F1 - 2017

Bananahead posted:

The sad part is that it didn't take out Hamilton instead of Alonso.

The troll is out & scavenging .........  

No, I've just checked - Gusse is still in my hallway where she always is.

(One of my Nowegian cousins used to make trolls!)

I don't think it's in a formula 1 drivers DNA to ever admit blame for anything..... 

No doubt we would all do the same...

Mike-B posted:

Bananahead posted:

The sad part is that it didn't take out Hamilton instead of Alonso.

The troll is out & scavenging .........  

meh

It would have made for a better race and a better championship.

Agreed. Although I wouldn't wish a crash on anyone.

Blame blame blame. 

Says a lot about some people that they need to blame someone. 

In my industry we move on. It helps. 

Tony Lockhart posted:

 Says a lot about some people that they need to blame someone. 

It’s not so much blame as taking responsibility for your actions...

Tony Lockhart posted:

Blame blame blame. 

 

Says a lot about some people that they need to blame someone. 

 

You’re not wrong there.

It’s all down to Sky, turning a racing incident, with nobody to blame into a controversy, adding a bit of interest into a sport which has become one of the most uninteresting sports on TV. Only the drivers/engineers squabbling on the intercom is remotely entertaining.

The first words uttered by the commentator where, Verstappen’s made a good start, Vettel will need to cover him off. (which he did, emphatically).

Brundels initial comment on viewing Verstappen’s onboard camera was. Vettel had no way of knowing Raikenan was there, the wing mirrors are as useful as a chocolate fire guard.

GO FIGURE.

fatcat posted:

<snip>

The first words uttered by the commentator where, Verstappen’s made a good start, Vettel will need to cover him off. (which he did, emphatically).

<snip>

That would have been fine if that's what he did, unfortunately he left it too late to cover him off, instead relying on bully boy tactics to squeeze him; and that's never wise at the first comer.

It's not about blame, it's about taking responsibility for poor judgement leading to excessive aggression.  There's no outright blame - no further action was warranted or taken.

fatcat posted:

Tony Lockhart posted:

Blame blame blame. 

 

Says a lot about some people that they need to blame someone. 

 

You’re not wrong there.

It’s all down to Sky, turning a racing incident, with nobody to blame into a controversy, adding a bit of interest into a sport which has become one of the most uninteresting sports on TV. Only the drivers/engineers squabbling on the intercom is remotely entertaining.

The first words uttered by the commentator where, Verstappen’s made a good start, Vettel will need to cover him off. (which he did, emphatically).

Brundels initial comment on viewing Verstappen’s onboard camera was. Vettel had no way of knowing Raikenan was there, the wing mirrors are as useful as a chocolate fire guard.

GO FIGURE.

Exactly.

Nobody's fault. Nothing to take responsibility for. First corner racing incident.

Harry posted:

That little Schumacher moment may have cost him the WDC and Ferrari their gong in the process. Wouldn't that be both ironic and fitting? After the babyish and petulant Lewis, Vettel has been the next most disappointing World Champion in the last decade for attitude and conduct.  Can't argue with the skill levels though. - when they're not crashing into eachother!

I thought having an ego the size of a planet was a prerequisite for a successful F.1 driver! Seriously, whether you find their personalities attractive or not is simply a matter of personal taste, but I really don't think there's much to choose between any of them. To succeed they not only have to have a great car, great support and terrific ability - without the killer instinct and total self-belief they will never finish higher than 2nd. 

And let's face it, we all enjoy having a pop at the 'villains' don't we? If they were all Mr Nice Guys the sport would be pretty boring.

Agree with Timo1341.

To be a winner in F1, their is no room for Mr Nice Guy, on the track you have to be ruthless.... and have extraordinarily 'big balls' .......

And off track you have to deal with the media hype, and the constant ridiculous questions on what you had for breakfast? do you drink coffee before a race? ect ect ect plus the constant criticism if you lose...

At the end of the day Vettel got the biggest punishment possible for the incident... Lewis Hamilton gaining 25 points in the championship when we was expecting to “loose” 10 or so...

So yes it was a “racing incident” ... but perhaps it’s a lesson to Vettel that to finish first, first you have to finish and that to come first in the big battle sometimes it’s worth coming second in the smaller battle. 

Eloise posted:

At the end of the day Vettel got the biggest punishment possible for the incident... Lewis Hamilton gaining 25 points in the championship when we was expecting to “loose” 10 or so...

So yes it was a “racing incident” ... but perhaps it’s a lesson to Vettel that to finish first, first you have to finish and that to come first in the big battle sometimes it’s worth coming second in the smaller battle. 

I see the spelling "lose" (as in, "you will lose") used so infrequently these days, I wonder if it has become official to spell it as "loose" (as not in "the wheel nuts were loose")?

winkyincanada posted:

Eloise posted:

At the end of the day Vettel got the biggest punishment possible for the incident... Lewis Hamilton gaining 25 points in the championship when we was expecting to “loose” 10 or so...

So yes it was a “racing incident” ... but perhaps it’s a lesson to Vettel that to finish first, first you have to finish and that to come first in the big battle sometimes it’s worth coming second in the smaller battle. 

I see the spelling "lose" (as in, "you will lose") used so infrequently these days, I wonder if it has become official to spell it as "loose" (as not in "the wheel nuts were loose")?

It has most definitely not, at least not where the Queen's English is still spoken.

winkyincanada posted:

I see the spelling "lose" (as in, "you will lose") used so infrequently these days, I wonder if it has become official to spell it as "loose" (as not in "the wheel nuts were loose")?

No I'm just rubbish at spelling ... but in any case ... Vetel's biggest punishment was seeing his deficit to Lewis increase from 3 points to 28 points!

There are also some people on here are dyslexic.  In my case, amongst other things, I have no ability to distinguish double consonants, e.g.

Diferent and Different are the same thing to me; similarly necessary and necesary.  It's only the spelling checker that allows me to distinguish them at all.

At school, the teachers tried the impact cure for dyslexia (i.e. they hit me a lot), it didn't work. 

Huge posted:

There are also some people on here are dyslexic. 

I'm not dyslexic (or at least not diagnosed) ... I'm just thick!

Huge posted:

There are also some people on here are dyslexic.  In my case, amongst other things, I have no ability to distinguish double consonants, e.g.

Diferent and Different are the same thing to me; similarly necessary and necesary.  It's only the spelling checker that allows me to distinguish them at all.

At school, the teachers tried the impact cure for dyslexia (i.e. they hit me a lot), it didn't work. 

Funny, there used to be a driving school near me called 'Impact! School of Motoring'. That wasn't so appropriate either...

Eloise posted:

... Vetel's biggest punishment was seeing his deficit to Lewis increase from 3 points to 28 points!

Which is why it should have been Hamilton taken out instead of Alonso.

Bananahead posted:

Eloise posted:

... Vetel's biggest punishment was seeing his deficit to Lewis increase from 3 points to 28 points!

Which is why it should have been Hamilton taken out instead of Alonso.

Why should Hamilton be taken out? 

Bananahead posted:

Eloise posted:

... Vetel's biggest punishment was seeing his deficit to Lewis increase from 3 points to 28 points!

Which is why it should have been Hamilton taken out instead of Alonso.

But that would have not "punished" Vetel for his reckless driving; and would have been punishing Hamilton.  Vettel should have known that he was battling for the championship and that (given Mercedes were struggling) giving up first place on the track to Max (even letting Max win) would have been better than getting no points.

Its (as they say) about the bigger picture.

Even without Kimi on the far side of Max, Vettel's move was dangerous and he was relying on Max giving way - surely better to risk losing first place (which was not inevitable if he had continued on line) than risk not finishing the race due to a collision?

Except that the stewards disagree. No driver was at fault.

Hamilton didn't deserve to be taken out. But it would have made a for better race and championship.

Bananahead posted:

Except that the stewards disagree. No driver was at fault.

Well they said it was a “racing incident”.  That means no one driver could be held wholly responsible for the incident.  (And I’m not disagreeing with that decision).  It doesn’t mean that one driver wasn’t acting recklessly and got exactly what he deserved in scoring no points while his rival for the title scored maximum!

Anyway you missed the point I was making... at this point in the season with the relative positions of Vettel and Hamilton, Vettel should have been more circumspect and if he looses the championship by less than 25 points then he only has himself to blame for being hotheaded and getting taken out in an incident he could have avoided!

No that is exactly what it does mean. If anyone had acted recklessly then they would have been penalised. Penalties are given in almost every race.