Thinking of upgrading to NDS or .........

Hi Crackie.

Not that you should not do it, but why are you making this move?  What are you after?

I have demoed the HDX, NDS, nDAC/555, and NDX-FM.  In some ways, the HDX with just a PowerLine into my NAC impressed me the most.  But I wanted the features of the nDAC and NDX-FM more.  If I had bought the HDX or NDS, I probably would not move, except, maybe, to gain FM and/or system automation.

All of these combinations are beyond excellent -- the sound of the HDX/PL moved me most, yet other priorities prevailed.

Nick

This is an interesting question indeed since very little, if not nothing, has been reported here on comparing nDAC with NDS post update v3.11.8, that brought some sound enhancement to the nDAC. I have both units but failed to run sound (pun intended) comparison. Lining up the 555DR back and forth behind the rack is cumbersome just like it is for many. All I can say is that a standalone nDAC is now already very very good. It seems to be sweeter, more relaxed, airy and more 3D. It all gets down to personal taste at that level. All I can suggest is to run the comparison yourself at a dealership or better, at home, if possible. A secundary question is your interest, today or tomorrow, in internet radio that NDS does offer. It took me four years to (almost) permanently hook up my Opal RJ45 and grow that interest even though I still prefer FM radio.. streaming. 

Chag -

I have never heard the difference as I choose to go from cd replay with ndac to nds. In my case this was a considerable step up. But it's not comparable to your situarion as you already have the top end combination of ndac / 555ps. I guess and you can see earlier accounts of that that the caracter of the machines is different. So besides a potential difference in refinement it comes down to that.

I hope that besides the obvious answer on go and listen, that also somebody can shed his light on the comparison, based on the last software upgrade. However I am not sure if anybody on the forum has that specific experience.

I found tthe NDS to be superior and a well worth upgrade over NDX /n DAC/ 555 (non dr) in a 252 / Supercap / 300 system. 

As always a good dealer and demo would be advisable but for me the NDS is a really good source and it just seems easier having one less box, power line, fraim, cables etc, 

regards 

Gary

At a certain point I had the NDX + 555PS+ nDac + XPS2. I tried all the combinations and the various end results were extremely worthwhile and captivating, prefering the NDX + XPS2 and nDac + 555PS.

However the NDS + 555PS DR is in a different league (IMHO) i.e. my current source.

I agree with both Gary and Sbilotta, having had an nDAC/555PS with anHDX and now an NDS using the HDX as a server, the NDS is far superior. Not so much in resolution but more in terms of ease and flow of the music. The nDaC/555PS is very dynamic but I found it could get a tad wearing after a while.

Cheers for the feedback. Interesting that a few comments have said the NDS gives a more relaxed flow of music vs the nDAC /555ps take on music. 

I just got a Super Lumina I/C and felt it has sorted out the slightly shouty / brittle sound I had (Hi Line I/C being the weak link in the system) whilst also giving much more resolution and drive to the music. To be honest I am loving life now with my system and the sound quality it brings and I feel it has the most balanced sound it has ever had and am very reluctant to change anything. However that NDS itch has always been there. I love rock/pop music and I do not want the sound to go too relaxed and mellow with a NDS.

A demo. is hard in a one Naim dealer town, who at last check did not have a NDS.

I will also pass on a speaker change, the S400 has respond superbly to the I/C upgrade and is singing beautifully. 

And I agree with all three of the above, having graduated from the same combo to the NDS, with which, as Jonn says, the music simply flows.

The one thing I would say, though, is hang onto your HDX, for use as a ripper / server.

I know that current advice would be to move to a software ripping solution, and acquire a NAS to store the music, with a UPnP server installed.

I didn't do this, and although it might seem that there's money tied up in the HDX, which could go towards the purchase of the NDS, the HDX provides a simple ripping / serving solution.

crackie posted:

 I love rock/pop music and I do not want the sound to go too relaxed and mellow with a NDS.

Mellow ??? when I listen to Rage Against The Machine or Massive Attack I don't feel too mellow ;-)

Indeed the NDS can rock when required. I went from NDX to NDS (with 252DR/250DR) so, yet again, my experience is not comparable with what you are considering. The NDS is a big step up in SQ from the NDX but I cannot of course say what uplift you will get from going from nDac to NDS.

What I would say is that as you are very happy with the current set up be very careful before deciding on changing anything, particularly in it involves spending an additional slug of cash. For this reason, and I realise demos might be tricky, I would strongly advise a home demo with an NDS, even if you have to wait for your one dealer to get one in.

Good luck.

I had an in-store demo of an NDS against my nDAC. The system was 282/SCDR/300DR/Sopra2/full SL loom.  The front end was CDX2.2/XP5XS into nDAC/555PSDR.  We tried the NDS as a straight replacement for the nDAC i.e. using it just as a dac, then tried the NDS being fed by a US.  I was fully expecting to prefer the NDS and so was very surprised (though pleased, as it saved me a lot of money) to find I preferred the nDAC both times.  A friend was with me for the demo, who doesn't have a Naim system, and he too preferred the nDAC.  The performance with nDAC seemed to have more vitality.  So, try before you buy, and ideally with a longish home demo.

I think you'd be mad to change anything from what you describe currently. 

The NDS will be superseded in the not too distant future, that surely is the time to consider changing. 

Enjoy what you have and take an antihistamine for the itch. 

.sjb

 

The NDS will be superseded in the not too distant future, that surely is the time to consider changing. 

Just like the nDAC, and probably at Statement price level. There will be more NDS joining the nDAC S/H crowd.

Distance indeed may be then the all relative issue.

Chag -

Sloop John B posted:

I think you'd be mad to change anything from what you describe currently. 

The NDS will be superseded in the not too distant future, that surely is the time to consider changing. 

Enjoy what you have and take an antihistamine for the itch. 

 

.sjb

Just ordered an NDS....it will be great, and 'green' is good for me, don't want to start adding 'white' bits...

Having heard the best that Naim, Linn and Chord have to offer plus flavour of the month speakers from Kudos and Focal and various hi-end cables over the years, the idea that there is something just over the horizon that will make everything that came before "sound broken" is a myth that keeps HiFi manufactures in business.

Once you reach a certain level, differences are more to do with sound signature and what type of presentation you prefer. Differences in scale are a factor of the size of the speaker and room interface.

Unfortunately fora like this are not that helpful in making a choice as you will get different answers based on individual preferences (surprise,surprise). So it comes down to the only piece of advice that makes any sense, listen for yourself.

Jonn posted:

Having heard the best that Naim, Linn and Chord have to offer plus flavour of the month speakers from Kudos and Focal and various hi-end cables over the years, the idea that there is something just over the horizon that will make everything that came before "sound broken" is a myth that keeps HiFi manufactures in business.

 

 

It's not so much sound as features I'm alluding to. 

Any "new" NDS will be based on the new uniti platform, which even if it sounds no better will have extra features and abilities like over the air upgrades. 

And the big one for me, will most likely have Roon. 

It's not worth scratching the itch IMO from this perspective. 

.sjb

The NDS is in a different league to the DAC. But don't take anyone's word for it. Your ears will know what suits you. If you prefer the DAC you're going to save an awful lot of money. You can't lose.

After much thought I think I'll go with a set of SL speaker cables. Much cheaper than a NDS upgrade and a safer bet in regards to a very musical upgrade whilst maintaining the superb system balance that I now enjoy and want to keep.

Sloop John B posted:

Jonn posted:

Having heard the best that Naim, Linn and Chord have to offer plus flavour of the month speakers from Kudos and Focal and various hi-end cables over the years, the idea that there is something just over the horizon that will make everything that came before "sound broken" is a myth that keeps HiFi manufactures in business.

 

 

It's not so much sound as features I'm alluding to. 

Any "new" NDS will be based on the new uniti platform, which even if it sounds no better will have extra features and abilities like over the air upgrades. 

And the big one for me, will most likely have Roon. 

It's not worth scratching the itch IMO from this perspective. 

.sjb

I've recently purchased a s/h NDX and this^ makes me wonder about that. It would be nice if the current line could be upgraded to at least stream higher res files that what if currently does. Not sure if that's even an option with hardware involved. 

crackie posted:

After much thought I think I'll go with a set of SL speaker cables. Much cheaper than a NDS upgrade and a safer bet in regards to a very musical upgrade whilst maintaining the superb system balance that I now enjoy and want to keep.

Good move. I actually do own both an nDAC (being fed off an NDX) and and an NDS...  I couldn't decide which one I liked more, so ended up keeping them both (in separate systems).

There is one difference I noticed, which may favour the nDAC - it seems to be more effective at upgrading external sources (like NDX or CDX2.2). Plugging my CDX2.2 into the NDS did not seem to yield the same effect as connecting it to the nDAC.

Ditto Adam, I couldn't part from my beloved nDAC after falling for the NDS. This being agreed, I found my CD5 XS singing sweet and flowing like never before when on NDS via DC1. 

Chag -

Chag... posted:

Ditto Adam, I couldn't part from my beloved nDAC after falling for the NDS. This being agreed, I found my CD5 XS singing sweet and flowing like never before when on NDS via DC1. 

Chag -

Hi

awaiting delivery of an NDS, was going to sell the NDac and feed CDX2 digi into NDS...

Maybe I should keep it for the CDX2, and put a (spare) XPS2DR either on the NDac or the CDX2...

Some trials required methinks..

Have a good Sunday

Just found this thread... to the OP I had a NDAC/555PS and was was going to upgrade to a NDS/555PSDR.. it was all worked out with a good trade in all lined up... I had an extensive home demo - a couple of weeks - and I ended up keeping the NDAC. They are very different - and there was something about the NDAC - a slightly organic earthy analogue sound that I really liked - it just wasn't there on the NDS, however music like choral music on the NDS absolutely beat the NDAC. The NDS sounds a fair bit more  refined than the NDAC, but perhaps loses that slight Naim 'sound' and punch.. so audition carefully.

Simon; Could your impressions and preferences at 282/250.2 level be different now since on 252DR and with nDAC updated to v4.11.8?   

Chag -

Hi Chag, I did my extensive listening on the earlier Naim firmware, and yes the attractive organic sound has slightly diluted on the latest firmware, but I had already decided to sell my NDAC.

Yes the 252DR provides less of its colour to the sources compared to the 282 so if you like the differences between the sources are more pronounced with the 252DR and the 552DR

Simon