one speaker is veeeery quiet - tested everything I can think of!

Posted by: Hoolio on 25 June 2017

I have a problem where the sound out of the left speaker is almost non-existent - when I swing the balance hard to the left it sounds like the 'shadow' of the right speaker channel...but it's only when I am using the DAC as the source.

Amps: Olive series 102 to 180

Speakers: SBLs

DAC: Beresford Caiman MkII (about 6 months old) with Chromecast input

Testing to try and identify the issue and assumptions as below:

1 - DAC onto each input on the 102, same issue on all inputs - conclusion: it's all or none of the inputs at fault

2 - Mini-jack to Din cable to test each input - both speakers working at full volume - conclusion: it's not the inputs, and the amps appear to be OK too as they are sending perfect stereo music to both speakers with this setup.

3 - Swapped speaker cables over out of the 180 - now the right speaker is the quiet one - conclusion: the signal isn't exiting the 180 to the left speaker

4 - Used NAD amp in place of the Naim amps streaming through the DAC with an RCA to RCA lead to this amp- all working perfectly - conclusion: The problem is either the RCA to Din lead I use from the DAC to my 102, or my Naim amps are at fault. Also confirms the speakers are fine, and that the DAC is fine.

5 - Used DAC and Chroemcast to stream to my other stereo (cheap NAD amp and Mission speakers, RCA to RCA cable from DAC to amp) - all works perfectly - conclusion: DAC and Chromecast are definitely not the issue. Maybe it's the RCA to DIN cable from DAC to Naim amp?

6 - Bought a new RCA to DIN cable - problem remains. dammit! maybe this cable is stuffed as well? it was a cheap one - USD$30 on Ebay. switching red and black RCA out of the DAC it stays quiet in the left speaker - conclusion: confused! Does this mean the cable is OK, as the problem is identical at the speaker end when swapping them over?

6 - use Coaxial input to the DAC to remove Chromecast from the equation, same quiet in left issue.

7 - got the boxes out to package the amps up to take to a repair place, and had a read of the manual...didn't realise the connector lead from 102 to 180 is directional...and it was the wrong way around! swapped it, and on the night though that had 'fixed it...but a week later it's back to being quiet in the left speaker again...only from the DAC sources

So, I feel like I've ruled out it's the amps, speakers or speaker cables...but I've also ruled out it being the DAC or Chromecast in at least one test above....and does swapping red and black RCAs out of the DAC and still having a quiet left channel mean both red and black RCA connectors are working fine?

HELP! :-)

Posted on: 25 June 2017 by Huge

It sounds as though you may well have an intermittent connection on a cable somewhere, or in one of the sockets of the 102 or the 180.

This could be a solder joint that's failed mechanically or some similar mechanical failure. If so, then the reason it comes back to life could be that moving the cable or one of the boxes mechanically disturbs the connection allowing an electrical connection by temporarily cleaning off the oxide layer. When the oxide layer reforms, the intermittent connection is lost again.

These intermittents are very hard to trace (as you've found out!).

Posted on: 25 June 2017 by yeti42

Except for the minijack comment, (what's that a different source?) it looks like it's one of the amps or the Snaic between them and since it worked for a while when you swapped ends (I've never had a power amp that powers the pre but assume its 4 pin at each end of the Snaic) it might just be corrosion on the pins or sockets. Repeated replugging would help clean these but it could also be a loose wire or (unlikely after this time) a dry solder joint. An intermittant fault seems likely. If a service is a distant memory then sending the amps and Snaic off for one would be a reasonable approach with a comment about the fault.

Posted on: 25 June 2017 by Stephen Tate

Hi,

It might just be worth getting hold of some Isopropyl alcohol and finding a way of cleaning the inside of the Din socket on the 180 and the one being used on the 102 that is connected to the DAC.

Not saying this will cure it but it could just be dirty or worn din sockets?

As others have mentioned here, tracing an intermittent connection like this can be a REAL head scratcher and trying to trace it without disturbing the other parts in the chain also presents its own set of challenges.

Hope you get this sorted real soon, I have had a similar experience in a past system myself, good job your system is not active!

Posted on: 25 June 2017 by Hoolio

yeti42 posted:
Except for the minijack comment, (what's that a different source?) it looks like it's one of the amps or the Snaic between them and since it worked for a while when you swapped ends (I've never had a power amp that powers the pre but assume its 4 pin at each end of the Snaic) it might just be corrosion on the pins or sockets. ....

Good info, thanks - I'll try cleaning the DIN sockets and wiggling the SNAIC (ahem) to see if that has any impact. Yes it is the power amp that powers the pre amp, no power input inot the pre other than the SNAIC connector.

Posted on: 25 June 2017 by Hoolio

Stephen Tate posted:
Hi,
It might just be worth getting hold of some Isopropyl alcohol and finding a way of cleaning the inside of the Din socket on the 180 and the one being used on the 102 that is connected to the DAC.
... I have had a similar experience in a past system myself, good job your system is not active!

Hi Stephen

The system is in use currently as plugging my phone or iPod directly in via the mini-jack to DIN cable works fine through both channels...sound quality isn't as good out of these devices, but less upsetting to listen to than the single-channel problem!

My assumption is that if my phone plugged in directly works, then the SNAIC should be OK, right? Why would it not work with a different source plugged in, and work again perfectly with the phone plugged in?

I'm not sure how using that direct cable as the source can work and the DAC into the same inputs doesn't...that's the biggest head scratcher for me - but I don't understand how DINs work so a cheap option to try out.

will grab some isopropyl alcohol on the way home, and maybe some beer alcohol for me while I'm at it :-)

Posted on: 25 June 2017 by yeti42

Which RCA to DIN cable do you use? Can you open up the DIN plug on the interconnect you use for the DAC or just check it with a meter, both hot pins should be on the same side on the right when looking at the ends of the pins, the return is the middle pin. The manual shows how the socket is wired. A cable off E bay is not of the highest provenance.

Posted on: 26 June 2017 by Hoolio

Hallelujah! the isopropyl alcohol cleaning of both ends of the SNAIC and the DIN end of the new cheap DAC connector cable has worked!

I hear you YETI42 - think I'll get a decent RCA to DIN cable from Flashback - I really dislike how cheap my current one looks.

Thanks everyone for your help - much appreciated!

Posted on: 26 June 2017 by Huge

In view of your point 7, I'd wait a couple of week before holding a celebration party!

Posted on: 26 June 2017 by yeti42

A genuine Naim Lavender RCA to DIN will set you back just over a ton from jour friendly local dealer, though he may not know it until he rings them up. I think It's the same cable as Chord used to use for their Chrystalis which is no more alas.

Posted on: 27 June 2017 by Hoolio

yeah I know...am going to invest in a decent cable, but the direct impact has me relieved it isn't the amps or DAC - will order one and hopefully it arrives before it stops working again :-)