Monitor Audio PL300 II and Supernait 2

Hi Andres,

I've just googled the speakers in your thread's title and the £8000 Monitor Audio PL300 II is the first item to come up. Hopefully a moderator will be able to ammend your title.

You have mentioned before the difficulty in auditioning Naim in Colombia. I suspect that your dealer is trying to sell you the only thing he can sell you, in an attempt to introduce the missing 'wow factor'. But you have already spent a considerable amount of money. I woud want to ask first, why is the wow factor missing in such a system containing your fine Naim amplifier and matching Focal speakers?

Naim have suggested in the past that the biggest improvement's in a system's performance come from improving the source of the music. The speakers appear to be the least of it. If only getting a meaningful demonstration of the truth of such statements was easier for you.

Chris

Hi [@mention:49859238896069530]. I really like those Focal speakers and they must work very well with your SN2. Have you considered adding an XPSDR to your ND5? Or moving from CD5SI to CDX2 if you're still playing a lot of CDs? I moved from CD5i to CDX2 this year and the improvement was fantastic. I have it connected to a SN1 with £3300 Revel speakers. If you make improvements elsewhere in your system I think you may be surprised at how good those Focals can sound.

Andres Herrera posted:

I have a few questions, what speakers do you have connected to your Supernait 2?

Andres,

To answer your question directly, I have Totem Sttafs connected to my SN2, though I suspect that is little help for what you are really after. I've been slowly demoing alternative speakers. One I spent 15 minutes with in a dealer showroom was the Focal Aria 936. Well balanced top to bottom, good clarity and decent resolution. Nothing offensive about them, still didn't provide me with enough engagement to convince me to take them home for a demo - but that's just me - for what it's worth to you.

You can assemble a laundry list of recommended speakers for the SN2 from suggestions here, but in the end you're going to be limited to the speakers available from dealers in your area. Getting those speakers home and spending time with them in your listening room is what's most useful.

I'd use speaker demos at dealers as an initial screening method. Then take home those that strike you and spend some quality time using a variety of recordings and various speaker positions. Relax with them, and focus on the overall engagement and cohesion they provide versus immediate hi-fi factors.

wow factor, can u describe more, what feel you are missing? Bigger speakers may not give you the wow factor you want, take look at room size (i can describe monitor audio sound like being "bright" for my taste and need some attention with matching) take a look at speaker cables, interconnects, power cables, if u want really change something go for ndx or cdx2. Naim integrates works very well with focal aria series.

As has been mentioned you may have a short list dependant on what's available.... Once that's established.... Then go for the best speakers you can afford and the ones that really excite you.....

And no doubt you will want to upgrade to a 250 at some point , which your new speakers will need in order to make them really sing....

wenger2015 posted:

As has been mentioned you may have a short list dependant on what's available.... Once that's established.... Then go for the best speakers you can afford and the ones that really excite you.....

And no doubt you will want to upgrade to a 250 at some point , which your new speakers will need in order to make them really sing....

 

Would you do that if your sources were ND5XS and CD5si?

C.

Finkfan posted:

Hi [@mention:49859238896069530]. I really like those Focal speakers and they must work very well with your SN2. Have you considered adding an XPSDR to your ND5? Or moving from CD5SI to CDX2 if you're still playing a lot of CDs? I moved from CD5i to CDX2 this year and the improvement was fantastic. I have it connected to a SN1 with £3300 Revel speakers. If you make improvements elsewhere in your system I think you may be surprised at how good those Focals can sound.

Rather than a power supply (I tried the XP5XS when I had ND5XS, with only marginal improvement, which I really felt wasn't worth the cost), the ND5XS can be improved far more by adding an external DAC like Chord Hugo (much to be found about Hugo on the streaming thread, including people finding that it improves the higher level NDX). Typical descriptions are that it is more analogue-like, more engaging. And above the Hugo is the Hugo TT, improves further, and above that the Chord Dave, which is in another league. Of course it all depends on your own taste in sound. I bought my original Hugo unheard because I lacked opportunity, but the people recommending it, and was highly pleased - then after three years I moved up, but if I hadn't had the resources to move up I would still be very happy with Hugo.

That said, I wouldn't necessarily say don't change your speakers, but it a important, if humanly possible, to hear them as speakers really set the tone for the system (literally, as all speakers sound different from one another): if you can listen to the PL300 and compare with your Focals in the same location and same source/amp (preferably your home), and they provide the engagement you seem to be lacking then of course it would be reasonable to change they - any possible source upgrade in the future should then simply shine through.

If you upgrade the DAC, you might in future want to consider the renderer/player, which for streaming might mean consider things like Melco, Innuos Zenith and possibly the new Naim Uniti Core, though a statement attribited to someone at Naim recently suggested that the latter might not be a good enough contender.

I get the feeling the superb Monito's might show up the rest of your system.  Monito suggest an amp between 100-300W,  OK the SN2 might well be OK,  but my guess is a 250 or better is more suitable.

Andres

PL300II will work brilliantly with your SuperNait2. But that is not a problem here I'm afraid. 

Your sources are the limiting factors. I run my SN2 with NDX + nDAC + 555PS. And into Monitor Audio Gold GX300. 

See the difference?

Adam

Andres, I have edited the title of your thread.  

As Adam points out, before you drop big money on such speakers you will really need to up the level of your source, as that will be the limiting factor.

I had the first generation PL300s and they we're excellent - they were driven by a NAP300 though. They're also beautifully made.

Get either the PL200 or even better the little PL100 first , then later upgrade your sauce.

I understand going the source way for clarity etc... but sometimes I am not looking just for that what I also want to have a party and the most I can get out of my system is 80db with out my SN2 cutting. Do you ever want to just hear loud music?

80db? Something else is wrong then. 

Andres Herrera posted:

I understand going the source way for clarity etc... but sometimes I am not looking just for that what I also want to have a party and the most I can get out of my system is 80db with out my SN2 cutting. Do you ever want to just hear loud music?

 

If you are only achieving clean sound to 80db with your SN2 then you have a problem/fault and the Focal Aria 936 are a good match for SN2. The could of course be a fault with the speakers. I'm getting 80+db at 9 o'clock with my 250DR. The SN2's power amp stage is strong so this seems perplexing.

depending on the file and source is my ND5, I will be at this level between 11 and 1 o'clock position when 

This is wrong. Check the interconnects - there is some serious signal attenuation somewhere.

Sorry my english is not so strong, what is Signal attenuation and how can I check it

Andres Herrera posted:

Sorry my english is not so strong, what is Signal attenuation and how can I check it

 

Don't worry. Al lot of natives around here can't speak English either!

Andres Herrera posted:

Sorry my english is not so strong, what is Signal attenuation and how can I check it

 

It means that your incomimg source signal may be quieter than it should be. Or a problem with a pre-amp section.

if you need to turn your amp so much and you still get only 80 dB that's worrying.

Have you checked all your connections [@mention:49859238896069530]?  Do the speaker cables have good connections? What/who's cables do you use? Are your interconnects din? Which connections do you have your cd5 and Nd5 plugged in to? 

Also do you have the signal ground n the ND5 switched to floating? 

Finkfan posted:

Also do you have the signal ground n the ND5 switched to floating? 

No I have it on Chasis

Finkfan posted:

Have you checked all your connections [@mention:49859238896069530]?  Do the speaker cables have good connections? What/who's cables do you use? Are your interconnects din? Which connections do you have your cd5 and Nd5 plugged in to? 

The cables are generic deoxiganted cables, calibre 12 with monster Banana plugs

Andres Herrera posted:

Finkfan posted:

Have you checked all your connections [@mention:49859238896069530]?  Do the speaker cables have good connections? What/who's cables do you use? Are your interconnects din? Which connections do you have your cd5 and Nd5 plugged in to? 

The cables are generic deoxiganted cables, calibre 12 with monster Banana plugs

Ok - time for some Naim magic then.

Get yourself some NACA5 - 2 lengts of minimum 3.5 meters each. At amp end terminate them with the SN supplied plugs.

Interconnect - I presume you are using DIN-DIN? For CD players HiLine is good.

Another thing: make sure all your Naim boxes are plugged directly into the mains. No filters, no conditioners. Best results are achieved with PowerLines.

Are you using a dedicated mains spurr?

Do all of the above BEFORE you even contemplate chaning your speakers.