal, and so was very keen to hear the track (and other material from the group) on my own system. Now the track did sound great on my systems, but there was definitely something missing by comparison. Good though I think my system is, it just couldn't rival (to my ears) the sheer scale and effortless power of the Statement system.

So my conclusion is that the system would probably sound absolutely fantastic in the right room, and playing the 'right' music. However, I would probably want to hear the Statement with a number of different speakers if I were seriously considering a purchase.  

By the way as an aside, the NDS with twin 555 power supplies was introduced at the demo as being Naim's top of the range streamer "at the moment".

Also interestingly, the tracks played (all CD quality and not high-res) were apparently a mixture of FLACS (no transcoding on the fly) and WAVS, but there didn't appear to be any clear preference from the perspective of any of the shop or Naim personal for one format over the other.

An enjoyable session, despite the mixed success of the demo as a whole.   

An excellent review, a very informative and interesting assessment...

Perhaps many high end systems at audio shows are put together based, not on what will sound best, but rather on decisions made by marketing, management or local dealers.  Someone, somewhere makes the decision that they want to show off their flagship electronics with another manufacturer's flagship speakers and another manufacturer's flagship wiring, etc., with little or no regard to the fact that these products were never designed to specifically work together in harmony.

joesilva posted:

Perhaps many high end systems at audio shows are put together based, not on what will sound best, but rather on decisions made by marketing, management or local dealers.  Someone, somewhere makes the decision that they want to show off their flagship electronics with another manufacturer's flagship speakers and another manufacturer's flagship wiring, etc., with little or no regard to the fact that these products were never designed to specifically work together in harmony.

Added to that,  maybe best not to demo in a room the size of a broom cupboard... 

Oi! It's bigger than my room.

-1.......With your SL2's up against the wall, you can probably fit more brooms in then you think! 

Its odd that Naim and the dealer thought to use speakers that big in a smallish room.  You've got to wonder what they were trying to achieve.

I've heard the Statement with Grand Utopia in 2 different very large rooms (and in one of those rooms twice, once across the room, once down the room) and they have been strident in all cases, to the point that we had to leave one of the dems because the sound was painful.

However, pair the Statement with the Sopra 3 and you get a very different impression - I don't think any of that stridency is down to the amp.

As for "By the way as an aside, the NDS with twin 555 power supplies was introduced at the demo as being Naim's top of the range streamer "at the moment"."  then they've been using that phrase for at least 6 months now 

Hungryhalibut posted:

It's interesting how people can attend a demonstration of a £250,000 system and come away underwhelmed. Is it the speakers, is it the room, who knows, but if Naim fans on Naim's very own Forum react like this, something must be amiss, and Naim would be wise to sort it out. Surely people attending should be shouting from the rooftops about how marvellous it all is?

The other thing that strikes me is the comments about some music sounding great and other music dreadful. I've always found that on a really good system you could chuck virtually anything at it, and it would be an enjoyable listen, whether it was a great recoding or not. Maybe this one is just too good, if such a thing is possible. 

I've heard Statement with Focal Grande Utopias (twice), Stella Utopias, Neat Ultimatum XLS and "lowly" Ovator S600s.  The Focal speakers don't do it justice, there is a degree of harshness in the high end, at least to my cloth ears.  Also the system is very transparent and unforgiving.  One track I particularly like on my home system I played at Naim's HQ and the HF was so bright that it didn't sound great.  I suspect that the Utopia line up wasn't designed with something like Statement in mind.  The S600s sounded much better but also quite different from how they normally sound with other amplification.

I'm with HH - I think it's shocking for all involved in putting this on that a system of that cost doesn't blow everyone away who hears it on every single track. No excuses re: room size either - these things are known ahead of time and speakers should be chosen accordingly.

Hmack posted:

However, I then played what for me was probably the stand out track at the demo by a band I had never before heard of - "Keep the Wolves away" by Uncle Lucius.  

On Quboz too ....WOW!

Thx,

M

Mr Underhill posted:

Hmack posted:

However, I then played what for me was probably the stand out track at the demo by a band I had never before heard of - "Keep the Wolves away" by Uncle Lucius.  

On Quboz too ....WOW!

Thx,

M

At the risk of castigation  +1 .  I dug it out on Tidal - it is a corker.

I have heard several $250,000 systems (and higher) that sounded inferior to my 252DR/250DR, often because the room was wrong or because the matching was poor or because the volume was far too high for the room in order to show off the brute power. I heard that Statement/Dynaudio setup at the dealer in too small a room and found it painful, but it did have space to breathe at Axpona and I liked it well.  Nonetheless I agree with the Axpona visitor above who found the small Dynaudio Confidence setup more enjoyable – real care had been taken and it was audible. It's not just about scale: the first time I went to Axpona I was ravished by certain expensive speakers driven by FM Acoustic amps in a small room; a year later I heard the same speakers sound terrible in a big room driven by Thrax. Room and component matching and careful setup and manageable volume and compelling music – it's rarely right except at home, after long system building! At least I leave shows temporarily relieved of the desire to spend (another) fortune on audio... 

Borders Nick posted:

Mr Underhill posted:

Hmack posted:

However, I then played what for me was probably the stand out track at the demo by a band I had never before heard of - "Keep the Wolves away" by Uncle Lucius.  

On Quboz too ....WOW!

Thx,

M

At the risk of castigation  +1 .  I dug it out on Tidal - it is a corker.

It is an interesting song - and one that is perfect for lots of HiFi systems in that there is not too much going on in terms of different voices. I'd be more inclined to be swayed by how the more 'difficult' tracks sounded as a truer reflection of what the system is capable of across a wider range of music