NAC-552

In an attempt to lighten the mood I will relay what I was told by my accountant. She told me there are three types of accountant, those that can count and those that can't.

Maybe I should be looking for another accountant!

As far as second hand 552s are concerned, the price will always be determined by supply and demand. Demand is high (judging by the many comments on here about the 552) and supply is limited. That is why they might 'appear' expensive when compared to their price when new.

So far as I'm concerned, nearly everyone (with honourable exceptions) has made completely invalid inferences about WHY I'm interested in what I'm interested in about the Nac-552.

It would be lovely if among the Naim Community people were able to supply the information I requested.

Thanks to those who did - but there are still gaps that could be filled in.

Meanwhile the aim of the Thread has been hijacked by a constant stream of invective about why second-hand Nac-552 prices are what they are.

Did I pose that question? No.

Is it a reasonable inference from what I've said about markets going down as well as up? No.

As a matter of fact, from the information provided here, I'm now inclined to the view that it would be far better value to buy a brand new Nac-552 at the best price available than to go for one made in 2004, currently selling for perhaps £7.5K, which would then need at least £3k of Service/Upgrade (assuming no Faults, Dings, Scratches or other (mis)use.

The key value issue from my point of view would be this: What will £10K-£11K invested in a 2004 S/N Nac-552 be worth in ten years time compared with £20K (Less negotiated discount) invested today in a Nac-552 with S/N 400000 +?

A couple on a well known auction site currently. Be interesting to see what the bidding one goes for.. that is vintage 2004 and a lot less than 7.5K but 2 days still to go

You could argue that a new 552 at 20k has 4K of vat on it

surely that is a fact?

jon honeyball posted:

You could argue that a new 552 at 20k has 4K of vat on it

or even £3,333 of VAT included in the price.

indeed - so its not a fact then 

I only mentioned it in case any of them accountants what can count was about. 

sjbabbey posted:

jon honeyball posted:

You could argue that a new 552 at 20k has 4K of vat on it

or even £3,333 of VAT included in the price.

Yes, that's the correct calculation

Unless you can claim it back

That's a perfectly valid issue raised by Jon. Many of us are, I suspect, self-employed and in business. A purchase via a VAT-Registered business with a legitimate interest in sound quality/reproduction would enable a VAT-Free purchase.

Whether it's £3K or £3.33K, it is not insignificant.

Part of my curiosity about early Nac-552 prices is about whether the prices originally paid are - or perhaps not - significantly less than the Real Value prices now being paid or anyhow demanded) for the same Amps 5-10-15 years after they were built and sold.

And if in fact someone had bought one on a VAT-Free business basis, they might now be selling it for a nominal 125% - 140% of the initial price. Given that we've had a significant spell of price deflation during the interval, in some cases the real price of the S/H unit today could be GREATER than the price paid in the first instance!

I have no issue with anybody selling second-hand (or sometimes multiple-used-hands) equipment for whatever price they can get for it.

Still, this is a (comparatively) unusual type of market.

That's why Economists might be more curious about it than Accountants.

skyebridge posted:

 Many of us are, I suspect, self-employed and in business. A purchase via a VAT-Registered business with a legitimate interest in sound quality/reproduction would enable a VAT-Free purchase.

Pull the other one, it's got bells on!

Bells will always sound better through a 552.

nigelb posted:

Bells will always sound better through a 552.

Equally, a 552 may well sound better after a couple of glasses of Bells. 

dave marshall posted:

nigelb posted:

Bells will always sound better through a 552.

Equally, a 552 may well sound better after a couple of glasses of Bells. 

Hic!

One of the advantages of being VAT registered, providing you work in a sector which requires quality audio playback.  You couldn't put the whole net cost of a 552 through the books unless your circumstances were particularly particular. A proportion has to go on personal use. But you can claim the VAT IF the purchase is legitimately business related. Or so I've heard from accountants.

There's you go. A 2004 552 is worth £9300 according to a well known auction site.

I was thinking around 7k. 

Yes, I saw that auction. Geoff at Acoustica is very successful. I've bought stuff from him in the past, and he's a very good guy to deal with - so I have nothing critical to say about him or his business.

However, it is quite interesting that the winning bidder has a score of only 11 on the site. None of the 'heavy hitters' who bid went over £8,200.

Moreover, Geoff's sale gives the buyer who wants an immediate DR Upgrade about a £400-£500 discount on the full cost of buying an S/H 552 and then later paying the Service and DR Upgrade costs itemised in this Thread.

Skyebridge

Yep I bid in there - but in my opinion it went  way over priced given the age of the NAC (12 years) and the 2.5K required to get it to current spec and service as well as being a blind purchase... good luck to the new owner..

skyebridge posted:

Yes, I saw that auction. Geoff at Acoustica is very successful. I've bought stuff from him in the past, and he's a very good guy to deal with - so I have nothing critical to say about him or his business.

Skyebridge

Just as an aside, some lucky bidder picked up a pair of Neat MF 9's, in premium piano black finish, for £2800.........good effort!

Time was (not from Argos!) I bought a Linn/Naim system new (LP12/Ittok/Trak/42/110) and it was good. It cost the difference between the car I was going to get (Golf) and the one I bought (2CV), that was a win-win. Since then I have bought some things new e.g. HiCap, 250, Isobariks, nDac, S/Cap DR and others not e.g. 135s, 52, 555ps, Rad/Urika, Ekos SE; this list is anything but exhaustive. I have never been able to splurge lots of cash and, without a healthy S/H market via dealers I could never have hoped to enjoy music at home as much as I now do. I don't know how much the component parts are worth or what the HiFi rate of inflation is but we all have a choice and we all have priorities. 

Enjoy the music, old age and tinnitus might be just around the corner!

Steve

Edit, I'd love a 552!

It's not just people and their ears that wear out: This also happens to cars and to HiFi equipment!

Buy a new one then.