can Nait 5SI sounds stronger then XS2 ?

Hi Dmitriy,

Sorry to read of your disappointment. If your XS2 is brand new it might take another couple of weeks before it really comes on song.

Chris

Dmitriy,

hi. The NaitXS has a history with some owners in the past about not producing great energy in the lower region. When I bought mine, years ago, I asked the owner why he was selling it and his rather laconic replay was poor bass. This is not to say that it is a bad or defective amp, but that perhaps it has a voice of its own, different from the 5si which, in turn, is more 'full' and slightly exuberant. The XS, though, is more introspective and has a much more interesting resolution of inner musical parts than the 5si. To my ears, it is perhaps the least 'Naim sounding' amp I have owned.

It would be useful to know, if it can be expressed, what you were expecting from it; what kind of changes for better you had in mind. If you miss bass energy, for instance, I would have suggested a SuperNait rather than a Nait XS; but the XS is probably more 'agile', more 'liquid'.

Chris's advice to let it run in and wait for a few weeks is a good one; but then, if you are not satisfied after that period, it is perfectly legitimate to go back to your dealer and have full support. Naim amps are all good amps, but none of them has to meet your taste.

Best wishes

Max

Hi Dmitriy

My XS2 took a few weeks of use before it sounded at its best, began a bit harsh and bright. It replaced a Quad 77 

Bob F

Please try with FlatCap XS 

i think the difference will be more obvious with 24\96 quality, but i listen 99% TIDAL FLAC + spotify 320 kbps. 

My upgrade was made with desire to achieve more detail and resolution in sound, especially in treble, Now i think the right way is change UQ2 to ND5 XS and return back 5SI, what do you think of this ?

I suspect you have grown used to the bouncy, exuberant sound of the 5si and you may, over time, grow to enjoy the XS more as you grow accustomed to it. Improving the source instead (or as well) may be a better solution for you, but there is a danger that you become trapped in a cycle of upgrades, never quite being satisfied, and always looking for the next expensive solution. If you are buying from a dealer, they should be able to help you choose an upgrade path that leads to a system you know you will like, because you have listened to it. 

If you are buying second hand gear, it's a bit more difficult, and you may just have to take a chance, and be prepared to re-sell anything that doesn't work out. 

I do think improving your source could be a good move. How about a 172, then move to a separate power amp such as 155 or 200?

Or how about ND5 XS and your XS2?

C.

It could be that there is less distortion and a lower noise floor with the XS2. Hence there is a tendency to play it louder. I found this when going from a NAP250.2 to the 300. In addition give it time (couple of months maybe) to bed in and for you to become accustomed to the different voicing. If you're still not satisfied look elsewhere

Mmm...one would like to think that the XS2 (even if voiced differently, allegedly) will sound much better than the 5si from the word go, even if not run in yet?  Considering the extra outlay/hierarchy  and expectations, this would be the minimum requirement no?

Or Naim is relying on a lot of faith?

Have you checked all connections are clean and firmly mated?

Stephen Tate posted:

Have you checked all connections are clean and firmly mated?

And that your speakers are still in phase?

C.

Christopher_M posted:

Stephen Tate posted:

Have you checked all connections are clean and firmly mated?

And that your speakers are still in phase?

C.

Yes, all connections is ok.

sheffieldgraham posted:

It could be that there is less distortion and a lower noise floor with the XS2. Hence there is a tendency to play it louder. I found this when going from a NAP250.2 to the 300. In addition give it time (couple of months maybe) to bed in and for you to become accustomed to the different voicing. If you're still not satisfied look elsewhere

Yes, I want to make sound louder and louder. Seems that 5SI makes hump on midbass which makes sound so "velvety".   this is like sugar - very hard refuse to it ! 

That is most bizarre -- at least from my experience. When I compared 5Si and XS2, I felt the XS2 was superior in every aspect (that was with an ND5XS as source). This impression was near instantly -- luckily my wife felt the same. Puuuh...  Did you buy second-hand or from a dealer? If from the latter, I would have a chat with my dealer to get him check the amp.

That's the main reason I purchased the cd5si instead of the 5xs. It just sounded more exuberant,robust and fun. 

The xs sounding refined and reserved compared to the si.

Just my opinion and my ears.

Hi, can't you try to move the speakers a bit closer to the wall? This might suport the bass more and whilst keeping the level of detail of the XS, improve (to a certain level) the bass response.

Your PMC's are front ported so I don't know to which extend this works on them - I have rear ported speakers and changing position the speakers is a great way of tone-control.

Dmitriy,

I'm curious what you're using for racking, your interconnects, and level of attention to cable dressing. If you're into set-and-forget then I can see where the basic musicality of a 5si works. If you're looking for greater insight and resolution to the music, then these fore mentioned factors become more important in optimizing a XS2.

It's worth trying to get hold of a second hand HiCap 2*; adding that will considerably increase the perceived bass weight and PRaT from the XS 2 without loosing the layers of extra detail and musicality.  In fact some people think the HiCap has too much effect and prefer the FlatCap as the effect from that isn't so strong.

If you find the HiCap works, you might choose to get it DRed, however although that increases the musical subtlety (in comparison to a HiCap 2) it may also decrease the perceived bass enhancement slightly.

* Don't forget that you need a SNAIC 4 to use with an integrated as well as the SNAIC 5 that comes with the HiCap; also make sure you get black SNAICS, they are quite a bit better than the earlier grey ones.

In the beginning I found the XS 2 to be a bit dull and lethargic compared to the 5si. The upside is that I'm able to listen to a larger part of my music collection without cringing.

I compare the XS 2 to a pair of stylish yet sensible leather shoes and the 5si to a pair of bright colored running shoes.

I haven't had the opportunity to hear the 5si or the XS2.  But many times I have heard differences in amplification where the step up lead to tighter bass, more airy sound, less perceived SPL and a feeling that the music was now a bit more sparse, indeed "lacking". But...

I think it all gets down to the "better" sound being less cluttered, less heavy, less dense and uncoloured with what I term, (scientifically of course), crap. Sometimes it's a shock to find out how basic a favourite recording actually is, and over time you move on and appreciate things that may have been too messy and complex before.

Iconoclast echoes a point that that I often made to clients when demonstrating "better" gear to them. Your hifi becomes a gateway to more and more music as it improves. Genre becomes less important with musicianship and composition becoming more important.

Other points regarding set-up and "synergy" between components are valid, as well as sonic signatures of different pieces of equipment. The observation about speaker placement is also true. But I feel that when you jump up the ladder, (bearing in mind that 95% of hifi equipment has not been designed with music in mind), to me it's the equipment stepping out of the way and letting the joy of music in.

Often it becomes clear when you drop back down the ladder. The "sugar" you spoke off becomes a bit too much and spoils the flavour.

Hi Dmitriy, Higher performance doesn't mean "better." Only the listener can decide what better means to them. It is not a given that a superior performing piece of equipment (aka more expensive) will sound better than something more humble. This was my experience with the Nait 5i-2.

The 5 series has a character that is not present in all Naim equipment and to my ears the XS2 lacks this character even though it is superior in the conventional hi-fi terms. On and on up the chain I demoed, appreciating what I heard but not being impressed relative to my 5i-2 until I heard a 252/300. While I preferred the 252 to the 5i-2, it didn't sound like a better 5i-2. In fact, the 552 is the only other Naim component I've heard that sounds like a 5 series box to me, though it's obviously much more capable.

When I first expressed this view to my dealer he thought I was mad; however after explaining to him what I was listening for, what sounded right to *me*, he understood my perspective. This insight ultimately led to the tube amplification I have now.

It may just be that you prefer the sound of the 5si to the XS2.

as i understand i'm not ready for serious sound so i'll try to upgrade  5si's  sound with more precision DAC for example.

Tnanks  everyone for answers !

Naijeru posted:

Hi Dmitriy, Higher performance doesn't mean "better." Only the listener can decide what better means to them. It is not a given that a superior performing piece of equipment (aka more expensive) will sound better than something more humble. This was my experience with the Nait 5i-2.

The 5 series has a character that is not present in all Naim equipment and to my ears the XS2 lacks this character even though it is superior in the conventional hi-fi terms. On and on up the chain I demoed, appreciating what I heard but not being impressed relative to my 5i-2 until I heard a 252/300. While I preferred the 252 to the 5i-2, it didn't sound like a better 5i-2. In fact, the 552 is the only other Naim component I've heard that sounds like a 5 series box to me, though it's obviously much more capable.

When I first expressed this view to my dealer he thought I was mad; however after explaining to him what I was listening for, what sounded right to *me*, he understood my perspective. This insight ultimately led to the tube amplification I have now.

It may just be that you prefer the sound of the 5si to the XS2.

Don't forget the Supernait. It has that beefy sound which I expect to be loved by Dimitry.

One can almost cut soundwaves with a knife. That beefy.