64 Bit n-serve

good question, it might be better to contact Naim directly in order to get a prompt answer ...

SecondOne posted:

Does anybody know if Naim is planning an update?

I have no idea, but given the myriad of software-related issues Naim are currently dealing with (as it appears to me reading this forum) the better question might be whether Naim have a timeline on your particular update and what priority your case merits in their grand scheme. Maybe it's an easy fix, but I wonder if Naim is attempting to tackle all things software in-house or have brought on consultants to assist in the short-term.

You both are right. I contacted Naim directly, waiting for an answer.

Apple have a policy of only maintaining backward compatibility for a short time.

If you buy Apple products you just have to accept this, and change everything else to suit as and when it occurs.  If that means re-buying all your programmes on a desktop or laptop, or your apps on a portable device, that's what you have to do.  If compatible replacements from 3rd parties aren't available, well so be it; you should have bought Apple software.  If you have to change your servers or other attached hardware well tough, they're just not part of the apple environment; so in Apple's eyes they don't count - you'll just have to change them (and that applies Naim audio systems just as much as it applies to servers or minis or mainframe computers for that matter).

This is simply a commercial decision on their part, noting more, nothing less

Apple have warned developers and users that 32bit apps will not be supported for the last year, on the very app itself when opening.

For phones apple have consistently been far ahead in terms of backwards compatibility, keeping older phones updated for as long as possible. 

Well the iPhone 5C is the newest phone no longer compatible with 

Huge posted:

Apple have a policy of only maintaining backward compatibility for a short time.

[...]

This is simply a commercial decision on their part, noting more, nothing less

Well ... the 5C is the newest phone incompatible with 64bit ... that was introduced 4 years ago (by the time IOS11 is released) and will have been discontinued for 2 years.

Its not just a commercial decision (if by which you mean stopping support to force people to upgrade), its about removing complications and eliminating code which may cause problems in the future.

If nServe isn't updated, that is Naim's bad not Apple's.  Its my understanding that (excepting issues) its pretty much a case of recompiling the existing code to support 64bit.  The question is: is Naim still supporting the Uniti Serve / HDX?

Eloise posted:

 The question is: is Naim still supporting the Uniti Serve / HDX?

I'm very eager to hear the answer ... the HDX is already out there since 2008 

Klout10 posted:

Eloise posted:

 The question is: is Naim still supporting the Uniti Serve / HDX?

I'm very eager to hear the answer ... the HDX is already out there since 2008 

And the HDX is still on the Naim product list on the website, with a link to the nServe app page on the Naim site. SO as a product that is still on sale, it'd be helpful to have an app that worked on current versions of IOS.

Eloise posted:

Well the iPhone 5C is the newest phone no longer compatible with 

Huge posted:

Apple have a policy of only maintaining backward compatibility for a short time.

[...]

This is simply a commercial decision on their part, noting more, nothing less

Well ... the 5C is the newest phone incompatible with 64bit ... that was introduced 4 years ago (by the time IOS11 is released) and will have been discontinued for 2 years.

Its not just a commercial decision (if by which you mean stopping support to force people to upgrade), its about removing complications and eliminating code which may cause problems in the future.

If nServe isn't updated, that is Naim's bad not Apple's.  Its my understanding that (excepting issues) its pretty much a case of recompiling the existing code to support 64bit.  The question is: is Naim still supporting the Uniti Serve / HDX?

4 years support is only a short time (Windows 10 will run DOS applications if they are safe).  And I'm not just talking about support for their own hardware, but the lack of support for their user base who are using older applications.

That's commercial reasoning:  It would be technically possible to continue providing virtualised OS support for the code

If Apple change things after a product is released why should all the 3rd party developers in the world be expected to suddenly jump to Apple's new tune; the 3rd party developers didn't cause the problem that stops the code running - Apple did.

P.S.  not all code can be so easily recompiled to a new OS, and even if it can there's a whole new set of full test / debug / fix / retest... cycles to go through.

They havnt suddenly changed their tune. Developers and users have been warned for more than a year.

Good point, I must remember to hang on to my iPad and a couple of old iPhones just in case.

garyi posted:

They havnt suddenly changed their tune. Developers and users have been warned for more than a year.

It's not a change of tune at all, Apple have been this arrogant for many years.

Dev, Test and Release projects are usually planned substantially more than a year in advance.  In business, 1 year warning isn't just sudden, it's precipitous!

I couldn't disagree with you more.

I bet naim have known for a very long time about this. The developer community for apple is the strongest out there, the tools provided them by apple are second to none. Apple are not arrogant when it comes to its developers and I contend huge, that you are wrong.

If naim do not have a solution here, thats naims doing, not apples. Technology moves on and in the world of phones, Apple is simply the best out there in terms of how long it supports its hardware, Android is extremely poor in this, and Windows is far out at sea, not evening talking to its community of users whether they give a flying toss about the platform.

Your reference to desktop pcs is nonsense in this context.

Apple thrives on their marketing scheme of built-in obsolescence. I find most younger Apple users content to disband their old devices as a rationalization and/or "need" to keep up with the latest and greatest technology. If manufacturers are going to base their server software on Apple's platform then they'll have to pay the piper in due time. I'd be surprised if this issue wasn't on Naim's calendar, but they've really got their hands full right now don't they?

joerand posted:

Apple thrives on their marketing scheme of built-in obsolescence. I find most younger Apple users content to disband their old devices as a rationalization and/or "need" to keep up with the latest and greatest technology. If manufacturers are going to base their server software on Apple's platform then they'll have to pay the piper in due time. I'd be surprised if this issue wasn't on Naim's calendar, but they've really got their hands full right now don't they?

N-Serve isn't the server software, it's the client app. So the question is, if I update my IPhone to the latest OS when it launches, can I still control my HDX via the app?

joerand posted:

Apple thrives on their marketing scheme of built-in obsolescence. I find most younger Apple users content to disband their old devices as a rationalization and/or "need" to keep up with the latest and greatest technology. If manufacturers are going to base their server software on Apple's platform then they'll have to pay the piper in due time. I'd be surprised if this issue wasn't on Naim's calendar, but they've really got their hands full right now don't they?

Agreed,

Part of the problem is that PCs & Macs are fairly reliable & powerful so marketeers have to push new/different software out the door, some of which is just not needed but when the next big thing comes along, the hipsters lap it up, whilst grey beards shake their heads muttering ' but theres no NT4 network drivers to connect this to the Novell server'.

Seven years ago I bought a new BMW 3 series and I went to Performance Parts Tuning Ltd to get some performance kit for it.  I've just upgraded to the latest BMW 3 series and the performance kit doesn't fit on the new model.  Performance Parts Tuning Ltd should now provide me with the same things for the new model free of charge.

Really?  

I can buy a Naim HDX new today for over £5,000, the control application they provide for IOS which is listed in the HDX features on their website won't run on the IPhone operating system already announced, in beta and expected to be launched in September.

Really?

That's like buying the old model 3 series rather then the bright shiny new one.  You could find an older iPhone to match!

Don't blame Naim for Apple's commercial decisions.

(You could always buy a Unity Star when they come out and buy an Android device to control it)

Huge posted:

(You could always buy a Unity Star when they come out and buy an Android device to control it)

An Android device where after each update and on different devices there are difficulties and issues with the application?

This doesn't impact me personally, my HDX is being boxed for sale, I have an IPad 2, so won't be going to IOS 11 on my tablet, but thought it was worth pointing out the fact that Naim are selling an active product with as yet no evidence they will keep the control application up to date with the operating system it is designed to work on. There's no blame in my mind, just trying to make the facts clear.

Is there an infrared remote control?

Yes, which does not provide the same level of functionality as the app unless you sit very close to the rack or use binoculars. And isn't even referenced in the product feature list on the Naim product page. The touch screen is references as a product feature.

Eloise posted:

Huge posted:

(You could always buy a Unity Star when they come out and buy an Android device to control it)

An Android device where after each update and on different devices there are difficulties and issues with the application?

Those are backward compatibility bugs due to inadequate testing rather than Google intentionally killing off 3rd party applications.

Huge posted:

Eloise posted:

Huge posted:

(You could always buy a Unity Star when they come out and buy an Android device to control it)

An Android device where after each update and on different devices there are difficulties and issues with the application?

Those are backward compatibility bugs due to inadequate testing rather than Google intentionally killing off 3rd party applications.

It doesn't matter why it doesn't work ... the point is that Apple are killing off 32bit support to ensure the OS works the best with new hardware.  Its been known they would kill off 32bit support since the 64bit OS / ARM cores came out in 2013.

Its up to Naim to keep their app up to date if they want it working on new versions of IOS.