Brigtness with 552

tonym posted:

In defence of the V1, before installing one in a second system where it's used as a digital preamp/DAC I tried it in my main system (552, 3 x active 500s into DBLs) & whilst it wasn't up to the quality of my usual Chord QBD76HDSD, it nevertheless sounded very good. Harsh it was not!

Agreed. Harshness is not something I would attribute to the DAC-V1.

R-LANE posted:

Re. DAC performance –  I'm currently using a Chord Hugo: macmini>Hugo connected directly via usb (Tellurium Q Black Diamond) ; Hugo>N-272 analogue input connected via rca (Tellurium Q Black Diamond); n-272/TPXS>250DR>B&W PM1(Tellurium Q Black speaker cable). Playback via Audirvana sounds superb; great synergy throughout the system. Smooth, musical and very engaging for long listening sessions without fatigue. A different presentation to the on board DAC which is also excellent.

How do you compare hugo vs 272?  What is the difference? 

Did you bought the hugo to upgrade 272? Or maybe already had it and just give it a go? 

I had the Hugo before purchasing the n-272/250DR combo. The plan was to sell/trade-in the Hugo but I was curious to hear how it would perform through the Naim pre-amp. I already had a macbook pro for playback. I tested various usb cables: stock; Audioquest Carbon and Diamond, all sounded great but  I settled on the Tellurium Black Diamond which was the most analogue sounding. Original RCA interconnect was Chord Shawline but again swapped over for Tellurium after testing. Playing like for like tracks, the Hugo in this set-up compared to the on board N-272 dac sounds more ‘live’ and 'in the room'. It reveals subtle nuances, layers and details in the recording which draws you closer to the music. I’m happy with the N-272 dac but the Hugo is a definite step-up in performance, although unconventional in this particular configuration. And, of course, there is some redundancy.  

R-lane

i find your post very interesting,I also have the Hugo and the 272/250dr combo,but when I tried the Hugo into the 272 analogue inputs I did not notice a big difference.Maybe I will re-try that set-up again,it might be that I did not give it enough time,also I do not have a mac-mini to feed the Hugo...I just used my I-pad,I have high-res files stored on it.I did plan on possibly getting a micro -Rendu or a new core to feed the Hugo,and try it again.Also,I am still saving my pennies for a power supply for the 272.Actually I am not even sure if the new Uniti core could feed the Hugo directly,does anyone know?

the annoying fact that 272 has only one analogue input thats is reserved for my CD player, i don't know what i am going to do with turntable( know i disconnected the cd player ), maybe i will connect to rca inputs rather then DIN for Turntable so another digital source  has to be RCA as well.  Now writing this i came to confusion that adding another digital input to 272 is too much hassle if you dont have the streamer/mac ready. I just like to use Roon but lets wait for Naim to come up with a solution. thanks for sharing R-LANE...

No Quarter

The interconnects used helped lift the performance of the Hugo above the N-272 DAC in an audible way, particularly the Tellurium Q Black Diamond USB and RCA-RCA which allows the music to flow into the room from a very dark background. I've also connected an iphone using the Onkyo app to play high res files. Performance was also very good, on par with the on board DAC, but less revealing and engaging than Audirvana/macmini playback. It's worth another try now your system has settled in.

R-LANE posted:

No Quarter

The interconnects used helped lift the performance of the Hugo above the N-272 DAC in an audible way, particularly the Tellurium Q Black Diamond USB and RCA-RCA which allows the music to flow into the room from a very dark background. I've also connected an iphone using the Onkyo app to play high res files. Performance was also very good, on par with the on board DAC, but less revealing and engaging than Audirvana/macmini playback. It's worth another try now your system has settled in.

R-LANE, how are you connecting the TQ USB cable to your Hugo? 

USB cable from Mac mini to Hugo via Audioquest USB B to Micro adaptor.

R-LANE posted:

No Quarter

The interconnects used helped lift the performance of the Hugo above the N-272 DAC in an audible way, particularly the Tellurium Q Black Diamond USB and RCA-RCA which allows the music to flow into the room from a very dark background. I've also connected an iphone using the Onkyo app to play high res files. Performance was also very good, on par with the on board DAC, but less revealing and engaging than Audirvana/macmini playback. It's worth another try now your system has settled in.

I was also using the Onkyo app to play my high -res files,like you said,to me i would say it was on-par with the 272's on board dac,so i pulled the Hugo out of the set-up.I think i am going to wait and see people's impressions of the Core,then make a decision between it and the Micro-rendu. Thanks for the suggestion of the TQ cables,i was just using the stock Hugo cables with the camera connection kit cable,then Audioquest rca's into the 272's analog in's...it was good,but did not outclass the 272's on board dac to my ears.

R-LANE posted:

USB cable from Mac mini to Hugo via Audioquest USB B to Micro adaptor.

Thank you sir. 

With a computer source interference is always a potential issue, which can limit sound quality (though I don't know if that may include the symptoms describrd). If dedicated to the music task (as, for example, with a Mac Mini running headless with nothing else on it) then there is still electrical/RF noise from the computer internals, regardless of the primary power supply, which can adversely affect a susceptible DAC like Hugo (I don't know about V1) - how much seems to vary between individual machines. MIcroRendu supposedly can overcome these limitations, and integrates with Roon, but seems to require a fair bit of fiddling and additions to optimise. I don't know if Melco can integrate with Roon, ditto the new Uniti Core, both of which bring advantages of avoiding streaming files across a network.

what is doing the rendering - is it Roon? When I read up about roon in that function it seemed people with higher end systems were critical about the sound quality compared to other renderers like Audirvana.

As for DAC, Hugo TT does indeed provide good isolation on its electrical inputs, and, to me, was a step up from standard Hugo (though not 'night and day'). But Dave really is night and day different, a real wow factor (literally when I first heard it). But I doubt the DAC is the cause of the symptoms, more likely to be the computer/rendrer, assuming that there are no issues elsewhere.

The Dave is on my "to do list" for sure but first I will test a microrendu to see if it helps the matter or not... I am using Roon, since I am on PC my choices are either JRiver or Roon and I simply love Roon... Not sure if microrendu would run with JRiver, have to research that one a bit.

Merry Xmas!

Sorry if this has been suggested. Full "Naim fraim"

i just could not see a rack in your profile. I may of missed that.

 Personally  I would have all Naim components from top to bottom including all cables. 

Ive found the 500's have a hard fast detailed presentation, never bright never harsh and never ever warm and  fluffy. Just jaw dropping every time.

I have the kit sitting on a Naim Fraim, top to bottom

Sounsfaber posted:

Sorry if this has been suggested. Full "Naim fraim"

i just could not see a rack in your profile. I may of missed that.

 Personally  I would have all Naim components from top to bottom including all cables. 

Ive found the 500's have a hard fast detailed presentation, never bright never harsh and never ever warm and  fluffy. Just jaw dropping every time.

In all honesty I am not sure how you can that.. the presentation of warm or bright can equally, and arguable more so, come from the speakers. I have heard performances on 500 series and Statement systems sound bright, overly warm, or even soft and boomy and I am confident it has all been down to speaker/room interaction.

Hi Tamer,

I used to own DAC V1, and am familiar with 552 with Sonus Faber speakers, this is not a bright combination (all 3 of them)

Can you please tell us how you have plugged in all these items into your mains?

The DAC V1 lacks a bit of resolution, and has a higher noise floor compared to the better and more expensive Naim sources and cannot be upgraded by a PSU, so it is being exposed by a 552, but again, this doesn't translate into brightness as it is quite neutral.

As you using the ASIO or WASAPI outputs on Jriver to the DAC V1? 

I would also highly recommend a good quality USB cable like Vertere from the PC to the DAC V1. 

Simon-in-Suffolk posted:

Sounsfaber posted:

Sorry if this has been suggested. Full "Naim fraim"

i just could not see a rack in your profile. I may of missed that.

 Personally  I would have all Naim components from top to bottom including all cables. 

Ive found the 500's have a hard fast detailed presentation, never bright never harsh and never ever warm and  fluffy. Just jaw dropping every time.

In all honesty I am not sure how you can that.. the presentation of warm or bright can equally, and arguable more so, come from the speakers. I have heard performances on 500 series and Statement systems sound bright, overly warm, or even soft and boomy and I am confident it has all been down to speaker/room interaction.

Agree with that, so the 500's systemsl I've herd were never bright or hash. I didnt really rate the satement omg how bad am I!!!! 

I would do a full none DR 500 on fraim any day over the statement period 

I think we need to get back to the core signature housesound of naime audio, which has/is unfortunately been changed imo. Pls remember when you became hooked, was it hard and fast? Like going down to the local pub on a Friday or Saturday?  night please remember those times and "the now". warm and fluffy?  I can remember 25 years ago what hit my arousal level. I was 20 and the soundman/boy in a no where band but man oh man we where happy

hifi? Like all the rest with pRat. 

Simon please take it easy on me. I'm an olive fan after all  

I changed my power extension and tonight pulled the curtains down a large window to that is to the side of the speakers and suddenly the harshness is no longer there, seems like most of this was due to the speaker/room interaction. Not sure if it is due to the power extension chord or the window surface being covered up with the curtain that contributes more to eradicating the harshness but I don't care ... All is good in naim-land tonight, just in time for some Christmas tunes through the Sonus Fabers driven by the 552

Merry Xmas!

thijazi posted:

I changed my power extension and tonight pulled the curtains down a large window to that is to the side of the speakers and suddenly the harshness is no longer there, seems like most of this was due to the speaker/room interaction. Not sure if it is due to the power extension chord or the window surface being covered up with the curtain that contributes more to eradicating the harshness but I don't care ... All is good in naim-land tonight, just in time for some Christmas tunes through the Sonus Fabers driven by the 552

Merry Xmas!

Sounds like you have the system sounding closer to how it should sound. Brightness is not one of the qualifications I would give to a 552, it's if you could talk about color - more to the earthy / warm style.....

Glass surfaces can be buggers for brightness. Been there, mostly tamed it.

Have fun.

I suggest you try auditioning the Chard  DAVE ...... I think this is the thing of future...... I have never heard oe but it gets tremendous rave reviews..... I think this could be more cost effective than an NHS + all the supplies....

I recently acquired a 552 (2003 vintage so prabably needs a service) and was not wowed like I thought I would be..... it took a few days to settle  down and required a few tweaks on speaker placement and it is now a material upgrade from my fully serviced 252 Supercap DR. 

Full system is 552, 300dr, NDS, 555 non  dr and PMC fact 8. Plan will be to get the 555 dr and 552 dr/service but they will have to wait for a while. 

I guess point is with new equipment it is worth playing around with speaker placement and room acoustics - previous upgrades just seem to blend in with not much effort but the 552 was different - maybe because it would benefit from a service.

Gary

fathings cat posted:

I recently acquired a 552 (2003 vintage so prabably needs a service) and was not wowed like I thought I would be..... it took a few days to settle  down and required a few tweaks on speaker placement and it is now a material upgrade from my fully serviced 252 Supercap DR. 

Full system is 552, 300dr, NDS, 555 non  dr and PMC fact 8. Plan will be to get the 555 dr and 552 dr/service but they will have to wait for a while. 

I guess point is with new equipment it is worth playing around with speaker placement and room acoustics - previous upgrades just seem to blend in with not much effort but the 552 was different - maybe because it would benefit from a service.

Gary

 

I found with my 52 that had been powered down for a while, took week's,  like 4 to come on song. Now it's got that 3D "Naim space". The 552 has it so much more. My 52 is a 2000 build and no service. I'm a little bit worried about a service as I feel the bits these days aren't like the bit in those days, this make me feel uncomfortable.  Anxiety you could say .