Power supply question

Yes. 

I'm not sure exactly what you are asking here but if you are asking whether you need to purchase a separate power supply for the 250DR then the answer is no; the 250DR has its own built-in power supply and is connected direct to the mains.

Allan

But you do need a power supply for the pre in the Nait once it's split, which is (I assume) the question. 

Which supply is another question, and will depend largely on the future direction, as running a 250 from a Nait preamp would not be a sensible long term solution. And that's another thing we don't know. 

Wouldn't it be nice if people provided all the relevant information? Life would be so much simpler. 

Maybe the OP is wondering if the 250 supplies power back to the pre as a 200 does? It doesn't. And I don't think a 200 would power an xs pre either. 

A 200  will power an XS pre.

A 250 (of any generation) won't power the pre.

HH is correct, with a 250 you need an external power supply.

Huge posted:

A 200  will power an XS pre.

Ah. ok

Hungryhalibut posted:

Wouldn't it be nice if people provided all the relevant information? Life would be so much simpler. 

"All the relevant information", which you seem to think is lacking seems necessary only after you posed a related question that I could not have anticipated.  

I have no idea why you felt the snarky passive-aggressive attitude was necessary.  

Judd

In any event, yes - I wanted to know if the pre-amp side of the Nait would need a seperate power supply once split off from the power amp section.  Which is not super awesome as I'm looking at additional $$ outlay.  In the olden days, I would think nothing of popping the tray out and running an internal link from the psu rail to the pre-amp section (i.e., a makeshift "internal link") to avoid having to add a dedicated external psu in a situation like this.  But the modern boxes seem harder to get into.  

For what it's worth, I'm acutely aware of the perils of putting a relatively lower end pre-amp into a nap250.  But, to be honest, I bristle at spending big $$$ on a nice Naim pre-amp since I literally have one source (a nice, new LP12), which needs a phono section anyway. What I wouldn't give for a shoebox sized preamp nowadays.  Well, it is what it is.  

I have little intention to upgrade the pre-amp anytime soon.  My experience is that adding a nap250, even to my pre-amp section, will make a substantial improvement.  

In either event, it looks like I need a power supply.  

Judd 

You haven't told us what your speakers are.  If they aren't difficult to drive, you may find that the preamp and poweramp upgrade (202 + 200DR) gives a significantly greater improvement than upgrading the power amp alone (as the Nait XS + 250DR combo will be limited by the XS's pre).  This is why HH was making the point: There may be other, better options out there.

Huge posted:

You haven't told us what your speakers are.  If they aren't difficult to drive, you may find that the preamp and poweramp upgrade (202 + 200DR) gives a significantly greater improvement than upgrading the power amp alone (as the Nait XS + 250DR combo will be limited by the XS's pre).  This is why HH was making the point: There may be other, better options out there.

His questions were appreciated.  I bristled only at the attitude. 

Judd

plimpington2 posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

Wouldn't it be nice if people provided all the relevant information? Life would be so much simpler. 

"All the relevant information", which you seem to think is lacking seems necessary only after you posed a related question that I could not have anticipated.  

I have no idea why you felt the snarky passive-aggressive attitude was necessary.  

Judd

Thing is, in the world of IT (which is not that dissimilar to the world of Naim), it's an acknowledged fact that a user doesn't know what he wants until you show him what he asked for, and then he knows instantly that's what he doesn't want... it's true, ask any seasoned IT chap (or chapess).   Exactly how this relates to the conversation above, I'm not sure, but a glass or two of the red nectar will soon have it all making sense 

Huge posted:

You haven't told us what your speakers are.  If they aren't difficult to drive, you may find that the preamp and poweramp upgrade (202 + 200DR) gives a significantly greater improvement than upgrading the power amp alone (as the Nait XS + 250DR combo will be limited by the XS's pre).  This is why HH was making the point: There may be other, better options out there.

Yes indeed, don't underestimate the importance of the preamp !

Perhaps something like the Lehmann Audio Linear headphone amp would be a good choice if you intend to stay with just the TT.  It can be used as a pre-amp and of course would provide excellent headphone use.  Cheaper than a full pre-amp with functionality you don't need, so it's simple, and well reviewed too.

rjstaines posted:

Huge posted:

You haven't told us what your speakers are.  If they aren't difficult to drive, you may find that the preamp and poweramp upgrade (202 + 200DR) gives a significantly greater improvement than upgrading the power amp alone (as the Nait XS + 250DR combo will be limited by the XS's pre).  This is why HH was making the point: There may be other, better options out there.

Yes indeed, don't underestimate the importance of the preamp !

I promise, I don't.  A bit more background with me and my system.  Started to get into Naim around 1992 with a Nait 2 + Rega Planar3. Over the following 15 years, flirted with other brands here and there, but inexorably moved up the olive box ladder until I got to Nac82 + 2hicaps + 250.  This stack of bricks variously into a pair of Linn Kan1's (then 2's), SBL's (not my cup of tea), and Rega Ela's (fluted).  A few others here and there (Neat Petites, Spica TC-50's - fantastic, spendors - Zzzzzz . . . .).  The LP12 up to Ekos2, Lingo 2 (I think), and various bits and bobbs (Asaka, troika, Ortofons).  

This talk of pre-amps tickled the gyri because I distinctly and clearly remember that when I moved from the 72 to the 82, it became unbearably bright and unpleasant.  There was too much detail there, and I figured I just didn't have enough good stuff going on upstream from the 82 to keep it in line  . . . despite that my LP12 was not crap by any stretch of the imagination (and it was tuned to within an inch of its life - that WAS NOT the issue).   Besides, I was running a CDX at the time as well, which I never saw the virtue in.

My other clear recollection was that adding the 250 to the mix (from a 180, as I recall) was a revelation.  One of the biggest upgrades I ever made.  A huge step up in weight, presence and meaningful detail.  It gave the impression of having limitless power without having to wield it.  Hard to explain . . . like a VERY powerful King who rules with nothing but grace and humility.

Anyway, now I run a Nait XS2 into Rega RX5's.  The LP12 is the current entry level "Magik" one, with the Pro-Ject tonearm and an ortofon 2M black (which I think is a great cartridge).  The LP12 goes under the knife next week to have a Lingo 3 fitted and a Ittok LV2 (which I am told is in fine fiddle).  I'd LOVE a new Ekos SE.  But, it's 5 bills, and that's not in the cards at the moment.  The Rega's are NOT hard to drive.  But the bass just flirts with flabby and the upper end lacks refinement - I believe the iron gripped weight and control of a 250 is EXACTLY what the Rega's need.  My room is large, BTW. 

Having looked a bit on Nap250 DR pricing, I think I will probably NOT be getting the DR version. Rather, I'll be sourcing a second hand Nap250 base (in black, not olive).  And if funds permit, I'll add the DR later.  

Judd     

if your speakers aren't hard to drive -- and since you have a Nait, i'm guessing they aren't -- i'd get a 282/Hicap DR and use your Nait as an amp. (either way, you'll have to get a power supply.)

or go old school? 32.5/HC/250, nicely serviced and recapped?

posts crossing in the night...

a Supernait 2 might be just what the doctor ordered with those Regas. what are you using for your phono preamp?

joe9407 posted:

posts crossing in the night...

a Supernait 2 might be just what the doctor ordered with those Regas. what are you using for your phono preamp?

In embarrassed to say - a Rega fono MM.  Sounds great tho.  

Judd

plimpington2 posted:

I have a Nait XS2 and wish to purchase a NAP250 (presumably one of the new regulated ones).

AFAIK, they're all regulated.

C.

Indeed the 250 has always been regulated - that is what has made the amp a legend. Its the technology used to regulate them that has evolved and recently changed

S

plimpington2 posted:

Anyway, now I run a Nait XS2 into Rega RX5's.  The LP12 is the current entry level "Magik" one, with the Pro-Ject tonearm and an ortofon 2M black (which I think is a great cartridge).  The LP12 goes under the knife next week to have a Lingo 3 fitted and a Ittok LV2 (which I am told is in fine fiddle).  I'd LOVE a new Ekos SE.  But, it's 5 bills, and that's not in the cards at the moment.  The Rega's are NOT hard to drive.  But the bass just flirts with flabby and the upper end lacks refinement - I believe the iron gripped weight and control of a 250 is EXACTLY what the Rega's need.  My room is large, BTW. 

Having looked a bit on Nap250 DR pricing, I think I will probably NOT be getting the DR version. Rather, I'll be sourcing a second hand Nap250 base (in black, not olive).  And if funds permit, I'll add the DR later.  

Judd     

I'm wondering whether the 250 will solve the problem or make things worse, unbalancing the system and needing more money to be spent up front to correct this. The XS2 is a lovely amp on it's own. If it was me, i'd add a Flatcap (or Hicap DR) to the XS2 and then check room problems weren't giving you the bass issues. I don't think a 250 is a solution here. 

Hi Judd,

I tend to agree with James in that the 250 may not be the best answer for the issues you have; however, although a flatcap will be an improvement, I think you could do better with the RX5s and enough budget to be considering a 250.

I currently run a Nait XS 2, but I'm only using the poweramp section; for a preamp I'm running a 272.  On going from a Nait XS 2 (bare), then adding a cuddly toy PSU to the preamp, and finally using a 272 as a preamp, each step has both tightened up the bass and improved the 'cleanness' of the signal (including adding more refinement and clarity to the top end).

Having said that the RX5s are 6Ω 2.5 way and so not exactly ideal for an XS 2, but, that said, they're still reasonably OK for it, so adding a PSU could work quite well (and a secondhand Flatcap 2X or Flatcap XS wouldn't be too expensive).

However, in my opinion, particularly given a big room, the best options for you would either be the NAC 202 + NAP 200 (DR preferred) combo or an SN2.  Later, adding a HiCapDR (and this would need to be the DR version) to either of these will further increase the tightness of the bass.

What speaker cables are you using?  From your tastes it sounds as though NAC A5 would be ideal for you.

It's also worth looking at room acoustics as the RX5s appear to have a bit of a lower-mid bass boost, and that can interact with some rooms to add a bit of flabbiness.

I suspect the preamp in your Nait will hold back your system quite noticeably with a 250, so as you say you're planning to stick with it for a while, I would look for a more balanced solution. As Huge says, Supernait, or 202/200 would be my choice.