F1 - 2017

Adam Zielinski posted:

There is a difference between drivers who are in F1 due to their sheer talent vs drivers who drive because they pay to be there....

Talent is talent, regardless. Are you saying Stroll doesn't have the skill/talent to merit his position? If yes, evidence please. If no, sounds like a case of prejudice against someone because of his Dad's cash. 

This is a rather lazy narrative. Sure, it was doing the pre season rounds but he has shown both skill and potential enough. 

When on the slowing down lap, procedures and shutdown check lists are gone through. As is moving onto the marbles to pick up. If another driver is still racing on the slowing down lap and coming around blind on the outside, that could be a "money can't buy you talent" scenario. Trouble is, it was Vettel whose head was on the wrong way around in this instance.

He's fuddled. He needs a holiday.

Had a holiday in August with the rest of them. 

Great race - full kudos to the Red Bull boys.  

Adam Zielinski posted:

It did.... didn't it. 
If it wasn't for his Dad's money, I don't think Stroll would be racing. Nor should he be allowed to...

There are very few people who can make it onto motor-racing without a "privileged" background. Most people can't afford the costly indulgence of this sport. Don't look to F1 for social justice.

Moderated Post:  Winky, I have removed a word that formed your first sentence.  While I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt that it was not mean't to be an insult, I'm aware that this is an international and multi-cultural forum - it has been read that way, so I have removed it.

Finkfan posted:

Ok race. Vettel drove well from the back of the grid. Bizarre post race incident between Vettel and Stroll 

Yep, good race.

I didn't see it as an insult, just airing a view that a certain post was, incorrect. And still no evidence, as requested, to show that it was anything but. 

Allegations regarding privileged backgrounds and lack of competence such as Adam made should be backed with evidence.

Tony Lockhart posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

There is a difference between drivers who are in F1 due to their sheer talent vs drivers who drive because they pay to be there....

Look at my quote from Wikipedia. What more would you ask?

 

And, the truth is that Williams are a team running in financial credit. Are you criticising Williams for requiring their own books to be balanced?

 

Stroll should have a bright future, as long as he copes with the relentless pressure of being a modern F1 driver.  

No - I'm not making any allegations.
It was you who projected Williams' story onto this - clearly an indication it troubles you.

Doesn't trouble me in the slightest. I've little to no allegiance to any team or driver. I just don't like people throwing loose, incorrect comments about drivers who are working hard to pursue their dreams. You say that Stroll is only in F1 because of his father's money. Well, the money certainly helped, but the one thing that nobody can do is wind back the clock and then see what would happen without that money. Of course, to make that a meaningful, if sci-fi, test, every other driver would have to have all family financial assistance removed, and all family time and effort. Hamilton only got to where he is because of his single-minded determination, his dad's relentless support, and McLaren's belief? That's just not fair!

Adam Zielinski posted:

There is a difference between drivers who are in F1 due to their sheer talent vs drivers who drive because they pay to be there....

Like Fangio you mean?

Finkfan posted:

Ok race. Vettel drove well from the back of the grid. Bizarre post race incident between Vettel and Stroll 

I’d say Vettel drove competently from the back of the grid.  Apart from Bottas he was behind his front running competitors and about where you would expect for one of the top three team from the back.

Post race was very bizarre.  The way I see it both were moving slightly towards each other, Stroll not aware Vettel was there, Vettel not expecting Stroll to be moving ... and they came together.

A true “racing incident” ... if it wasn’t for the fact the racing was over.

Eloise posted:

Finkfan posted:

Ok race. Vettel drove well from the back of the grid. Bizarre post race incident between Vettel and Stroll 

I’d say Vettel drove competently from the back of the grid.  Apart from Bottas he was behind his front running competitors and about where you would expect for one of the top three team from the back.

Post race was very bizarre.  The way I see it both were moving slightly towards each other, Stroll not aware Vettel was there, Vettel not expecting Stroll to be moving ... and they came together.

A true “racing incident” ... if it wasn’t for the fact the racing was over.

I thought Ricciardo's defensive move on Vettel was "interesting". Ultimately very effective of course, as Vettel never threatened again. I'd like to see a replay. Nobody else saw much malice in it of course, so I'm possibly just imagining things.

Eloise posted:

Finkfan posted:

Ok race. Vettel drove well from the back of the grid. Bizarre post race incident between Vettel and Stroll 

Post race was very bizarre.  The way I see it both were moving slightly towards each other, Stroll not aware Vettel was there, Vettel not expecting Stroll to be moving ... and they came together.

A true “racing incident” ... if it wasn’t for the fact the racing was over.

Yes, it will be interesting to see whether Vettel has to swap a gearbox (or worse) as a consequence. Personally, I'm not sure why he was going past Stroll in the first place.

A delayed wet FP2. Not much running. 

Lewis smashes the lap record to take his first Suzuka pole. Vettel will be along side him on the front row after Bottas takes his gearbox penalty. 

Having seen Lance Stroll’s onboard from that incident, I take it back. Seb is a tw&t!

Seb is a tw#t, ohhh I'm shocked, surely not.   Seriously tho' talking to a pub buddy who works at Williams,  you will be hard pushed to find anyone in the paddock to disagree with you & that includes in the red car team

Nice one Lewis!

No 4 beckons...

steve

Unfortunately

Why unfortunately? A great driver in a great car, driving well, with a team at the top of their game. Seems right to me. 

Tony Lockhart posted:

Why unfortunately? A great driver in a great car, driving well, with a team at the top of their game. Seems right to me. 

100% spot on Tony.   LH seems to attract a negative reaction among some F1 followers,  I really don't understand it,   it seems to be related to his character, life style or something that I'm just not tuned into.    My normally eloquent daughter who can't say his name without a snide remark has yet to explain it to me or at least explain it in F1 racing & driver terms.    Maybe someone on the forum can enlighten us.  

I’m a LH fan. I appreciate some like him and some don’t. I personally dislike SV and the now retired NR for various reasons. I felt NRs little digs at LH and his frosty encounter with Wolff post race today didn’t do him any favours. 

I thought NR was just enjoying a bit of banter. I'm no fan of his, but I don't think he was being nasty.  

Yeah I too don’t think he was being nasty. It’s a shame their friendship will never be what it once was.