My Baby's back in town...
Posted by: Monster on 15 June 2017
About 6 weeks ago, my CDS2 started to act up. It took a holiday at the Plurison spa in Montreal, and came back today. In it's place, I was using a Rega Apollo-r, which was more than fine. I got used to the sound over time, and even contemplated selling the CDS2 once it came home. Not any more. All it took was the opening few notes on Paul Chambers' excellent Bass on Top cd for me to realize just how much I was missing my CDS2. The music now has a richness, depth, and drama that the little Rega player just couldn't emulate. Happy camper, me.
Rest of system is HiLine/72/Hi/140/Quadraspire Q4 Evo/Totem Arros.
BBM
I love the CDS2. Have you considered a 555 power supply? The new PS will really make it sing!
Love your post BBM.
This is a supreme example of how the human brain does not have an accurate recall of sound, making nonsense of many claims that X sounded better than Y if compared from memory without at least a common direct reference point - and indeed, I would venture, the same is true of many of the claims about burning in, which in reality are much more likely to be the listener's brain burning in (=learning to like, as the OP did when firced just to use the Rega)..
Innocent Bystander posted:This is a supreme example of how the human brain does not have an accurate recall of sound, making nonsense of many claims that X sounded better than Y if compared from memory without at least a common direct reference point - and indeed, I would venture, the same is true of many of the claims about burning in, which in reality are much more likely to be the listener's brain burning in (=learning to like, as the OP did when firced just to use the Rega)..
IMHO, their is definitely a burn in process??
wenger2015 posted:Innocent Bystander posted:This is a supreme example of how the human brain does not have an accurate recall of sound, making nonsense of many claims that X sounded better than Y if compared from memory without at least a common direct reference point - and indeed, I would venture, the same is true of many of the claims about burning in, which in reality are much more likely to be the listener's brain burning in (=learning to like, as the OP did when firced just to use the Rega)..
IMHO, their is definitely a burn in process??
For some things undoubredly, but not for everything, and not to the extent cited in some posts - night and day changes from day to day as a 10mm2 mains supply cable burns in?! (Not sure if that specific statement has been made, but similar things have).
I'm with Innocent Bystander. There is things warming up, which can but doesn't have to take an hour or so and there's loudspeakers where there are flexible materials to stress and padding etc to settle, but after that? Brain burning-in strikes me as a better explanation that most of the others I have seen. (I am in an argumentative mood this afternoon.)
best
David
OK, I'll take the argument...
Electrolytic capacitors can "burn-in": The process of final formation (of the dielectric) can take a significant length of time to complete, and various electrical properties of the capacitor change during the process.
However I also believe that the most variable and unreliable component in the listening chain is the nut in front of the speakers!
So burn in... 10% to 30% electronic, 70% to 90% human! (and maybe more than that, particularly up to 100% for things like cables!).
Huge posted:OK, I'll take the argument...
Electrolytic capacitors can "burn-in": The process of final formation (of the dielectric) can take a significant length of time to complete, and various electrical properties of the capacitor change during the process.
However I also believe that the most variable and unreliable component in the listening chain is the nut in front of the speakers!
So burn in... 10% to 30% electronic, 70% to 90% human! (and maybe more than that, particularly up to 100% for things like cables!).
I mostly agree with this. But I'm not sure why the change in electrical properties of a capacitor over the early period should necessarily always be a good thing, unless one believes that the designer calculates and relies on the performance of an aged component. Also I think good electrical design shouldn't be so dependant on capacitor characteristics (analogue filters etc excepted).
But for cables, plugs and sockets, adapters etc I think burn-in is in the mind of the listener.
best
David
The burn in (or not) debate will no doubt rage on into infinity meanwhile very pleased indeed to hear you have been reunited with an exceptional cd player BBM.
ATB Mike
If you spend a considerable amount of cash on a new black box, you are almost willing it to sound superb from the off.
The reality is somewhat different, over a process of time, many many hours, it eventually reaches a sweet spot, and one feels extremely relieved.
Our dealers call it a 'burn in process', having experienced this process a number of times, I call it a 'burn in process'....
Maybe this is more of an occurrence when it's a New black box..??
If you can't measure it, you can't prove it. Religion, directional cables, life after death, ad infinitum.
So how do you know that an orange tastes like an orange?
sktn77a posted:If you can't measure it, you can't prove it. Religion, directional cables, life after death, ad infinitum.
Is the earth flat as well?
Yes according to the Landsdowne Baptists!
I am certain that there is a modicum of psycho-acoustical effect going on. The big thing here, though, is that I purposely chose the Paul Chambers recording because it opens with a deep, bowed acoustic bass which is somewhat tricky for lower level players. With the CDS2, not only was there a much greater richness and depth of tone, but there was articulation and nuance that simply wasn't audible with the Apollo. The Apollo is an amazing cdp for the price, and it's errors are only of omission. It isn't bright or shouty, and it times very well, but it lacks a little in dynamics and control. But ultimately it performs WAY beyond it's meagre price category. My Hiline alone cost me $100 more than the Apollo did.
The CDS2 just has a rightness about it that makes it that much more musical and enjoyable. The difference between the two cd players is ultimately large, especially after one has lived with a CDS level player for so many years. But if I had to use the Apollo for the rest of my days I certainly wouldn't find it offensive in any way. Maybe just not as involving or accomplished. That's why we pay so much for these little things; because they really are big things in the end.
I'm sure glad my baby's back...
BB.
Huge posted:Yes according to the Landsdowne Baptists!
No its Landsdowne flatists ....