In praise of 272/250DR

TonyK posted:

Picking up my 272 this afternoon from my dealer.  Took 4 weeks from placing order. Replacing the Uniti 2. Reading all the posts on this thread can I expect a big difference once run in?

I moved from a Uniti 2 as well. What I've learned is the U2 is a very good piece of kit. Is the 272/XPS/250 better? Yes. Is the U2 embarrassed by the 272 combo? No IMO. I'm happy with the move I made but it's not as big of a difference as the price would make it seem. Enjoy the new kit. Just to be clear I'm not going back to the U2 from here but it is a nice piece. 

SS : Many thanks for reply. Just that my U2 with 250Dr has been sounding so good lately that I was dreaming of even more from the 272. Next is the XPS DR and then a SL ic and speaker cables by Cristmas time. My U 2 is being inherited by my daughter and her husband so it will stil be in the family.

TonyK posted:

SS : Many thanks for reply. Just that my U2 with 250Dr has been sounding so good lately that I was dreaming of even more from the 272. Next is the XPS DR and then a SL ic and speaker cables by Cristmas time. My U 2 is being inherited by my daughter and her husband so it will stil be in the family.

You will get more from the 272. I was more reminiscing on just how good the U2 actually was in my house. Ice also added SL IC. Can't really comment on it benefit or lack of benefit. I added it all at about the same time. 

Is anyone using the N272 in an Active setup? N272 --> Snaxo --> Poweramps?

Ardbeg10y posted:

Is anyone using the N272 in an Active setup? N272 --> Snaxo --> Poweramps?

[@mention:65907191339557814] used his with Dynaudio XD 600. Not sure if that's the same application you're referring to or not. 

TonyK posted:

SS : Many thanks for reply. Just that my U2 with 250Dr has been sounding so good lately that I was dreaming of even more from the 272. Next is the XPS DR and then a SL ic and speaker cables by Cristmas time. My U 2 is being inherited by my daughter and her husband so it will stil be in the family.

Take a breath, man. You've just dropped over three grand on a piece of equipment without apparently knowing conclusively that it's better than what you already have. And before you've even got it, you're planning 7k's worth of further spending on it.

Audiophilia nervosa/galloping upgraditis loom.

Ardbeg10y posted:

Is anyone using the N272 in an Active setup? N272 --> Snaxo --> Poweramps?

No reason you couldn't do that. But it does seem somewhat at odds philosophy wise. Multi box count vs low box count ethos exemplified by the 272. Having said that, if I was remotely interested in streaming, which I'm not, I might consider swapping out my 282/SC for the 272/XPSDR. The difference has been reported by many as minimal to inaudible, which, if true, would make the 272 one of the Greatest Naim Bargains of all time!

I must say a NAPSC on the 202 (I presume you mean, not a 292?) did not have that effect on me.

In fact I thought it had little effect or benefit so I'll try my 202 without it. 

... must be my ears!

I suspect that the investment required to go active and the fact that, as I understand it, an active set up is more revealing of any weakness in the source would mean that a 272 active set up is relatively rare.

My 272/XPSDR/250DR/SL2 set up sounds wonderful but if I decided, in time, to move to active I suspect trading in the 272 for NDS / NDX and 282 would be part of the equation.

That said I'd be very interested to hear if anyone is running a 272 active and what observations they may wish to share.

S3 posted:

I suspect that the investment required to go active and the fact that, as I understand it, an active set up is more revealing of any weakness in the source would mean that a 272 active set up is relatively rare.

My 272/XPSDR/250DR/SL2 set up sounds wonderful but if I decided, in time, to move to active I suspect trading in the 272 for NDS / NDX and 282 would be part of the equation.

That said I'd be very interested to hear if anyone is running a 272 active and what observations they may wish to share.

I cannot afford NDS / 552 etc ... but my to-be-collected Ovators 600's benefit strongly when configured in active mode. Think to feed the setup by a 272.

Cool. As I said I'd love to learn how you get on if you decide to go 272 active!

I got 272/250dr last week after some crafty work by my dealer, upgraded from a non naim system and I am blown away by the detail, punch, clarity and the ease of use. Plus it's not even run in yet! I am also driving a set of monitor audio platinum pl200s which seems a rare choice to pair but these 2 black boxes have really brought the best from them, I couldn't be happier. XPS next... once my wallet has recovered  

My foray into streaming is in its infancy, but I am liking the results.  I couldn't justify going straight to an ND5 XS (which would match the rest of my system) so have a Cambridge Audio CXN.  It is really very good and holds its own against my CD5XS+FlatcapXS in direct comparison (playing the CD I'm streaming and switching between inputs).

But I am so impressed I was thinking next step could be SN2+NDX.  Realising that the direct alternative is the 272+250DR, at least in terms of outlay this thread suggests the latter is a better approach.  However how would the 272+200DR fare?  Reason is that I would struggle with changing from my Neat Motive SX2's - anything else would be too big in our living room, and therefore do I need the extra power of the 250.  Or is it's extra grip on the speaker more the point?

Judge posted:

My foray into streaming is in its infancy, but I am liking the results.  I couldn't justify going straight to an ND5 XS (which would match the rest of my system) so have a Cambridge Audio CXN.  It is really very good and holds its own against my CD5XS+FlatcapXS in direct comparison (playing the CD I'm streaming and switching between inputs).

But I am so impressed I was thinking next step could be SN2+NDX.  Realising that the direct alternative is the 272+250DR, at least in terms of outlay this thread suggests the latter is a better approach.  However how would the 272+200DR fare?  Reason is that I would struggle with changing from my Neat Motive SX2's - anything else would be too big in our living room, and therefore do I need the extra power of the 250.  Or is it's extra grip on the speaker more the point?

To my knowledge Neat speakers have the reputation that they are easy to drive. I tried the SX1 with my humble XS2 -- no problems at all. So I would assume that the 200DR should do a marvelous job with the SX2 (which should be easier to drive than the SX1; 8 rather than 6 Ohm). 

With a 272 there is little point in a 200DR. A used 200 will be virtually as good, and perfectly fine with Neat Motive 2. 

Back to the forum after a couple of years vacation and just back from Demo of the N272 + NAP250DR. Couldn't resist so made my order and signed, waiting for sealed and delivery. 

Traded my NAIT XS and keeping my CD5XS.

Summer of Love 2017   50th anniversary ✌

I can tell you from my own experience that a NAP 200 has no problem driving a Neat Motive SX2

Judge posted:

My foray into streaming is in its infancy, but I am liking the results.  I couldn't justify going straight to an ND5 XS (which would match the rest of my system) so have a Cambridge Audio CXN.  It is really very good and holds its own against my CD5XS+FlatcapXS in direct comparison (playing the CD I'm streaming and switching between inputs).

But I am so impressed I was thinking next step could be SN2+NDX.  Realising that the direct alternative is the 272+250DR, at least in terms of outlay this thread suggests the latter is a better approach.  However how would the 272+200DR fare?  Reason is that I would struggle with changing from my Neat Motive SX2's - anything else would be too big in our living room, and therefore do I need the extra power of the 250.  Or is it's extra grip on the speaker more the point?

I had a CD5i + Nait 5i into Motive 2s, followed by a CD5XS + 152/155 into Motive 2s, followed by an NDX/SN2 into Motive 2s, and the Motive 2s just kept on improving with each hardware upgrade.  However I felt that when I got to the NDX/SN2 that they started to become the weakest link in the chain.  

FWIW I chose the NDX+SN2 knowing the 272 wasn't far away but don't regret my choice at all.  In my opinion I would look at either NDX+SN2 or 272+250DR.

Having owned NDX/SN2 for a few years I'd take a 272/250DR over it any day of the week.

G

S3 posted:

I suspect that the investment required to go active and the fact that, as I understand it, an active set up is more revealing of any weakness in the source would mean that a 272 active set up is relatively rare.

My 272/XPSDR/250DR/SL2 set up sounds wonderful but if I decided, in time, to move to active I suspect trading in the 272 for NDS / NDX and 282 would be part of the equation.

That said I'd be very interested to hear if anyone is running a 272 active and what observations they may wish to share.

Re: 282, last month I moved from Naim DAC/282/300/SL2 to 272/300DR/SL2. For me the 272/300DR  delivers a warmer more natural sound. I suspect the combination of the 272 and DR upgrade is responsible. Rather than the 272 or 300DR Not disappointed in the least. Both systems fed with FLAC files.

Ardbeg10y posted:

Is anyone using the N272 in an Active setup? N272 --> Snaxo --> Poweramps?

As Spurrier Sucks said,i have traded my 250 dr for the xpsdr,and sold my passive speakers (Taksim's) and i now use Dynaudio XD 600's,which are active.This is much different than the way you want to "go active",i am feeding the XD's directly from the 272's digital/SPDIF out.The XD'S keep the signal in the digital domain all the way to the drivers,with built in digital amps and DSP.The end result is simply the best sound i have ever heard in my home,as if live musicians are in my room...with well recorded material,at least.

Judge posted:

But I am so impressed I was thinking next step could be SN2+NDX.  Realising that the direct alternative is the 272+250DR, at least in terms of outlay this thread suggests the latter is a better approach.  However how would the 272+200DR fare?  Reason is that I would struggle with changing from my Neat Motive SX2's - anything else would be too big in our living room, and therefore do I need the extra power of the 250.  Or is it's extra grip on the speaker more the point?

This is where you need to listen and decide for yourself. I spent a fair amount of time at my dealers doing that, and I found NDX based systems consistently sounded better than the 272, so that's what I bought. I went into the process expecting that I would probably come away with a 272, and I certainly wouldn't have been disappointed if that's what I'd bought, but to my ears, at any given price point, NDX systems just seemed to sound more musical.

Judge posted:

But I am so impressed I was thinking next step could be SN2+NDX.  Realising that the direct alternative is the 272+250DR, at least in terms of outlay this thread suggests the latter is a better approach.  However how would the 272+200DR fare?  Reason is that I would struggle with changing from my Neat Motive SX2's - anything else would be too big in our living room, and therefore do I need the extra power of the 250.  Or is it's extra grip on the speaker more the point?

Don't rule out a change to your speakers Judge. I moved from a Superuniti to a SN2/NDX (and then added XPS DR) and always thought that my living room would be out of balance with bigger speakers. But I also was sure that my Neat Motive 2's were limiting my system.

So I tried some PMC 25.23's. The first reaction both from myself and my wife was 'they seem really big' but 'wow, they sound really good' too! Once the initial reaction is assimilated into the brain and you live with the change for a week or so, it soon becomes normal.

In fact when I look at the pictures before and after, my Motives look a bit small for the room now!

Heres the post I made in System Pics to give you an idea:  https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...27#64781167027054227

Food for thought maybe?

Thanks for the responses.  PMC would be my first port of call if I thought I could change speakers.  I have always changed the speakers once the electronics got to a point where it was needed.  So perhaps I should continue to move toward that point through the next upgrade cycle, then see what happens...  

(Thanks for the link to the pics Chrish, I remember seeing them at the time now).

Judge posted:

Thanks for the responses.  PMC would be my first port of call if I thought I could change speakers.  I have always changed the speakers once the electronics got to a point where it was needed.  So perhaps I should continue to move toward that point through the next upgrade cycle, then see what happens...  

(Thanks for the link to the pics Chrish, I remember seeing them at the time now).

Judge, tbh, the enthusiasm I profess for the 272/250DR combo at the start of this thread was because of the sounds I heard from that amp team in combo with the PMC fact.8's. None of the other speakers I heard were any  better than OK quite frankly, but the 272/250DR's with fact.8's were musically just gripping stuff. Lightning quick, huge emotional connection, no overhang - so no 'fuzz'  getting in the way of the artistes uniqueness and expressive power. Rare in any system in my experience.  Strongly recommend an audition.