streaming from Synology - issue

Hi Kacper,

Have you got the latest firmware (v4.4) installed on your ND5XS? If not, I suggest that you update the firmware to the latest version.

There were problems with dropouts on some HiRes files with firmware version 4.3 which were discussed on this thread.

https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...pnp-issues-unitilite

Steve

 

A wired connection should be able to handle 192 comfortably, but you could check that your streamer's buffer is running full? Does your network have a lot of other activity on it as well as playing music?

A faulty cable is a possible cause, worth checking this first as it's an easy issue to eliminate by swapping for a new one - even if you have to buy a new cable, just get a very cheap Cat5e from ebay to test it.

If that doesn't solve the problem, maybe your router/network configuration has issues, but check the easy stuff first. Good luck.....

......oh yes, and check your firmware is up to date - good call, Steve!

Chrissu thanks for your reply,

The ethernet cables are Audioquest Forest. Sometimes utorrent is open during the music is playing - maybe this is causing the issue.

About TP-LINK router I don't know what kind of configurations are the best for server and the streamer.

sjbabbey posted:

Hi Kacper,

Have you got the latest firmware (v4.4) installed on your ND5XS? If not, I suggest that you update the firmware to the latest version.

There were problems with dropouts on some HiRes files with firmware version 4.3 which were discussed on this thread.

https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...pnp-issues-unitilite

Steve

 

Hi Sjbabbey,

thanks,

Yes, there is the latest firmware (v4.4) but to make sure I will check it later afternoon.

Kacper

Kacper - sounds like there are still network issues at your place.

have you trued re-booting your network equipment?

Your moderately expensive Ethernet cables shouldn't be at fault, unless one has been crushed, kinked, or bent too tightly around a corner, which can affect performance, apparently.

Can you disable other activity on your network, and see if this helps?

Is the TP Link router supplied by your ISP, and does it connect to the internet, or are you just using it for your LAN? There may be some settings that could be changed to improve things here?

Is the problem only with 192kHz ?? Is 96kHz & less OK ??? I'm tempted to blame the TP-Link, some wireless routers are not great at network switch duties & heavy traffic shows it up. The simple solution is to add a pukka gigabit switch, TP-Link TL-SG105 is the steel cased version & TL-SG1005D is the desktop. Or everyones favourite the Netgear GS105.    You will need a length of ethernet - nothing fancy required - between router & switch & connect as per ............

Adam Zielinski posted:

Kacper - sounds like there are still network issues at your place.

have you trued re-booting your network equipment?

Hi Adam,

Yes, I have did it,

ChrisSU posted:

Your moderately expensive Ethernet cables shouldn't be at fault, unless one has been crushed, kinked, or bent too tightly around a corner, which can affect performance, apparently.

Can you disable other activity on your network, and see if this helps?

Is the TP Link router supplied by your ISP, and does it connect to the internet, or are you just using it for your LAN? There may be some settings that could be changed to improve things here?

Yes, the router has been connected to the modem so also to the internet.

Only the thing is; local internet supplier has some problems with own system and therefore they can't switched the modem in to the "bridge mode". They are busy to resolve the problem.

Mike-B posted:

Is the problem only with 192kHz ?? Is 96kHz & less OK ??? I'm tempted to blame the TP-Link, some wireless routers are not great at network switch duties & heavy traffic shows it up. The simple solution is to add a pukka gigabit switch, TP-Link TL-SG105 is the steel cased version & TL-SG1005D is the desktop. Or everyones favourite the Netgear GS105.    You will need a length of ethernet - nothing fancy required - between router & switch & connect as per ............

 

 

 

As far until now, I think only with 192khz aiff. Do you think the switch might be the solution?

My Router is: Archer C7

Kacper - can you please refresh my memory (from the last thread). What 'define's your network? Was it the Apple Extreame or have you ended up with a different one?

The reason I'm asking is that I suspect the trouble may be either at a swtich level or at a router level (this is where IP address assignment should be taking place).

Adam

Kacper posted:

As far until now, I think only with 192khz aiff. Do you think the switch might be the solution?    My Router is: Archer C7

The TP spec's don't tell anything about its switch chipset, so hard to be 100%.    If you can borrow one to try or just to hell with the expense & lash out £20 for a switch & a short length of ethernet.       In my book it's simply the right thing to do with hi-res audio.

Kacper posted:

As far until now, I think only with 192khz aiff. Do you think the switch might be the solution?

My Router is: Archer C7

Hi - that device uses Gigabit ports - and most router switches uses the same or similar chipsets of little standalone switches these days... so although possible my gut feel on such a modern device kind of unlikely it is the issue. A stereo 192/24/2 PCM data feed is utterly trivial for a gigabit port - coming in at about 1% load.

Are your sure your NAS is not the bottleneck - can you find out what speed you are able to spool off the disks?

Simon

Simon

Adam Zielinski posted:

Kacper - can you please refresh my memory (from the last thread). What 'define's your network? Was it the Apple Extreame or have you ended up with a different one?

The reason I'm asking is that I suspect the trouble may be either at a swtich level or at a router level (this is where IP address assignment should be taking place).

Adam

I have purchased TP-LINK Archer 7 which is connected to the CISCO modem. Between ND5XS and Synology is only the router. Could be that extra switch can resolve the problem or in that case the extra switch is unnecesary?

Kacper

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Kacper posted:

As far until now, I think only with 192khz aiff. Do you think the switch might be the solution?

My Router is: Archer C7

Hi - that device uses Gigabit ports - and most router switches uses the same or similar chipsets of little standalone switches these days... so although possible my gut feel on such a modern device kind of unlikely it is the issue. A stereo 192/24/2 PCM data feed is utterly trivial for a gigabit port - coming in at about 1% load.

Are your sure your NAS is not the bottleneck - can you find out what speed you are able to spool off the disks?

Simon

Simon

 

Hi Simon,

Thanks for your reply.

"Are your sure your NAS is not the bottleneck - can you find out what speed you are able to spool off the disks? " - could you please provide me how to check this?  My synology - DS214

Kacper posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

Kacper - can you please refresh my memory (from the last thread). What 'define's your network? Was it the Apple Extreame or have you ended up with a different one?

The reason I'm asking is that I suspect the trouble may be either at a swtich level or at a router level (this is where IP address assignment should be taking place).

Adam

I have purchased TP-LINK Archer 7 which is connected to the CISCO modem. Between ND5XS and Synology is only the router. Could be that extra switch can resolve the problem or in that case the extra switch is unnecesary?

 

Kacper

I think the extra switch is unnecessary - generally the simpler the better.
So we need to look at the way your Cisco modem handles DHCP and other protocols governing the network traffic (here Simon will be the best person to advise).

Adam

What type of disks do you have in the NAS?
Are they healthy (if you don't know, then run the SMART diagnostic test on them using the Synology Web UI)?
Which Media Server are you using?
Are you transcoding?
Are you running other disk access tasks at the same time?
Does the the Synology Web UI indicate an excessively high demand in the Resource Monitor?

ALL the Synology 214 enclosures have plenty of power to stream 24/192 easily.

When you get the 'empty space' does the buffer level indication on the streamer display show that the streamer's buffer is briefly empty?

Huge posted:

What type of disks do you have in the NAS?
Are they healthy (if you don't know, then run the SMART diagnostic test on them using the Synology Web UI)?
Which Media Server are you using?
Are you transcoding?
Are you running other disk access tasks at the same time?
Does the the Synology Web UI indicate an excessively high demand in the Resource Monitor?

ALL the Synology 214 enclosures have plenty of power to stream 24/192 easily.

When you get the 'empty space' does the buffer level indication on the streamer display show that the streamer's buffer is briefly empty?

-WD Red Nas 3 TB (two disks in SHR configuration)

- I don't know - I will do test when I'm back at home

-media server

- no transcoding

- sometimes I do access to the disk during the music is playing

- yes, he indicate when Antivirus Essential is running

Which version of the 214 do you have, particularly how much RAM does it have?

I ask because Antivirus Essential is very resource hungry (particularly RAM) and on lower powered NASes with 512Mb RAM or less, this can impact real time code such as Media Streaming.  Antivirus Essential is only really required if your Synology is directly exposed to the internet.  If all access is limited to your local network (or via your PC), then nothing can get to the NAS without going through your PC's AV system.

Huge,  I've just installed Antivirus Essential to check - its a pre-loaded Synology package - running a 192/24 album has no affect on RAM running with & without,  it shows RAM at 22% both ways.  DS214 system has 512 MB DDR3.     I agree no need for it unless the NAS is connected to www.   I've now uninstalled mine.  

Adam,  you're barking up the wrong tree IMO,  nothing to do with DHCP or protocols,  its a break in the data stream with 192,   despite what others say I do not trust wireless routers as switches,  OK many may be good for that job, but I seen a few not up to muster & including poor SQ,  my bet is on a switch to fix this.

Mike - I didn't realise this was a wireless router doubling up as a switch. If that's the case, it wasn't even a bark - more like a howl and it wasn't even a tree.

To the OP: just install a proper switch

I've been running an Airport Extreme inside my ISP supplied router for years and it works fine for both WiFi and Ethernet. The router just has WiFi disabled but is still my DHCP server. For me this has been a much better solution than just relying on the router do do everything and if the OPs TP Link is set up right, presumably it could do the same. 

Hi -

I agree with Simon that the gigabit switch in a modern router and wireless access point is likely not a huge bottleneck, especially one that lives at or near the top of the home router performance charts like this one. If this audio drop out issue happens every time you play hi res files, then I'd go for an infrastructure problem... But if it's once in a while, or a few days at a time then nothing, I'd re-visit the impact of running the Antivirus application. Someone said their system showed no real loading (memory or CPU) when they turned AVEssentials... in my experience it is much more 'bursty' and, when performing disc scans, uses both memory and CPU plus loads the disk i/o which is likely to be a bottleneck "just because". It scans over many many hours, with a cycled workload (is not running full out for an hour), as a simple prioritized quasi-background process. 

My advice is to take a look at your Synology resource monitor at a time when you're experiencing the drop outs and see if there's a correlation that might point to a solution. 

Regads alan

I have installed on my Mac Asset UPnP. I will try to stream music files (192khz aiff) from my computer.
-Thanks Phil for an advice.

Cheers 

Kacper

alan33 posted:

Hi -

I agree with Simon that the gigabit switch in a modern router and wireless access point is likely not a huge bottleneck, especially one that lives at or near the top of the home router performance charts like this one. If this audio drop out issue happens every time you play hi res files, then I'd go for an infrastructure problem... But if it's once in a while, or a few days at a time then nothing, I'd re-visit the impact of running the Antivirus application. Someone said their system showed no real loading (memory or CPU) when they turned AVEssentials... in my experience it is much more 'bursty' and, when performing disc scans, uses both memory and CPU plus loads the disk i/o which is likely to be a bottleneck "just because". It scans over many many hours, with a cycled workload (is not running full out for an hour), as a simple prioritized quasi-background process. 

My advice is to take a look at your Synology resource monitor at a time when you're experiencing the drop outs and see if there's a correlation that might point to a solution. 

Regads alan

Hi Alan33,

thanks for an advice.