F1 - 2017

Mike-B posted:

It looks like BRDC will be activating the official break clause for the British (Silverstone) GP & then gamble on renegotiating a new improved contract with Liberty in an attempt to keep hold of the event.  

Silverstone (BRDC) has made the announcement thats its invoked the F1 contracts break clause & will not continue to hold the British GP after 2019.   The background is that Silverstone signed a 17-year deal with F1 (Bernie Ecclestone) in 2009 starting with £12m 'fee' & an annual escalator of 5%.  The fee is now at a level that Silverstone can't organise & run the race & break even.  Despite the British GP attracting the largest crowds of any GP, unlike other GP's, Silverstone does not get support from government. 

F1's new chairman Chase Carey told BBC Sport this week that it is his "priority" for the event to stay at Silverstone but that there was "interest from other places, other UK options, that would have appeal".    Silverstone has up to 2 years to try to reach a deal.

In my opinion all Silverstone have done is put themselves into a better position to negotiate a better deal for the British GP being there. However, I really don't like the circuit. It's an ugly shadow of the great circuit that was gone by the early 90s. Trouble is, no other circuit in the UK can stage a modern GP without massive investment, and that just won't happen.

Well done Silverstone. F1 needs these old circuits. It's a shame they gave in to the bullying and altered the fast and flowing circuit that it was years ago.

lets hope Monza, Spa, Suzuka etc go the same way. The greedy "owners" need some lessons.

The old owners were greedy, the new ones could well be more sensible, especially where the older circuits are concerned.  

It's a risk for Silverstone certainly, but it should offer a better product than the so called F1 street circuits alternatives. They can't all be like Baku, as good as it is it has serious problems with some elements.

Let's face it Monaco wouldn't even get a site visit if it offered it's self for a GP today.

If F1 can give ONLY Ferrari a $100M gift every year for being at F1 all races maybe they should look at giving the BGP home a break too? It was the home to the first Championship GP. Liberty have been making some good noises about a more equitable split of prize monies, and the fact that the BGP (especially at Silverstone) should be a permanent fixture.

BE had a bee in his bonnet about Silverstone, what ever they did he would continue to snipe at them and say how bad the facilities are.

Still the French GP is back at Paul Ricard next year, so I guess that will be perfect as I'm sure the owner has done ALL the things that F1 asked of him. 

BTW for those that don't know Bernie owns Circuit Paul Ricard.

I wonder who the "5 or 6" serious requests for a GP are coming from? 

When circuits like Turkey are idle it does make one wonder, what's best for F1. 

BigH47 posted:

 When circuits like Turkey are idle it does make one wonder, what's best for F1. 

Hopefully we are moving beyond the days when the answer to "what's best for F1?" is no longer answered with "whatever is best for Bernie / Liberty".  Where races are held should be about more than just which circuits pay the most money.

BigH47 posted:

I wonder who the "5 or 6" serious requests for a GP are coming from? 

Bernie claimed he had 2 serious contenders but it seems 'serious' might be more speculative than factual.  Silverstone is the only circuit with grade one status that is needed to qualify for F1 consideration.   Donnington, Brands & Rockingham are the only tracks with grade two status & all would need to take on considerable development costs to get to grade one.

The 5 or 6 as I understand it are:     Donington Park,  they pulled out of the Bernie manipulated threat to Silverstone in 2008 because it was not able to fund the (est) £135m required to redevelop. A press report a while back said they have no intention of bidding for the British GP.    

Rockingham has also said they had not approached F1 & have no intention of doing so.

Brands is probably (IMO) least suitable, its physically small in both land area & track size 2.4miles vs Silverstone 3.6miles & in the southeast corner of UK is hardly UK population friendly. Making it suitable for F1 will be a huge investment, new land would be needed for parking & probably a complete teardown & rebuild is needed in the paddock area & the space required for the facilities now expected in that area.

Circuit of Wales is one of the least likely especially so as building work has yet to start at the Ebbw Vale site, the last cost est. I heard was £450m. Now it seems the Welsh gov has refused to get involved with support although I read reports about a new investor/business partner. Finally, like Brands, south Wales is not exactly the centre of the UK population.

London GP was a new street circuit idea supported by Bernie, the idea was something that was bantered around as a follow up to the Formula 'E' races. But for me it is a least likely non-starter as it would be a logistical nightmare. For me the existing street circuits are not ideal for F1 cars, some better than others,  & the less said about Monaco the better.

VB's start looked 'perfect' to my eyes - a rare thing. 0.2 of a second response time and the car just moved off with fluid momentum and didn't 'bog'.

Check out the Beeb stories today and Christian Horner's comments re the pit location. It seems the BRDC have lost ~£6/7m in hosting the last 2 races.

I'd love to see a London GP on the basis they leave the traffic signals 'live' and all the natural hazards of the roadworks remain  - and they had to give priority to emergency vehicles in case of need. We might see a bit of overtaking then (I'm thinking ambulance > F1 car here).

Don’t forget we need to keep the cyclists, keeping to the cycling lanes, but not necessarily obeying the signals.

I’m sure there’ll be quite are a few forum members exited at the prospect of Sebastian Vellel sideswiping them onto the pavement.

Mike-B posted:

BigH47 posted:

I wonder who the "5 or 6" serious requests for a GP are coming from? 

Bernie claimed he had 2 serious contenders but it seems 'serious' might be more speculative than factual.  Silverstone is the only circuit with grade one status that is needed to qualify for F1 consideration.   Donnington, Brands & Rockingham are the only tracks with grade two status & all would need to take on considerable development costs to get to grade one.

The 5 or 6 as I understand it are:     Donington Park,  they pulled out of the Bernie manipulated threat to Silverstone in 2008 because it was not able to fund the (est) £135m required to redevelop. A press report a while back said they have no intention of bidding for the British GP.    

Rockingham has also said they had not approached F1 & have no intention of doing so.

Brands is probably (IMO) least suitable, its physically small in both land area & track size 2.4miles vs Silverstone 3.6miles & in the southeast corner of UK is hardly UK population friendly. Making it suitable for F1 will be a huge investment, new land would be needed for parking & probably a complete teardown & rebuild is needed in the paddock area & the space required for the facilities now expected in that area.

Circuit of Wales is one of the least likely especially so as building work has yet to start at the Ebbw Vale site, the last cost est. I heard was £450m. Now it seems the Welsh gov has refused to get involved with support although I read reports about a new investor/business partner. Finally, like Brands, south Wales is not exactly the centre of the UK population.

London GP was a new street circuit idea supported by Bernie, the idea was something that was bantered around as a follow up to the Formula 'E' races. But for me it is a least likely non-starter as it would be a logistical nightmare. For me the existing street circuits are not ideal for F1 cars, some better than others,  & the less said about Monaco the better.

I was thinking of a more globally, which other 5 or 6 countries have applied for GPs? IMO only one logical place for BGP and that's Silverstone  hopefully a new deal can be struck, as Mike points out the failings of the others.

Not many have said anything about Rockingham for the BGP, running near the walls has been done at what is now a pretty decent track at Indianapolis. I'm sure an approach the other way to RRW might get some thinking.

Rockingham? British weather and fast banking plus F1 wouldn't mix well at all.  

Former Renault team principal Frederic Vasseur has been appointed as team principal of Sauber replacing Monisha Kaltenborn who left last month.  Not exactly headline news,  but rumours abound that Sauber have backed out of the Honda engine deal for 2018, it seems the deal was never finalised,  Sauber's new owners disagreed with Monisha Kaltenborn over Honda engines & that was a factor in the 'mutual consent' over her departure.

So assuming its all correct & if McLaren do go to Mercedes engines,  we might not have Honda in F1 next year.

Would that be such a loss? Honda are a laughing stock over the F1 engine development. A few years getting an engine that is  OK, some battery/ERS issues, then over the winter make a completely new engine, and hey presto more engine, turbo failures. Some really basic failures too, an MGU-H that can't last more than 2 races etc.  

All engine manufacturers had difficulties but go around them relatively quickly, generally they passed the first hurdle of being powerful enough, reliability came next, Honda have gone for the low power, low reliability option.

I'm surprised McLaren team members are still pulling so well together, it must be soul destroying.

Apparently, Honda just point blank refuse 'outside' assistance, even directly from McLaren.

I've no idea why Honda themselves can't yet get it right after 3 or 4 years this time around and plenty of motorsport history behind them, but to avoid offers of co-operation merely to save face, yet continue to provide an appalling product for all the world to see every fortnight  is quite bizarre.

Howard,

i seem to recall 2014 being notable for its lack of  power unit failures. It's only now that they're all turning the wick up that failures are occurring, a few last year too.  

JamieWednesday posted:

..... to save face, yet continue to provide an appalling product for all the world to see every fortnight  is quite bizarre.

I was part of a team interfacing with Japanese engine suppliers for years,  my role was identifying, quantifying & making the case for technical solutions.  Face saving & bizarre,  absurdly bizarre,  were normal barriers to accepting responsibility despite the blatantly obvious.  

Glad Lewis has pole for tomorrow.

Fingers crossed for the race!

steve

Yes, fingers crossed for Kimi to win one last time before retirement …

… and unfortunately it did not happen. 

Sunday afternoon drive for Lewis.

Should Ferrari be sponsored by Kwik Fit?

steve

So Halos next year...

Eloise posted:

So Halos next year...

Not great but it seems the only solution for deflecting large objects, and has a very small impact on vision.

Problem now is that by saying there should be a solution to perceived problems the FIA can't drop the extra protection as it will leave them open to litigation in the event of an intrusion incident causing death/injury.

Eloise posted:

So Halos next year...

Its a shame the visor did not work out.   I get a feeling we have not seen the last of this. 

Mike-B posted:

Eloise posted:

So Halos next year...

Its a shame the visor did not work out.   I get a feeling we have not seen the last of this. 

Maybe a ballistic  "plastic" version can be manufactured a la F16 canopy. Main problem of this and any screen solution is what happens when it rains, someone drops oil or slashes  mud after going off. Quite easy to remove a tear off your helmet visor, not so easy on a screen. Just how many millions of dollars would F1 teams spend on a windscreen cleaning device? Have you seen how much wheel nut guns and jacks now cost?

An F-16 rarely flies as slowly as a flat out F1 car, so any rain water on the canopy isn't there long enough to be a problem. 

An F1 car on a wet Monaco behind the safety car is going to make seeing debris on the track impossible if it has that screen. 

Halo? Ugly. Another nail in the coffin for my watching of it.